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Pell Grants plug pulled for thousands of students
Santa Cruz Sentinel ^ | 05/20/2012 | Matt Krupnick

Posted on 05/20/2012 7:47:29 PM PDT by artichokegrower

A mother of four who was laid off in 2008, Danielle Torno had planned on turning her life around next year with the help of a Cal State East Bay business degree.

Instead, the 36-year-old San Jose resident will be searching for another solution because of a little-noticed congressional decision to reduce or eliminate Pell Grants for hundreds of thousands of the poorest college students.

The changes take effect July 1, and students like Torno will bear the brunt of the reforms, which are expected to save $11 billion over 10 years.

Among those who will lose Pell Grants in the summer are at least 65,000 new college students without high school diplomas and 63,000 who, like Torno, have spent more than six years in college. Changes in income requirements will reduce or eliminate grants for nearly 300,000 others.

(Excerpt) Read more at santacruzsentinel.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: educationfunding; pellgrants
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Your are in college without graduating from high school. On top of that you want a government funded scholarship. Makes sense to me.
1 posted on 05/20/2012 7:47:33 PM PDT by artichokegrower
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; ColdOne; Convert from ECUSA; ...

Thanks artichokegrower.
Among those who will lose Pell Grants in the summer are at least 65,000 new college students without high school diplomas and 63,000 who, like Torno, have spent more than six years in college.

2 posted on 05/20/2012 7:51:23 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (FReepathon 2Q time -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: artichokegrower
How do you get into college without a high school diploma??
3 posted on 05/20/2012 7:55:25 PM PDT by funfan
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To: SunkenCiv

“For many students who never finished high school, the loss of Pell Grants could put college out of reach”

Do you think? And the taxpayers are going to save how much?


4 posted on 05/20/2012 7:56:23 PM PDT by artichokegrower
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To: artichokegrower

I knew of so many students who took their Pell Grants and paid for furniture, cars or other luxuries once they got that money while I worked two jobs to pay for my college and drove an old car with hand me down furniture.

Stop the fricking gravy train. I have absolutely no sympathy.


5 posted on 05/20/2012 7:56:40 PM PDT by Cowgirl of Justice
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To: artichokegrower

Guess she’ll just have to work her way through college like I did.


6 posted on 05/20/2012 7:57:04 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: artichokegrower

Uhm ,you mean the free ride is over and now it’s time to pay the piper?

Damn them rich folks for not doing their fair share.

How unpatriotic of them.


7 posted on 05/20/2012 7:58:01 PM PDT by South Dakota (shut up and drill)
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” who, like Torno, have spent more than six years in college.”

Six years? I went to college in 2 different states took a half a year off, worked part time, and did my best to wreck my liver in the process, and I completed Mechanical Engineering in 4.5 years, with a 3.7 GPA to boot.

Alright...obscure movie quote...

I’ve been in this high school for seven and a half years...I’m no dummy


8 posted on 05/20/2012 7:58:01 PM PDT by dsrtsage (One half of all people have below average IQ. In the US the number is 54%)
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To: artichokegrower

I went to college without graduating from high shcool. I loved reading and learning but hated high school. I took an early GED, did well on the SAT, and started college at 17.


9 posted on 05/20/2012 7:59:38 PM PDT by Hugin ("Most times a man'll tell you his bad intentions, if you listen and let yourself hear."---Open Range)
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To: artichokegrower
please, if you can't make it in SIX years, you never will... feh
10 posted on 05/20/2012 8:03:11 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Hugin

From the article

“Students without diplomas or a GED certificate”

what you did was fine. What these “students” are doing is neither.


11 posted on 05/20/2012 8:04:04 PM PDT by artichokegrower
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To: Hugin

Didn’t post her major. Probably Gender and Ethnic Studies.


12 posted on 05/20/2012 8:05:27 PM PDT by DIRTYSECRET
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To: Hugin
I went to college without graduating from high shcool. I loved reading and learning but hated high school. I took an early GED, did well on the SAT, and started college at 17.

