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Man killed by his own concealed weapon
timesdispatch.com ^ | 18 Nov 2011 | Mark Bowes

Posted on 11/20/2011 8:51:58 PM PST by smokingfrog

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1 posted on 11/20/2011 8:52:00 PM PST by smokingfrog
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To: smokingfrog

Those damn Glocks cry out for those professional enough to carry them!

That leaves me out..


2 posted on 11/20/2011 8:56:58 PM PST by One Name
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To: smokingfrog

What’s your point?


3 posted on 11/20/2011 8:57:37 PM PST by ButThreeLeftsDo (Help End FREEPATHONS.)
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To: smokingfrog
"...he inadvertently grabbed the trigger."

He pulled on the trigger enough to disengage the trigger safety?

4 posted on 11/20/2011 8:57:39 PM PST by Jagdgewehr (It will take blood.)
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To: One Name

I am still partial to a 1911.


5 posted on 11/20/2011 8:58:25 PM PST by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: One Name
Those damn Glocks cry out for those professional enough to carry them! That leaves me out..

Yeah, Glocks have that super-sophisticated danger - pulling the trigger fires the weapon.

That's why, out of tens of millions of Glocks, there's so many accidental firings...

oh, wait a minute...

6 posted on 11/20/2011 9:01:11 PM PST by Talisker (History will show the Illuminati won the ultimate Darwin Award.)
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To: ButThreeLeftsDo
What’s your point?

If you're going to carry a gun, do it the right way. Like the story points out, you shouldn't carry a gun without a holster. Especially a Glock.

How's that?

7 posted on 11/20/2011 9:01:11 PM PST by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
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To: smokingfrog

To carry a pistol with a CHAMBERED round in it, I believe—is contrary to all safety training.

What do those Freepers with a CC permit say?


8 posted on 11/20/2011 9:02:30 PM PST by AnalogReigns (because REALITY is never digital...)
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To: smokingfrog

First firearms safety is your brain. Disengage that and bad things happen.


9 posted on 11/20/2011 9:02:30 PM PST by Molon Labbie (Occupiers- The world is watching....and alternatively laughing and vomiting)
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To: smokingfrog
DOH!
10 posted on 11/20/2011 9:07:10 PM PST by Wally_Kalbacken
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To: MrEdd

Condition One is safer than a Glock, I think.

Plus, most 1911s are carried on the hip rather than in the crotch. I have a Taurus Millenium I carry on occasion where the sun don’t shine (warm weather) but its DA striker with a safety.


11 posted on 11/20/2011 9:07:13 PM PST by One Name
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To: smokingfrog

Holsters are your friends.


12 posted on 11/20/2011 9:07:54 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum ("The very idea of a community organizer is to stir up a mob for some political purpose." Ann Coulter)
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To: AnalogReigns

I never understood the reasoning behind the Glock’s safety - but that’s just me and my limited experience. I bought a Springfield XDM as a first pistol as I liked the safety on the rear of the grip and the way it felt and shot.

Is always in a holster, and always has a round chambered.


13 posted on 11/20/2011 9:07:57 PM PST by 21twelve ("We can go from boom to bust, from dreams to a bowl of dust....and another lost generation.")
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To: AnalogReigns

Perhaps. Right, wrong or indifferent, I have been carrying my Glock 22 with a chambered round for ten years. The difference here is I always carry in the proper holster. Always.


14 posted on 11/20/2011 9:08:14 PM PST by Jagdgewehr (It will take blood.)
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To: Molon Labbie

I find an inside the pants soft holster, secured firmly to a leather belt and the waist of your pants is very secure, yet easy to pull, if the need to do so ever comes.

Get to the range often and practice, practice, practice is what we preach to the ladies we teach in our Second Amendment Sister classes.


15 posted on 11/20/2011 9:09:26 PM PST by basil (It's time to rid the country of "gun free zones" aka "Killing Fields")
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To: AnalogReigns

Walther PP style pistols are designed to be carried with a round in the chamber. And the double action on my P64 is so stiff it’s pretty much impossible to fire it by accident.


16 posted on 11/20/2011 9:09:41 PM PST by Mountain Troll (My investment plan - Canned food and shotguns)
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To: AnalogReigns

Disagree, but it’s a matter of training and practice. If you’re carrying a revolver, no big deal. But, if you’re carrying a semi-auto, can you guarantee you’ll have time to rack the slide?


17 posted on 11/20/2011 9:10:34 PM PST by One Name
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To: AnalogReigns

That is incorrect. My CHL trainer carries a chambered, hammer cocked, 1911 45. I don’t carry chambered because I have kids.


18 posted on 11/20/2011 9:11:04 PM PST by TheZMan (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2794639/posts)
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To: smokingfrog
Almost certainly a Glock!

He must have hit his femoral artery.

19 posted on 11/20/2011 9:11:04 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: smokingfrog

Dang! I just hate it when that happens!


