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Newtown Officers Traumatized By Sandy Hook Shooting Could Get Leaves of Absence
The Hartford Courant ^ | January 10, 2013 | DAVE ALTIMARI

Posted on 01/13/2013 4:41:24 PM PST by Uncle Chip

Edited on 01/13/2013 4:42:49 PM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]

Newtown police officers struggling emotionally after the Sandy Hook Elementary School shootings may be given up to six months of leave with at least partial pay under an agreement being discussed between the town and union.

The officers could receive at least two-thirds, and possibly 100 percent, of their regular pay as part of the deal, which was being negotiated Wednesday. The negotiators hoped to complete the final details over the next two weeks.


(Excerpt) Read more at articles.courant.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; US: Connecticut
KEYWORDS: leo; newtown; psychology; sandyhook
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1 posted on 01/13/2013 4:41:30 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

I’m sure it wasn’t easy to look at the scene.


2 posted on 01/13/2013 4:47:12 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Uncle Chip

Sorry, this is part of their job. They have a duty to serve their city. If these guys are that weak, they need to get a job flipping burgers.

I am sure it was a horrible scene, but officers all over the country have witnessed horrible scenes in the course of their careers.


3 posted on 01/13/2013 4:53:58 PM PST by dforest
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To: Uncle Chip

Sorry, this is part of their job. They have a duty to serve their city. If these guys are that weak, they need to get a job flipping burgers.

I am sure it was a horrible scene, but officers all over the country have witnessed horrible scenes in the course of their careers.


4 posted on 01/13/2013 4:55:16 PM PST by dforest
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To: driftdiver

It must have been really horrific and difficult to process that crime scene. I can understand payed leave with psych evaluations for those that were there.


5 posted on 01/13/2013 4:55:31 PM PST by Red_Devil 232 (VietVet - USMC All Ready On The Right? All Ready On The Left? All Ready On The Firing Line!)
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To: driftdiver

I am sorry, but they are professionals right? They get paid for 90% of the time just sitting around. Our war vets have seen a lot worse, and they can’t even get disability.

I saw 16 people pulled off a bus in Columbia and machine gunned. Pretty ugly, survived without extra leave or pay.


6 posted on 01/13/2013 4:55:53 PM PST by stubernx98 (cranky, but reasonable)
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To: stubernx98

If the locals want to pay for it the who are we to critisize?


7 posted on 01/13/2013 4:57:49 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: stubernx98

If the locals want to pay for it the who are we to criticize?


8 posted on 01/13/2013 4:58:09 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: dforest

I would agree with you if this were an urban hell-hole like Detroit or Chicago where dealing with murders is a ho-hum daily occurence.

But Newtown? I think even the toughest veteran cop in East St. Louis would be seeing a shrink after what happened there.


9 posted on 01/13/2013 4:58:36 PM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: Uncle Chip

Wow! What a bunch of hard asses we have here. I’m guessing your response to soldiers with PTSD is f’emm. It is part of thet job you know.


10 posted on 01/13/2013 5:01:26 PM PST by Drill Thrawl (The Progs are pushing for war. Be ready.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Look, soldiers see scenes as bad or worse than Sandy Hook, they don’t get to negotiate for paid time off.

I know it was bad, but You hear crimes stories all the time and they are described as being terribly disturbing. If every cop wanted time off from their job for these reasons, nobody would be working.


11 posted on 01/13/2013 5:02:22 PM PST by dforest
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To: Uncle Chip

Call me whatever you like - I’m not buying it. I’m not buying any part of the whole narrative. What we have been told happened there that day is all too convenient and poorly, inconsistently documented.

“Hush money” came first to my mind when I read this headline.

I never buy the “official” reports” on much of anything anymore. The only times I was ever part of and eye-witness to historical events - the Fall of Saigon and the Mayaguez Incident - and saw how the news and the history of those times were distorted by the media/CIA complex, I swore off believing anything the government ever told me.


12 posted on 01/13/2013 5:05:18 PM PST by dagogo redux (A whiff of primitive spirits in the air, harbingers of an impending descent into the feral.)
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To: Uncle Chip

No videos with a school with 5 plus permanent cameras on the premises, a “laughing” parent who seconds before he goes on camera starts LOL’ing before ‘crying that his “daughter” died, a medical examiner who acts like he came from a mental asylum...