A GED is the equivalent of a H.S. diploma.

Apparently, the students referred to in the article have neither a H.S. diploma nor a GED.

13 posted on 05/20/2012 8:06:35 PM PDT by okie01
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To: Hugin
I went to college without graduating from high shcool. I loved reading and learning but hated high school. I took an early GED, did well on the SAT, and started college at 17.

A GED is the equivalent of a H.S. diploma.

Apparently, the students referred to in the article have neither a H.S. diploma nor a GED.

14 posted on 05/20/2012 8:06:35 PM PDT by okie01
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To: funfan

I did—dropped out of High School,and started college-—BUT I was on probation—if got a C or lower, I would have been out! (I worked my butt off and got As) went on to do post grad work. and got degree. I couldn’t do it now.


15 posted on 05/20/2012 8:09:37 PM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: artichokegrower
“..at least 65,000 new college students without high school diplomas and 63,000 ...”

We have helped several single moms apply for Pell Grants in the 80’s,90’s and they required a HS diploma or GED diploma. When was the requirement removed? Incidentally everyone we helped graduated and is working today - most of them nurses. Pell grants for drop out is a crazy idea!!

16 posted on 05/20/2012 8:11:07 PM PDT by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-hereQaeda" and its allies.)
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To: okie01

Back in my day GEDs were looked down on as less than a HS diploma. Now I would say it’s better, since it shows you at least learned something and wern’t just passed along.


17 posted on 05/20/2012 8:11:23 PM PDT by Hugin ("Most times a man'll tell you his bad intentions, if you listen and let yourself hear."---Open Range)
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To: artichokegrower

Hey, quit talking about taxpayers, they’ve got plenty already, going to college without graduating is an ENTITLEMENT, dammit. ;’)


18 posted on 05/20/2012 8:11:45 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (FReepathon 2Q time -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: artichokegrower

tell the scumbags to get a job and pay their own way through school like most of us did.


19 posted on 05/20/2012 8:11:45 PM PDT by biggredd1
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To: artichokegrower

Clearly, not EVERYONE should be going to college. We’re funding boatloads of sociology and ethnic studies majors who have learned absolutely nothing on our dime.


20 posted on 05/20/2012 8:13:26 PM PDT by bigdaddy45
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To: artichokegrower

If these were tied to merit as well as need I’d say it’s a shame. Doesn’t sound as if merit has anything to do with it though.


21 posted on 05/20/2012 8:13:55 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: artichokegrower
What about homeschoolers?

Generally speaking, though, this is how the left funds its Sandra Flukes.

22 posted on 05/20/2012 8:14:13 PM PDT by hopespringseternal
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To: elpadre

“When was the requirement removed?”

Probably when it was determined that a diploma or a GED requirement was racist.


23 posted on 05/20/2012 8:17:28 PM PDT by dsrtsage (One half of all people have below average IQ. In the US the number is 54%)
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To: funfan

Look, if colleges dump kids who can’t graduate from high school AND kids who can’t finish college in 6 years - where will our teachers come from??


24 posted on 05/20/2012 8:19:33 PM PDT by GOPJ ( "A Dog In Every Pot" - freeper ETL)
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To: artichokegrower

“You should be able to get a bachelor’s degree in six years, honestly,” said Torno, who received a letter last month from the U.S. Department of Education alerting her that she would lose the $5,550-a-year scholarships. “But there should be hardship exceptions. People have families.”

Torno also has borrowed the maximum allowable $46,000 in federal loans,
meaning her only remaining aid option could be private loans with higher interest rates. But even that is uncertain.

“My credit’s too bad from not having a job,” said Torno, who has been balancing child care and school by taking online courses. “I’m going to have to stop going to school.”


25 posted on 05/20/2012 8:21:37 PM PDT by kcvl
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To: artichokegrower

26 posted on 05/20/2012 8:23:30 PM PDT by kcvl
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To: GOPJ

We need to cut the Pell grant even more.

Obama pumped it up for the stimulus.

You used to not be able to use Pell Grant during the summer term.

