UK: Sikh soldier becomes first guardsman to parade outside Buckingham palace in a turban

IBN live ^ | 12 12 12 | AP

[Cronos]

London: Britain's Ministry of Defence says a Sikh soldier has become the first guardsman to parade outside Buckingham Palace while wearing his traditional turban. Fifty family members were on hand on Tuesday as Guardsman Jatinderpal Singh Bhullar as he took part in the changing of the guard at the London home of Queen Elizabeth II.

[kabar]

Sikhs have served in the United States military at least as far back as the early 20th century, when one Bhagat Singh Thind, who though not a citizen joined the United States Army and served in World War I. Thind requested citizenship at the end of the war, being granted and revoked twice, before finally being naturalized in 1936. Far larger numbers of Sikhs served in World War II, and all American wars following.

The ability of observant Sikhs to serve in the American military has, since 1985, been compromised by a discontinuation of exemptions to uniform standards which previously allowed Sikhs to maintain their religiously-mandated beards and turbans while in uniform. Currently, a Sikh doctor, Kamaljeet S. Kalsi, and dentist, Tejdeep Singh Rattan, are the only Sikh officers to be permitted to serve in uniform with beard and turban. In addition, Simranpreet Lamba was permitted to enlist, with exemption to wear his turban and beard, in 2010 due to his knowledge of Punjabi and Hindi.

[RummyChick]

So does the Army allow these bearded Shikhs out in the battlefield where they can get gassed to death because the gas mask won’t fit properly due to their religious beard?

[kabar]

We used to allow them to serve in the US military with their beards and turbans until 1985.

[DUMBGRUNT]

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2004-01-18/news/0401180497_1_manjit-singh-sikh-uniform-indian-army

Sikhs remember soldier who died for adopted home
U.S. Army Sgt. Uday Singh, 21, an Indian immigrant, was killed last month in Iraq
January 18, 2004|

One of the first KIA in Iraq.

Lake Forest Illinois was his home of record a very nice neighborhood. ‘Upper bracket’.

[hummingbird]

Just kidding!

[Grubwart]

Google is your friend. He HAD to be able to fit his gas mask. There are also pictures out there of him fitting his gas mask. So to answer your question......yes

[RummyChick]

I don’t doubt that there are brave men and women who are highly qualified and would be a valuable asset to our military - that can’t join because of religious beliefs.

But I have a problem with carving out exemptions for a few.

You give a brave warrior Shikh an exemption - and along comes Muslim Terrorist Nidal Hasan wanting the same exemption.

So just why did the Judge get yanked off Nidal’s case . Something that RARELY happens in the Military Court System.

I assume the beard controversy isn’t over. If the new Judge allows him to keep the beard - or shave it off - either way it will cause a problem.

[Grubwart]

Tell you what, I will save you the time.

“During training, Rattan wore a helmet over the small turban, which he doesn’t remove, and was able to successfully create a seal with his gas mask despite the beard, resolving the Army’s safety concerns, said Harsimran Kaur, the Sikh Coalition’s legal director.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/23/sikh-army-captain-graduat_n_509294.html

[ansel12]

Most everybody would agree with you, but as I pointed out, there is some kind of cult like thing in regards to Sikhs, who knows why.

[Flag_This]

"So does the Army allow these bearded Shikhs out in the battlefield where they can get gassed to death because the gas mask won’t fit properly due to their religious beard?"

This was something that always puzzled me: we were told we could not have a beard in the U.S. Army for the reason you just cited, but I know several NATO countries allowed their soldiers to grow beards.

[RummyChick]

So the ENTIRE time you are in the field you have to keep your full beard vaselined up because you only have about a 9 second window to put one the gas mask , clear, and seal, when you are gassed.

[kabar]

The point is that there was no need to carve out exemptions prior to 1985. They were allowed to serve with their beards and turbans. I have no idea why the change was made in 1985.

The US military does have policies on facial hair. All branches of the U.S. Military currently prohibit beards, although some mustaches are still allowed.