13 posted on 01/13/2013 5:10:36 PM PST by max americana (Make the world a better place by punching a liberal in the face)
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To: Uncle Chip

six month vacation?? excuse me? that’s their job. did the medical examiner get 6 months vacation as well? how about the crime photog?

wtf?! I don’t get any vacation if a project is extra difficult. why should they? (besides being govt types and on the public dole)

what’s next? teachers getting more vacation because students are unruly or get bad grades? life guards getting vacation if they get sunburned?

if its too much, quit. you can always go back.


14 posted on 01/13/2013 5:23:26 PM PST by sten (fighting tyranny never goes out of style)
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To: dforest

Not sure a lot of soldiers see this many kids killed in this fashion.

The soldiers may see more blood and guts but not sure if they see what these policemen saw that day.

I am curious how many want this much time off. If they were there and they are evaluated and found that time off with counseling will help them, AND it is negotiated between them and the town, I don’t see how anyone could have a problem with that.

Think of the setting also. An American school where maybe some of theses officers kids went or some kids of their friends go to school. Many many children shot dead as they hid or tried to run.

I am pretty sure most of you hard asses on here would be pretty messed up after seeing something like what these officers saw that day.

I could be wrong and you guys are the type that has no soul and can carry on like nothing happened after seeing bodies of children that were shot and bled out on their CLASSROOM FLOOR where they and everyone expected them to be safe.

Not judging anyone that has no feelings as there is a need for people like you, but don’t see how you can judge them from afar.


15 posted on 01/13/2013 5:24:30 PM PST by BookaT
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To: Drill Thrawl
I’m guessing your response to soldiers with PTSD is f’emm.

Seems to me that is the government response, military that seek help are poorly served, and quickly denied their 2A rights, as opposed to cops who are coddled beyond all reason.

16 posted on 01/13/2013 5:26:45 PM PST by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: dagogo redux
As a hospital chaplain intern and then resident, specializing in pediatric ministry, I watched a bunch of lovely children die. (But not all at once.)

I had the strength of my faith, the support of my brother and sister chaplains, and, in a funny way, the support of the staff-- pediatrics people are special. We grieved together.

I've been a cop. I know some cops. Damn few of them have the education, the background, the support teams that I had.

When you go to seminary, when you enter chaplaincy training, you go in with the "movie" that you're the poor sucker who shows up when everything else has gone tits-up and the worst has already happened. Once an airliner crashed at the local airport -- only one survivor. Whom do they call? Chaplain. I'm on my way up to the NICU and I get flagged down by the ER people. They have a guy who just croaked. They don't know what to do. Like I do? Croaking stinks! It's not exactly what God had in mind.

I'm not sure, but I'm guessing the cops in Newtown maybe ran movies of, maybe, if they got REAL lucky, stopping a bank robbery or a rape. I bet few of them ever thought of preparing themselves emotionally and spiritually for a massacre of children.

I'll tell you another thing. Whatever people's theology of ministry is, when the compost hits the air-conditioner, the chaplain is there as God's representative. So when a kid I really loved, of parents I really loved, after spending most of her short life in the hospital, is discharged, and then dies of unknown causes, guess who the parents are angry at?

But while that hurt unbelievably, at least I had been briefed. I was ready to take fire.

My heart goes out to the Newtown cops. I bet they were completely unprepared for this. I bet we see some broken marriages, maybe even some suicides down the road for these LEOs.

Until you personally have messed with a bunch of dead children, please forgive me if I come into the dialogue thinking that you might not have a clue.

17 posted on 01/13/2013 5:31:22 PM PST by Mad Dawg (In te, Domine, speravi: non confundar in aeternum.)
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To: dforest

My cousin is a CT State trooper. He is a fifteen year vet, and he saw it all. He said it was the worst thing he had ever seen. Much worse than could be described.

Your imagination cannot come close to seeing little children blown apart.

Give these guys a break, as you do not know what you are talking about.


18 posted on 01/13/2013 5:33:23 PM PST by Vermont Lt (We are so screwed.)
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To: sten

over 600,000 have seen this. i saw some of these clips right after the shooting...like the feller that they pinned down in the woods, and the kid saw him, and he was in the front seat of the police car, but now he’s disappeared. i’m from Missouri, & i’m cornfused about a lot of stuff since 0bama took over. Good Luck, & i hope this helps: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx9GxXYKx_8&feature=youtube_gdata_player


19 posted on 01/13/2013 5:33:44 PM PST by stickywillie
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To: driftdiver

um... police see kids dead in horrible traffic accidents all the time, I don’t see why these officers need any time off at all. Seems like they are just trying to take advantage of the situation.