Now I agree nowadays students more often do summer courses because
of overcrowding or other reasons.

But restricting it to fall/spring made it so that you had to be serious
to get a degree at the end.
Pell Grant is “free money” if you don’t get a degree or even drop out of
the course!!

some people and colleges are just Pell Grant mills

Like those illegals claiming child tax care credit to $4B.


27 posted on 05/20/2012 8:24:34 PM PDT by preamble
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To: artichokegrower

She’s already gone to college the equivalent of six full years and still hasn’t earned a degree.

If she wants to go for the rest of her life, fine. Loans are still available; it’s just the freeby grants that are being modestly cut.


28 posted on 05/20/2012 8:32:35 PM PDT by Jedidah ("In those days Israel had no king. Everyone did what was right in his own eyes.")
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To: Chode
please, if you can't make it in SIX years, you never will... feh

It took me twenty years. Spent the first year and a half partying and flunking out. Got married, raised a couple of kids, and then went back. Probation because of the lousy grades those first three semesters and carried extra loads to get back on track. Total time spent at the two universities was about four years and six months. And paid my own way. And got a double major, math and economics. Just tooting my own horn here.

29 posted on 05/20/2012 8:32:35 PM PDT by ProudFossil (" I never did give anyone hell. I just told the truth and they thought it was hell." Harry Truman)
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To: Chode
please, if you can't make it in six years, you never will.

I went to University, flunked out, went to work, returned and graduated with a BS in Geology in 3-1/2 total years in school. In 1983 the oilfield went to hell and I returned to school and obtained a BS in Pharmacy in only 2-1/2 years of university. I managed to do this because of CLEP tests. I checked the books out of the Library and studied them and then would take the CLEP tests for credit. This eliminated 1 year of university studies. I also took extra chemistry courses as electives when studying geology. This also eliminated a year of pharmacy school.

My total government subsidies i.e. Pell grants, scholarships etc. came to the grand total of zero. I did owe the bank 8600 dollars and paid them. I worked when I was in university even though I was carrying full loads 18 plus hours of pharmacy courses. The last semester before clinical rotations I took 21 hours of pharmacy courses and still worked.

Relative to those poor darlings that are bemoaning their terrible fate of not getting their Pell Grants I would suggest they take a look at the Websters Unabridged Dictionary. In it they will find that the word sympathy is located somewhere between the words sh-- and syphllis.

If you can not hack it in school, get a job that your skill levels deem you are adequate to perform.

30 posted on 05/20/2012 8:38:10 PM PDT by cpdiii (Deckhand, Roughneck, Mud Man, Geologist, Pilot, Pharmacist. THE CONSTITUTION IS WORTH DYING FOR!)
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To: Jedidah

If she has 6 yrs of college she should be able to find work and finish whatever she is taking on her own. She got a hand UP from the taxpayers..the rest is up to her.


31 posted on 05/20/2012 8:39:12 PM PDT by katiedidit1 ("This is one race of people for whom psychoanalysis is of no use whatsoever." the Irish)
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To: Cowgirl of Justice

“knew of so many students who took their Pell Grants and paid for furniture, cars or other luxuries once they got that money”

Hell, I know people doing that NOW....

It’s like they KNOW they’ll never have to repay it, and it’s just ‘Fun Money’ from Uncle Sugar


32 posted on 05/20/2012 8:47:09 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Election 2012: THE RAPTURE OF THE DEMOCRATS)
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To: Chode

It was 26 years from the time I took my first college class until the time I was awarded my bachelor’s degree. I did spend 24 of those years in the military, and I got married and we have 6 kids, so college wasn’t the only thing I was doing.

There were times during the process that I might have agreed with you.


33 posted on 05/20/2012 8:57:46 PM PDT by Gil4 (Sometimes it's not low self-esteem - it's just accurate self-assessment.)
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To: ProudFossil
Probation because of the lousy grades those first three semesters

When I went back to school after flunking out it was in a summer session. At the end of the summer I received two letters from the Dean of Pure and Applied Science.