20 posted on 11/20/2011 9:11:25 PM PST by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: AnalogReigns
Not necessarily - that is technically a Condition One carry, where the firearm is immediately deployable. Condition Two is the magazine in place but no round chambered, Condition Three is unloaded.

The difficulty with Condition One when you're carrying a Glock is that the trigger "safety" is a lever in the middle of the trigger that requires a direct pull in order to release the trigger. If you've put your finger on the trigger as this fellow did, you've released the safety. There is no thumb safety or grip safety as with a 1911; if the trigger is pulled in this condition the gun goes off.

That's why it is so important to practice draw and presentation of the piece with the finger off the trigger. The Glock isn't the only design with this characteristic: all revolvers and many other striker-fired semi-autos are this way. "Don't touch the trigger until you want the gun to go off" is Cooper's rule on it. Most of us memorize that early on in our firearms careers.

21 posted on 11/20/2011 9:11:58 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: smokingfrog

I think I’ll just stick with my wheel-gun and holster.


22 posted on 11/20/2011 9:14:20 PM PST by SaxxonWoods (.....The days are long but the years are short.....)
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To: dayglored

Shouldn’t of concealed it!


23 posted on 11/20/2011 9:14:32 PM PST by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: AnalogReigns

I say Glocks with a round in the chamber are dangerous. There is no external hammer or safety AND its half cocked by design. You pull the trigger it goes off.


24 posted on 11/20/2011 9:14:52 PM PST by omega4179 (We can't wait!............. for the end of an error.....1-20-13)
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To: AnalogReigns
I carry an S&W M-59, always a round in the chamber, hammer down with the double action disengaged.

It takes too long to rack the slide when time is vital and if you're hurt you may not have two functional hands.

25 posted on 11/20/2011 9:15:06 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: Talisker

Plenty carry them. I don’t.

Whatever trips your trigger...


26 posted on 11/20/2011 9:15:41 PM PST by One Name
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To: AnalogReigns

...and incidentally, many Israeli schools recommend a Condition Two carry, and practice the slide racking motion as a part of the draw. It’s a safety compromise, not much of a compromise if you’ve trained and can do it quickly, but even then still a compromise. I’m not that good at it; when I carry my 1911 it’s always Condition One but then I have a thumb and grip safety. Others’ mileage may vary.


27 posted on 11/20/2011 9:15:49 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: AnalogReigns

There is no point in carrying a handgun if it is not functional, as in loaded. Safe carry practices do not include an empty chamber unless you are carrying hammer down on an old style six-shooter that can discharge from a blow to the hammer. In that case it’s a five-shooter with an empty chamber under the hammer.
If you are going to carry, carry properly in a suitable holster.
Further, this only proves the reliability of a Glock. It fires when the trigger is depressed.


28 posted on 11/20/2011 9:16:29 PM PST by Steamburg (The contents of your wallet is the only language Politicians understand.)
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To: Jagdgewehr

Yes, how do they know that’s what he was doing. Perhaps he committed suicide.


29 posted on 11/20/2011 9:16:46 PM PST by Pining_4_TX ( The state is the great fiction by which everybody seeks to live at the expense of everybody else. ~)
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To: MrEdd

Same here. Two Ed Browns and 3 Les Baers. One Crimson trace Kimber job I carry a bit also. A couple of Springers, (The EMP 9 and the .45 shorty), to but I have had probs with ‘em. (One broken FP and one snapped main spring). 1911’s are it as far as this old boy is concerned!


30 posted on 11/20/2011 9:18:22 PM PST by bobby.223
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To: basil

That’s how I carry my 26.


31 posted on 11/20/2011 9:19:23 PM PST by Molon Labbie (Occupiers- The world is watching....and alternatively laughing and vomiting)
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To: AnalogReigns

You might not always have time to rack a round into the chamber. Or, in a high stress situation, you’ll forget.

There’s a video on the intertubes of a jewelry store owner that was being robbed and he forgot to flip the safety on his pistol. He got shot up pretty bad, but survived. The bad guy had a cheap revolver.


32 posted on 11/20/2011 9:20:01 PM PST by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
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To: smokingfrog

i hate it when that happens


33 posted on 11/20/2011 9:24:00 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (bloodwashed not whitewashed)
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To: AnalogReigns

I’ve always carried in condition zero, I believe it is. It won’t matter though because I always have it in a holster. Only thugs carry it naked in their pants. Also, if I have to adjust, I will grab a part of the holster that is attached to the waistband. Not from the trigger area. Negligent Discharge. End of Story.


34 posted on 11/20/2011 9:24:25 PM PST by GunPkrBkr (I'd rather be judged by twelve, than carried by six.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

Correct! No time to rack, should be able to fire with either functional hand- which supports a mid-back, leg or chest holster, and an either-hand safety.

Or, there’s the wheel gun back-up.