20 posted on 01/13/2013 5:44:44 PM PST by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama lied .. the economy died.)
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To: dagogo redux

I’d like to hear from someone who saw the rooms after the victims were removed. Where there holes in the walls? Or not? That would tell you the caliber of the weapon/s used.


21 posted on 01/13/2013 5:45:23 PM PST by meatloaf (Support Senate S 1863 & House Bill 1380 to eliminate oil slavery.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

“I think even the toughest veteran cop in East St. Louis would be seeing a shrink after what happened there.”

What good would that do? What has been seen cannot be unseen. You deal with it. If you’re lucky, you have people to comfort you while you do.


22 posted on 01/13/2013 5:48:38 PM PST by dsc (Any attempt to move a government to the left is a crime against humanity.)
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To: meatloaf

There are pictures of cars with bullet holes in them that were parked out front.


23 posted on 01/13/2013 5:55:56 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Mad Dawg

Amen, sir! Retired NYPD here. Trust me, if you can go through something like those officers went through and it doesn’t affect you, there’s something wrong with you. Not everyone has faith or a strong family or loved ones to help them through these things. On the opposite side of the coin, there are still way too many law enforcement agencies that say one thing, but do another, when it comes to seeking help. Contrary to what is said, it goes in your file and is considered when you go for special assignments. Pray for these officers. That’s a small town and they more than likely knew some of the victims.


24 posted on 01/13/2013 5:56:50 PM PST by cumbo78
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To: Mad Dawg

Good post, Mad.

Why can’t people consider the context? Consider the shattering of their “normalcy bias”?

Our entire world is crumbling around us, our government is corrupt, our constitution is being shredded, and we go on watching football, right?

It is only going to get worse, and it breaks this aged heart, who is grieving for everyone in Newtown, and everyone else in the USA who is struggling with seeing our nation destroyed by fools and knaves.

In case some of you didn’t notice, the American dream died in Newtown.

The nonsense going on in the media - the “reaction” of the MSM & liberal land is just the final nail in our national coffin. The “meme”is that we should surrender all our guns.

Do they really think we are that dumb?

Complex systems, and complex societies eventually self-destruct. We are witnessing our own destruction in slow motion.

And, I am very close to someone (crisis expert) called in on an emergency basis - to counsel the first responders and the families.

I think this person may have overwhelmed by the depth of the trauma and loss, so I am praying for my friend, as I am for all in Newtown, and the rest of us.

We desperately need God, so join me in prayer for our tattered shred of a nation.


25 posted on 01/13/2013 5:58:33 PM PST by jacquej
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To: Uncle Chip

First of all, if the officers see a shrink, all their weapons must be immediately confiscated as they are mentally ill and a danger to society (the same rules the Feds are applying to Vets with PTSD, or depression or can’t sleep, etc). Second, this is the first step in the unions for the police, school administrators, teachers, bus drivers, janitors, passerbys, ambulance attendants, etc. to start their permanent disability claims. Doesn’t sound possible, bet it will happen. Just setting up precedence through the temporary disability process.


26 posted on 01/13/2013 6:04:22 PM PST by RetiredTexasVet
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To: dagogo redux

I call you awake and alert, because absent answers to the many pieces to Sandy Hook that don’t fit, questioning the narrative is our duty. Especially when it is being used to try to disarm us, against all reason toward the stated purpose.


27 posted on 01/13/2013 6:06:34 PM PST by JTHomes (28th: Congress shall make no law respecting economics , or prohibiting the free exercise of markets)
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To: stickywillie

The guy who made that video is playing games with your head.

Out of one side of his mouth he is telling you that you can’t trust the media, yet he uses the media newsclips as proof of what he is selling in his video.

Here is a timeline from the audio of the police dispatch:

http://nhregister.com/articles/2012/12/14/news/doc50cc0897adc1a203744261.txt?viewmode=fullstory

It happened —


28 posted on 01/13/2013 6:12:30 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Mad Dawg

Well said, sir. I believe they should take all the time they need and all the help they can get. And if some decide to change careers, I’m for helping with that, too. I’ve not stood in their shoes, nor yours. Thank you for choosing the path you have, I’m sure you have helped many.

And I’m sure those officers and support personnel have helped many along their way. They need help, they should get it.


29 posted on 01/13/2013 6:21:27 PM PST by SueRae (It isn't over. In God We Trust.)
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To: Uncle Chip

looked to me like the media showed us somethings, once, and never again, is what he is saying. what am I missing? who was the guy in the woods, and the one the kid described. was the kid part of the hoax? I saw these clips the day of the shooting, and now they don’t even try to explain them away; they are simply ignored. just like fast & furious, & benghazi.