Letter number one congratulated me on being on the deans lists.

Letter number two reminded me that I was still on probation from 5 years prior due to the fact that summer school was not a factor in removing academic probation. That one gave me a good laugh. I was serious about school then.

34 posted on 05/20/2012 8:57:59 PM PDT by cpdiii (Deckhand, Roughneck, Mud Man, Geologist, Pilot, Pharmacist. THE CONSTITUTION IS WORTH DYING FOR!)
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To: artichokegrower

This woman was laid off in 2008. That’s almost 4 years ago. So, as a mother of four, she obviously has been getting welfare, medical assistance, and food stamps, along with the Pell Grant and whatever unemployment checks she received that were given to her, for however long. Thus, a lot of government/taxpayers’ money has already helped her along. She is studying for a degree in business...but, after six years of college she is still not able to get a degree? She must not be too bright, so how will she be an asset to any company if she hasn’t even been able to manage her own situation better? If this woman is typical, no wonder we are going broke!


35 posted on 05/20/2012 9:06:37 PM PDT by CitizenM (Obama - The architect of the decline of the U.S.)
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

Congratulations for your hard work!!


36 posted on 05/20/2012 9:09:04 PM PDT by funfan
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To: DIRTYSECRET

yeah, it said she was going to graduate with a business degree.


37 posted on 05/20/2012 9:11:17 PM PDT by EDINVA
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To: cpdiii

I never graduated from high school or had a GED and still went to college. I spent 4 years in the Marine Corps and was required to test in.

I did not graduate because I had the wrong class credits. I also had terrible grades because I worked nearly forty hours a week in high school. Had to help pay the bills at home as my step dad was 70% paralyzed and a diabetic.

It also didn’t help that I thought most of my teachers were idiots. Even then I was a staunch republican. I loved Reagan’s policies and my teachers didn’t.


38 posted on 05/20/2012 9:12:52 PM PDT by jimpick
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To: funfan

I am trying to get into Grad School right now, and I found other applicants that do not have Bachelor’s. I also found that those who were born in this country are about 25% of the applicants ... the rest are foreign born. This is at a top 10 school.


39 posted on 05/20/2012 9:17:01 PM PDT by RainMan (Newt/Sarah - Red Meat for a Red America)
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To: funfan

GED - its not a HS diploma


40 posted on 05/20/2012 9:53:26 PM PDT by bill1952 (Choice is an illusion created between those with power - and those without)
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To: Cowgirl of Justice

I’m sympathetic. I truly am, but here’s the truth: demand for government handouts will always, always outstrip the supply of taxpayer money. Free contraceptives, food stamps, Pell grants, free cell phones, etc. The list is endless. If it’s not permissible to cut any program that hurts someone somewhere, no program will ever be cut.

Once government starts down this path of trying to help people by redistributing wealth, there is no end to it. That doesn’t mean I don’t think people should be helped. All wealth redistributionist programs are inherently immoral in that they take from one citizen to give to another. Private charity is the only moral alternative, and it’s much more efficient, too.


41 posted on 05/20/2012 10:00:05 PM PDT by CitizenUSA (Why celebrate evil? Evil is easy. Good is the goal worth striving for.)
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To: cpdiii
I didn't get on academic probation, but spend my whole career on social probation. I was out of town with the team, when they put my frat on social and they never took me off. I only found out near graduation.
42 posted on 05/20/2012 10:03:28 PM PDT by razorback-bert (I'm in shape. Round is a shape isn't it?)
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To: Chode

I guess you’ve never heard of people studying part-time?


43 posted on 05/20/2012 10:05:50 PM PDT by Boogieman
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To: CitizenM
Hail, CitizenM!

The woman in question is typical. Government charity, aka mandatory wealth redistribution programs, encourage irresponsible behavior. Government itself is complicit in aggravating the very problems it claims it wants to solve. Also, let's not forget the woman's own role in this. How does one get to be a single mother of four? Where's the father(s)? Is she a widow? Unlikely. She probably has a very long history of irresponsibility, and government has been there every step of the way to protect her from herself. Is it any wonder that the numbers like her keep growing?