35 posted on 11/20/2011 9:27:26 PM PST by One Name
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To: One Name
"Those damn Glocks cry out for those professional enough to carry them!"

I'm not a professional by a long shot, but there's no way I would carry a Glock with a chambered round in my waistband. That, in my opinion, is a Darwin award tryout.

36 posted on 11/20/2011 9:29:54 PM PST by matthew fuller (I stand with Leroy!)
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To: omega4179

Only as dangerous as the persons safety with a firearm. My Sig 226 has no safety. It has a de-cocker and is DA & SA. After first shot though the trigger pull is far less. If he had it in a holster it wouldn’t have went off.


37 posted on 11/20/2011 9:30:39 PM PST by GunPkrBkr (I'd rather be judged by twelve, than carried by six.)
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To: matthew fuller

That’s my point- I’ve only ever shot a few of them, never felt a need to buy one. Plenty of LEO’s carry them, safely holstered.

For a deep conceal, condition one or equivalent, a trigger-safety Glock would not be my choice.


38 posted on 11/20/2011 9:35:49 PM PST by One Name
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To: omega4179

I won’t say who, but I know a guy...who keeps a Glock at home near his nightstand. He won’t cock it because, in the off chance a kid came into the house (which they don’t...but its possible) he doesn’t want that kid to find the gun and shoot somebody. I figure if I heard, er, I mean my friend heard.... someone break-in to my (er his) house...he’d have time to cock the thing anyway.

I can see thought, in a PROPERLY HOLSTERED GUN, WITH PROPER TRAINING, on your person....a chambered round is preferable.

Apparently this guy didn’t have his gun holstered...


39 posted on 11/20/2011 9:37:09 PM PST by AnalogReigns (because REALITY is never digital...)
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To: smokingfrog

My Ruger SR9 has a trigger safety pretty identical to the Glock. It has an additional thumb safety as well which I believe makes it an almost perfect weapon for CCW. Ruger even makes a compact version for smaller framed folks. One other thing about the full-size SR9, a standard magazine holds 17 rounds.


40 posted on 11/20/2011 9:38:31 PM PST by gop4lyf (Socialism is the political dream of the unachiever, the excuse maker, and the lazy.)
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To: Molon Labbie

I like that. Well said, Sir.


41 posted on 11/20/2011 9:41:46 PM PST by Altariel (`)
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To: One Name

We agree to agree.


42 posted on 11/20/2011 9:42:05 PM PST by matthew fuller (I stand with Leroy!)
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To: AnalogReigns

Holsters save lives.

Keep the finger off the bang switch and Glocks are 100% safe.

I have carried one for years, 12+1, never an issue.

IMO, without one in the chamber, the gun is a club.

(22 year retired USAF Security Police and a former deputy)


43 posted on 11/20/2011 9:44:34 PM PST by JimBianchi11 (The 2A is the cornerstone of our free society. Those that don't support it, oppose it.)
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To: smokingfrog

Unfortunately, it’s a tad too late for the dude to hear the helpful selfless advice expressed herein. Pity.

(Can he read it from the Great Beyond?)


44 posted on 11/20/2011 9:44:40 PM PST by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: One Name
All I have to do on the M-59 is flip a lever and I've got DA. The DA pull is long enough to be almost accident proof but smooth enough for good first shot accuracy.

The Glock was fundamentally designed to be used by people who aren't shooters. I'm afraid this covers a lot of cops. I know a couple of retired NYPD guys here who know nothing about guns beyond how to pull the trigger. They don't think like shooters and it's scary to be around them.

45 posted on 11/20/2011 9:47:18 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: matthew fuller

Thunderwear may be the culprit in this instance, why carry with the gun near the crown jewels. Carry strong side in a holster either IWB or OWB. Dress around the gun and IT can be concealed without this Thunderwear stuff.


46 posted on 11/20/2011 9:48:38 PM PST by ccwman
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To: smokingfrog

Praying for this poor man and for his family.

The only constant in tragedies like this one is the victim’s mistaken belief that their own abilities and wisdom make them immune from mistakes like these. The only truly effective safety measure is humility, a virtue which is ominously absent from many posts on this thread.


47 posted on 11/20/2011 9:49:25 PM PST by Ronaldus Magnus
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To: Billthedrill
When you get older and arthritis hits your hands you may not be doing any speed racking of slides.
48 posted on 11/20/2011 9:50:13 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: smokingfrog

One more data point in the negative column for Glock.


49 posted on 11/20/2011 9:52:06 PM PST by 2nd Bn, 11th Mar (The "p" in Democrat stands for patriotism.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER
I am and I can't. :-)

Some of the Krav Maga guys are pretty slick at it so I thought I'd give it a try. It just didn't work out. And you need two hands to do it. I want my off hand to fight but I don't like needing it.

50 posted on 11/20/2011 9:53:38 PM PST by Billthedrill
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