30 posted on 01/13/2013 6:25:35 PM PST by stickywillie
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To: stickywillie

I just found this on You Tube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fIdNl_KwEo


31 posted on 01/13/2013 6:34:15 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip

didn’t watch the whole thing, but I saw similar points brought up from the same information from the scene. there were other videos, to be clicked upon, that looked like more of the same as these two.


32 posted on 01/13/2013 7:00:35 PM PST by stickywillie
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To: dforest

Agree. Too many want a check. My BIL has my sister convinced he has PTSD from Long Binh. And, I set him up as a disabled vet owned business.


33 posted on 01/13/2013 7:21:32 PM PST by Lumper20
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To: dforest

“I am sure it was a horrible scene, but officers all over the country have witnessed horrible scenes in the course of their careers.”

I agree They are a disgrace.

My son was on duty in Manhattan the morning of 9-11 and got 12 hour days for a couple of weeks. No whining—you do what you have to do.

.


34 posted on 01/13/2013 7:26:59 PM PST by Mears
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To: dagogo redux
“Hush money” came first to my mind when I read this headline.

You are sharper than I. To me at first, it just seemed another embellishment of the on-going sale of the narrative as it now stands. I like your idea better now.
35 posted on 01/13/2013 7:31:00 PM PST by Resettozero
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Sandy Hook and Christopher Rodia – Most ‘Conspiracy Theorists’ Can’t Think

Nancy Lanza’s, not Christopher Rodia’s, car being removed from SH school. Apparently many alternative news pundits and Sandy Hook conspiracy theorists are still fixated on the idea that a man named Christopher Rodia was the REAL owner of the black Honda Civic that has been identified as the car of Adam Lanza’s mother and which was found outside the Sandy Hook elementary school.

The basis for this erroneous belief is police scanner audio that was picked up from the morning of Dec. 14th and details Connecticut State Police response to the massacre.

I obtained the original audio files from Radioreference.com. I had to pay a small sum for the full files. I have listened to them, and it is pretty clear that it is rather unlikely that the aforementioned Christopher Rodia had anything to do with the Sandy Hook massacre, even if his name and DOB is mentioned in the audio.

This doesn’t seem to dissuade the conspiracy nuts though. In fact, it just makes them even nuttier.

What so many of these nutty people have apparently missed is the fact that the audio files clearly contain police communications about MORE than just the Sandy Hook event.

http://joequinn.net/2013/01/11/sandy-hook-and-christopher-rodia-most-conspiracy-theorists-cant-think/


36 posted on 01/13/2013 7:51:38 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: dforest

I was a policeman for almost 30 years. I got to know tough street cops who could laugh and make jokes about just about every kind of murder, suicide, traffic collision, or industrial accident you can imagine. It seemed like the more violent the death, or the more graphic the autopsy, the more we tended to look for dark humor in it. Perhaps it was an emotional defense mechanism that helped us deal with what would otherwise be a pretty grim sight.

But seeing a dead or dying child was a sobering experience for all of us who experienced it. It was the one thing we never joked about, and it was the one thing that I always found somewhat difficult to forget.


37 posted on 01/13/2013 7:52:28 PM PST by 04-Bravo
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To: Uncle Chip
Union officials said 13 officers are affected. At least six were the first in the school on Dec. 14, arriving just as Adam Lanza shot himself to death. Lanza killed 20 first graders and six women during a shooting spree inside two classrooms.

Almost all of the officers have tried to return to work. Police union attorney Eric Brown said many will need counseling for years.

Reading this in the actual article tells me its the union and I wonder how much of the counseling money they will collect.

38 posted on 01/13/2013 8:09:48 PM PST by mouser (Run the rats out its the only chance we have)
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To: 04-Bravo

I was very good friends with a fireman that did the same kind of kidding. Like you said..defense mechanism. But never when children were involved.

I equate these policeman to the ones in my small town. They probably don’t, never expected to experience such a horrific thing. They don’t make huge money and usually deal with stolen bikes, traffic tickets, low level drug dealers and MAYBE a single murder once in a blue moon.

They more than likely knew the families of these children.

Although I am a cynic by nature, I can well imagine that these people were not mentally equipped to deal with the magnitude of this event.

I have a step-sibling in a neighboring town that is a psychologist. She was asked to go to counsel first responders. She broke down and couldn’t do it, although she has been in the business for 50 years.