44 posted on 05/20/2012 10:19:34 PM PDT by CitizenUSA (Why celebrate evil? Evil is easy. Good is the goal worth striving for.)
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To: dsrtsage

Better Off Dead? (the movie)


45 posted on 05/20/2012 10:23:43 PM PDT by MacMattico
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To: Boogieman
The article says 6 full time years and P/T since 2000.

I'm surprised you can get Pell grants for six years (the new rule) and before 9 years (the old rule). In NY we have TAP grants and the little money they gave me in the 90’s stopped after 8 semesters, or the equivalent of 4 years, so I graduated in 4 years!

46 posted on 05/20/2012 10:32:12 PM PDT by MacMattico
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To: kcvl

The caption to that picture is “Danielle Torno outside of Great America Theme Park Park in Santa Clara, Calif”.

I think we now know why she is still in school after 6 years...


47 posted on 05/20/2012 10:42:05 PM PDT by Mr Rogers (A conservative can't please a liberal unless he jumps in front of a bus or off of a cliff)
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To: funfan

I went to college without a High School diploma. All of my pre-entry test scores were excellent except for math. I had a 7th grade level so I had to a remedial math course, and then 2 others to being me up to where I could take the College Algebra course.

During my time in remedial math, I was given a questionnaire regarding other education, and life experiences and so was given credit for a small amount of other classes I’d taken here and there, as well as certain life experiences. Because all of my entry test scores were so good, all combined I was awarded a GED.

I graduated college with a 3.67 GPA and donated 4 years of volunteer service to the community to say ‘thank-you’ for the opportunity to go to college. All of my college was through Pell Grants AND scholarships with a teeny amount of student loans ..under $1500.00 which I paid plus interest.

I was in my mid 30’s when I enrolled in College...on a whim, and very dissatisfied with my min. wage job. I’d raised a family already, AND had grandchildren.

Although I never did get an outstandingly profitable job, it was still the best thing I could have done for myself, and it set the example for the new up and coming generation being born in my family.

My kids ended up going to college, and now my grandkids are.

The circumstances one is in at 15-18 aren’t necessarily the circumstances you are in by middle age. Nor are you mentally the same. What didn’t work for you as a kid can change drastically when you ‘grow up’ thereby enabling you to succeed.

A high-school diploma proves little to nothing. Lots of people managed to be GIVEN a HSD when they couldn’t read, spell, or even know the difference between To, Too, & Two. I’m not talking about special ed students, either.

I’ve seen many brilliant kids fall through the cracks with poor grades due to whatever attitude an educator wanted to dump on them. Add in discouragement and you have a drop out. Let that kid grow up a bit, and the realization of the importance of training comes into perspective.

It’s sad to see this benefit cut/reduced when corporate welfare is right up there. These business are run by educated CEO’s who can’t manage money or innovation????? So much for high-school diplomas!

You can go a summer semseter on a Pell if you don’t use up your entire pell during the spring semester. Some schools will allow you to apply it toward that summer semester. That’s what I did.

I don’t know how people buy cars or furniture on school money. I was very low income and never did get more than
$300 handed to me after books,tuition, fees were paid.

That 300 paid for my lunches, and other things like notebooks, paper and pens or whatever extra supplies I needed for classes. I had no car and sure could have used one!


48 posted on 05/20/2012 11:06:16 PM PDT by PrairieLady2
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To: kcvl

Who’s that guy? </ sarcasm >


49 posted on 05/20/2012 11:07:56 PM PDT by lewislynn ( What does the global warming movement and the Fairtax movement have in commom? Misinformation)
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To: artichokegrower

Santa Cruz Sentinel reporter Matt Krurpnick comes to defence of government waste in Santa Cruz TX college system... S.C..Sentinel Nominated for Pulitzer


50 posted on 05/21/2012 12:34:53 AM PDT by mosesdapoet (The best way to punish a - country is let professors run it. Fredrick the Great p/p)
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