In 2010, the U.S. Army granted waivers for a number of Sikh soldiers and one Muslim soldier, permitting them to have beards (and in the case of the Sikh soldiers, to have "unshorn" hair covered by turbans).] In 2010, a rabbi filed suit against the Army for permission to be commissioned as a Jewish chaplain without shaving his beard, noting (among other issues) that another Jewish Chaplain, Colonel Jacob Goldstein, has been serving (first in the New York State National Guard and later in the United States Army Reserve) since 1977 with a beard.

On November 10, 1970, Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) Elmo Zumwalt explicitly authorized beards for active duty Naval personnel, in his Z-gram number 57, "Elimination of Demeaning or Abrasive Regulation," although his position was that they were already implicitly allowed based on policy changes made by his predecessor, Thomas H. Moorer.

The Navy ban on beards on Naval installations and operational vessels, including its submarine fleet, was reinstated in 1984 by CNO James D. Watkins.

I served in the USN at the time that both beards and mustaches were permitted. They just had to be neat and well-trimmed.

[RummyChick]

“The point is that there was no need to carve out exemptions prior to 1985. They were allowed to serve with their beards and turbans. I have no idea why the change was made in 1985. “

Was EVERYONE allowed to have facial hair like the Shikhs? If not, they were exempted.

[RummyChick]

So maybe someone here that was in the military can tell me how you would go about putting on a gas mask, sealing it , and clearing it in the 9 second window with this big of a beard?


Or are they cut some slack because they aren't going out in the battlefield.

[kabar]

Robert E. Lee

ulysses s grant

john j pershing

Col. Lewis Millett--World War II, Korean War, and Vietnam War

Lewis Millett is best known for leading the last bayonet charge in American military combat. Judging by the mustache, are you really that surprised? His Medal of Honor citation tells the tale of the Battle of Bayonet Hill during the Korean War.

"Capt. Millett ordered the 3d Platoon forward, placed himself at the head of the 2 platoons, and, with fixed bayonet, led the assault up the fire-swept hill. In the fierce charge Capt. Millett bayoneted 2 enemy soldiers and boldly continued on, throwing grenades, clubbing and bayoneting the enemy, while urging his men forward by shouting encouragement. Despite vicious opposing fire, the whirlwind hand-to-hand assault carried to the crest of the hill. His dauntless leadership and personal courage so inspired his men that they stormed into the hostile position and used their bayonets with such lethal effect that the enemy fled in wild disorder.

LT. Col. Matt "The Ghost" Urban Conflict: World War II

Another MOH winner: Destroying attacking enemy tanks with a bazooka. You know what's even more badass? Voluntarily leaving the hospital after being wounded, hitchhiking across France to meet up with his company. You know what makes Urban one of the most badass war heroes in United States history? That he continued to lead a charge after sustaining a seemingly mortal bullet to the neck. In fact, he survived. President Jimmy Carter called Urban one of the "greatest soldiers in American history" when presenting him with the Medal of Honor."

Army Ranger Sergeant Shughart and Gary Gordon never came home from their heroic mission to save the crew of two downed Black Hawk helicopters in Mogadishu, Somalia, during the summer of 1993. The Delta Force sniper teammates became the first Medal of Honor recipient since the Vietnam War.

[kabar]

There were rules on the length of beards and the requirement that they be trimmed and neat. Sikhs could retain their beards under those strictures.

[Former Fetus]

Does anybody remember what happened with the American Orthodox Jew who asked for an exemption to the clean-shaven rule? Last I heard, he had been denied. He must not have been a “good guy”.

[Grubwart]

Apparently it was done with the case of Captain Rattan. With regards to the “Vaseline”, I cannot answer that as the HuffPo article makes no mention of the Vaseline or any other substance being used on the beard.

Only the army.mil article makes mention of Vaseline and that was with regards to the Captains Uncle who served in the Indian army.

[Former Fetus]

Oops! It was not the US military but the NYPD. Read Here . I got confused because someone mentioned the IDF did not allow beards.

I know, I know... the IDF is not the US military or the Queen Guard! My point was that religion did not get an exception to the American Jew.

[FreedomPoster]

I’m with you. We should have raised a Sikh regiment in the wake of 9/11, similar to the Gurkhas. I’ve been saying that for about a decade.