39 posted on 01/13/2013 8:27:20 PM PST by berdie
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To: Uncle Chip
oh brother... another scam by LEO looking for the disability check and long slide into retirement with low back pain, knee pain and pension/disability then a nice house in Florida. pathetic bunch of weak sisters.

How 'bout paramedics that see this cr#p everyday, nurses, morgue techs.... I guess they should just disincorporate the entire city, salt the earth and move away....... oh and get a government check to help them forget.

40 posted on 01/13/2013 8:51:33 PM PST by Dick Vomer (democrats are like flies, whatever they don't eat they sh#t on.)
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To: Uncle Chip

I feel so bad for these townspeople. What a horrific crime.


41 posted on 01/13/2013 8:55:22 PM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: mouser
I wonder how much of the counseling money they will collect.

I'm sure that is all going to be covered in the negotiations for these officers' time off. The union will get its cut for sure. They want their piece of that 6+ million dollar charitable fund raised for the victims of Newtown.

42 posted on 01/13/2013 8:55:58 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Mears

Perhaps there are “cultural differences” between hardened NY city officers, and those of sleepy rural Connecticut villages.

These responding officers rose to the occasion, and did what they had to do, but nothing in their experience had prepared them for that horrible scene.

I will wait to hear what first responding NYC officers have to say about the trauma of seeing so many little kindergarden and first grade kids blown to bits in their classrooms. Many of them children of neighbors and friends in the community.

I say again, these local police did what they had to do, they responded, and your comments demean their bravery and their pain
.
We do not need police officers who are devoid of normal human feelings.

Think long and hard about the consequences to us all - of that sort of “hardened” officer.


43 posted on 01/13/2013 9:11:03 PM PST by jacquej
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To: Dick Vomer

If those kids can return to school after all this then why can’t the police return to work. Who is setting the example for whom???


44 posted on 01/13/2013 9:17:43 PM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: dforest

I figure LEOs are used to seeing a dead body or three, but a room full of dead toddlers and little ones? I think we can cut them slack.


45 posted on 01/13/2013 9:21:46 PM PST by Clock King
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To: BookaT

Good post.

Instead of the federal government trying to grab the guns, it would make more sense for Congress to grant Newtown funding to replace the Sandy Hook school, and perhaps to hire some new officers.

I sense that those who had to go into that building first are going to be scarred for life, regardless of the fact that they were “officers on duty”.

Some may decide not to come back to work. I wouldn’t blame them.


46 posted on 01/13/2013 9:23:27 PM PST by Road Glide
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To: Clock King

Thank you for joining me in understanding that there are some things a civilized human being cannot see without long term consequences.

When did some Freepers become so cynical, so hardened, so suspicious?

Another sign of our dangerously troubled times? Probably. I find myself being totally mistrustful of anything I hear from the media and authority.

We are losing faith in all of our institutions, because of corruption. But it begins from the top, not the bottom. OK to distrust Union leaders, the Fed, the Justice Dept, Supremes, Homeland Security, etc.

But, we can’t get to the point where we do not trust our local first responders, or else we are in a deeper pit than I can even think about.

How do we go there, I ask? Not to even trust our neighbor?


47 posted on 01/13/2013 9:44:36 PM PST by jacquej
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To: Uncle Chip

Uncle Chip, these little kids are doing what they are told to do, not what they want to do.

If you were one of them, would you ask your mommy to let you go back to school?

I know all about getting back on the horse, etc... but this is a whole different notch up the scale of trauma.

I will bet that at least 30% of these children will bear scars for the rest of their lives by being forced to go back to school. We all aren’t wired the same way.

I would pay very close attention to my children, and be willing to homeschool them, and get them extended counseling after a horrible trauma like this.

But, I see this as “A Harbinger” of our devolution into chaos and devastation. You might want to read the book, by that title. It is available on Kindle.

We have been warned, are being warned, but seem to insist on ignoring the warning. It will only get worse, not better.


48 posted on 01/13/2013 9:55:32 PM PST by jacquej
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To: Vermont Lt

Idoubt you know what you are talking about either.

Does anyone, since we have heard little since it happened about what actually happened?


49 posted on 01/14/2013 2:15:11 AM PST by dforest
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To: BookaT

Poopycock. Who are you to judge others feelings? I don’t see the President weeping. He is using that scene to punish others.

I am sure of one thing. It is awfully good that the 9/11 first responders just kept on ticking. They saved lots of lives that day. Many gave their lives.


50 posted on 01/14/2013 2:21:38 AM PST by dforest
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