Hybrids as City Runabouts, Natural Gas Fueled Cars for the Country

Science Daily ^ | Sep 19, 2010 | SD

[Cronos]

Hybrid cars and those fuelled by natural gas produce significantly less carbon dioxide (CO2) than equivalent vehicles running on gasoline. In the course of a study undertaken on behalf of the Swiss Federal Office for the Environment (FOEN), the results of which were recently published, Empa has investigated the CO2 emission behavior of current hybrid cars. A comparison with gasoline and natural gas fuelled vehicles concludes that hybrid vehicles are the cleanest during inner-city driving whilst natural gas fuelled cars do best on the motorway. When driven in rural areas, both types do equally well. Under mixed conditions (that is real, everyday driving) vehicles based on both concepts offer reductions of up to 25 per cent in CO2 emissions compared to conventional gasoline fuelled automobiles. Hybrid drive systems and natural gas engines therefore represent an important technical measure for reducing CO2 emissions which can be put to use immediately, as do vehicles powered by renewable fuels such as biogas and ethanol derived from waste matter.

[discostu]

Except nobody rides them, so every penny spent on them is wasted. Lightrail is a boondoggle.

[discostu]

There’s nothing conservative about stealing 4 billion dollars from the people to build 11 miles worth of track in DC that won’t be ridden.

[Cronos]

I agree -- mass transit makes a lot of sense in dense cities -- look at the efficient mass transit in Europe. In rural US, SUVs matter, but in the cities, they don't. however, the idea of smaller towns is not sensible -- large cities are beehives of activities, meeting people, new people, culture, etc. and that's the way it has been for thousands of years: and that's a reason for that. Smaller towns are not necessarily more manageable as someone has to manage what happens when you cross the boundaries between the towns. And also, the urban sprawl tends to destroy nice green places where one can walk and relax and also over-runs farms etc. Cities are a center of trade as they have always been, rural areas are also very important -- the suburban or small towns are the ones stuck in-between neither here nor there.

Also, using SUVs MAKEs sense (as the article says) -- for folks that use that, so why not push them to be more efficient? If you can get more power, better mileage and yet cleaner burn at the back, why not?

Vaquero --> you're out of line accusing Willie Green of being a Dem --> and it's not a cattle car: have you ever travelled by public transport in NY or W. Europe?

[Cronos]

Yes, from what I have heard, the US has the largest amounts of NG reserves. Why not switch to that and starve Saudi Arabia and Iran (whom we do not import from, by the way, but Saudia is the one supporting the terrorists), we’d be much better off. Why would you, Vaq, not want to starve the SAuds?

[Cronos]

“when i step on the gas, i expect things to happen NOW, not later “ —> and that’s what good hybrid technology CAN do —> set it on electric when you are in stop-start traffic or idling and then give you the push when you need it. Think of this —> you drive your F150 and you’re in a long tailback. During this while, why not have the car automatically switch to electric to keep it rolling, yet not use up gas? And then when you get out of the jam and go uphill, your car switches to gas and gives you the bhp you need.

[Cronos]

“you have already stated you prefer that the crud from the cities be spread like manure into the last remaining unspoiled places to make people more manageable....what point did I miss????? Sounds vaguely familiar with something Hitler, Stalin, or Mao would say “ —> completely inaccurate. That is not what the article or Meyer or even Hit/Stal/Mao said. being rude and insulting people instead of debating a point is something a Democrat does — are you looking for DU by any chance?

[Cronos]

we have lots of oil. YES -- and we SHOULD drill in ANWAR, but oil is needed for lots of other stuff -- from plastics to boots. And we should not use up all our oil and then be completely dependent on Moslimes to get the oil we need for petrochemical products.

Use OUR oil, but use it wisely so that no American, no or in future generations has to depend on the Moslem slime.

[tnlibertarian]

"The only thing certain in life is death and taxes."

I happen to believe that the latter is the lesser of two evils.
If you disagree, you are free to choose the former.

That has to be the singular most mind-numbingly idiotic dumb-ass comment I have seen in my 8 years of signed up plus 1 year of lurking time in this forum. Essentially, if you don't believe in high taxes, then you choose death? You did notice it says 'and', not 'or'. Maybe, if we build enough choo-choos with taxes, we can achieve immortality! Holy crap! Is that your reason for your obsession? I always thought you approached this topic with religious fervor. Public rail is the fountain of youth! Choose Amtrak and live forever!

[Willie Green]

That reply wasn’t addressed to you, so stuff a sock in it.

[tnlibertarian]

That reply wasn’t addressed to you, so stuff a sock in it.

Um, there is a button for private reply if you don't want unsolicited comments. Wait, wait. Let me try one. Tell me if this is how you do it:

They say, "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."
Well, I'm no fan of a scorned woman, but I'll take that over the alternative.
If you want to choose hell, go right ahead.

Did I get that right?

How about this?

I've heard "A fool and his money are soon parted."
I'll take the money, you can keep right on being the fool

[Chode]

for the added cost to the vehicle and the added complexity of more things to go wrong/brake/maintain, not to mention with 15below zero mornings, i'll pay for the gas...

simple is better for me, and as far as things happening now, i don't even like fuel injection but i'm stuck with it

[Vaquero]

“you have already stated you prefer that the crud from the cities be spread like manure into the last remaining unspoiled places to make people more manageable....

In never said that....why did you post that as a quote?? at best that is a really bad interpretation of what you though I said ...that is the kind of disinformation they use at DU.

[Vaquero]

Yes, from what I have heard, the US has the largest amounts of NG reserves. Why not switch to that and starve Saudi Arabia and Iran (whom we do not import from, by the way, but Saudia is the one supporting the terrorists), we’d be much better off. Why would you, Vaq, not want to starve the SAuds

Starve the Arabs...drill for OIL, drill of natural gas, open up another 100 nuclear power plants...why limit yourself to natural gas....we have more coal than most countries....burn more coal.

[Cronos]

The Internal combustion engine isn’t simple, the drive-shaft isn’t simple. These are all complex mechanisms (and I’m a mechanical engineer).

[Chode]

never said it was... i simply said i prefer it without any superfluousness add-ons.

i much preferred carburetors over fuel-injection, as the only way to get revs is to down shift since simply stepping on the throttle is still limited by how fast the injectors pump and therefore forces you to down shift for revs

and since for the first time in my life, i am driving am automatic... and even shifting the car into sport mode and trying to force a downshift i am still over ridden the rheostat driven throttle as to if i will or i won't get the revs i'm asking for, that and the shift program in the transmission computer, as opposed to simply opening the secondaries on a 4-barrel

that aside, when the cam does come alive... i really do love my inertial spring driven variable valve timing!!!

[Cronos]

true, I dislike automatics too. The new hybrids don't give a lag in response. Yes, it's more complicated than a 60s engine, but if you pop the hood of your 90s, or 00s car, you'll see a lot of complexity that a neighbourhood mechanic couldn't figure out easily without experience. I'm just saying that I'd rather we conserve gas so that:
1. The US stops all imports of gas from the ME (indeed from everyone except North Americans)
2. The US keeps it's gas for itself and uses it wisely (since petrol is used in a host of other products) so that it is available for a whole host of future generations

The net result is that the two economies that would be most dependent on oil would be China and India and at least China is not going to play nice if the Arabs hike the prices every now and then