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Minnesota's wealthy caught in a tight tax net over residency
MPLS Star & Sickle ^ | 4-16-14 | ADAM BELZ

Posted on 04/19/2014 9:19:32 AM PDT by TurboZamboni

It’s getting tougher for Minnesotans to avoid the state’s taxes by spending part of the year somewhere else.

Snowbirds and high earners are discovering that they must do more than buy a condo in the Sun Belt and register a vehicle there, after a court decision last year reinforced the state’s ability to use any of more than two dozen criteria to determine who is a Minnesota resident.

“People refer to it as Hotel Minnesota,” said Matt Shea, a lawyer at Gray Plant Mooty. “You can come any time you like, but you can never leave.”

To determine tax residency, the state is looking at such things as where people vote, whether they mostly use Minnesota bank accounts and whether they go to the doctor here or in another state. Accountants and lawyers are advising clients who want to avoid Minnesota tax to sell local property and businesses if possible, and definitely to spend less time here than wherever they plan to claim as their new home state.

(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; US: Minnesota
KEYWORDS: dayton; democrats; fleeingtyranny; income; mn; tax; taxes
26 NEW criteria to meet...good luck. Democrats want their wage slaves to stay on their plantation.
1 posted on 04/19/2014 9:19:32 AM PDT by TurboZamboni
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To: TurboZamboni

Guess they’ll just stay in Florida then.


2 posted on 04/19/2014 9:20:58 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("The best way to control opposition is to lead it ourselves." -- Vladimir Ilyich Lenin)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
Talking to public sector employees (mostly educrats and LEOs)I always thought it hypocritical to learn where they plan to retire to and why.

They spent their employment years in the union voting rat, but first chance they get, move to Florida.

3 posted on 04/19/2014 9:23:08 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.-JFK)
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To: TurboZamboni

“the state is looking at such things as where people vote, “

Probably both places.


4 posted on 04/19/2014 9:23:33 AM PDT by Lurkina.n.Learnin
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To: TurboZamboni

Are you a Minnesotan? The answer may surprise you.


5 posted on 04/19/2014 9:23:43 AM PDT by DManA
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To: TurboZamboni

No one has ever said how many Minnesota folks play this dual-state status. From my three years in Tucson....I had the feeling that I bumped into a Minnesotaite almost daily after 1 October, and rarely saw any of them after March. It’d be curious to know how many of them leave for the winter.


6 posted on 04/19/2014 9:25:47 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: TurboZamboni
the state is looking at such things as where people vote,

that is all that matters, isn't it?

7 posted on 04/19/2014 9:26:14 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: DManA

Maybe he’s the guy with signs in his yard and the pickup truck with the Don’t tread on me (Gadsden) flag on it.


8 posted on 04/19/2014 9:28:01 AM PDT by BeadCounter ( Let's hope profanity remains the only stranger here.)
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To: TurboZamboni
Very soon I'm gonna be selling my place in the Gay State,buying a place in New Hampshire that's about 10 miles farther from Boston than my current place and,probably next winter I'll be buying a small place on the west coast of Florida (near Sarasota).I'll spend every April,May,June,July,August,September,October and November (and part of December) in NH,and the other months in FL.No danger of income tax and I'll be exposed to a sales tax only while in Florida.The Gay State is very close to seeing the last nickel in tax they'll ever see from me.Except for the occasional meals tax or gasoline tax.
9 posted on 04/19/2014 9:30:07 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Stalin Blamed The Kulaks,Obama Blames The Tea Party)
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To: Gay State Conservative

good luck.


10 posted on 04/19/2014 9:37:44 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.-JFK)
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To: DManA
Are you a Minnesotan? The answer may surprise you.

I've set foot in Minnesota once.I spent three nights there (in a hotel).I don't anticipate ever setting foot in the state again.I'd be surprised,to say the least,if Minnesota ever tries to claim me as a "resident".But then,you never know with leftists.When I make my move to New Hampshire and Florida I anticipate at least some trouble from Gay State tax officials.My Dad,who had a healthy income and net worth thanks to hard work and frugal living (he was a child of the Depression),had enormous trouble from the Gay State when he made his move to Florida.But he prevailed...after spending thousands on a lawyer.

11 posted on 04/19/2014 9:37:45 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Stalin Blamed The Kulaks,Obama Blames The Tea Party)
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To: TurboZamboni; All

As with most rules, they come about because a few folks abuse the freedom they have. When someone follows ‘the letter of the law’ they are playing the government’s game. If you are an ethical person you don’t need to try and shade things and skate on the edge to save a few bucks.

If you have enough money that you can afford to play these games over taxes then I don’t have a lot of sympathy for your ‘plight’.

Me, I am just one of those poor middle class dupes that works hard, votes, and actually lives where I say I do


12 posted on 04/19/2014 9:42:37 AM PDT by Nifster
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To: Chode

Read the story....

Where you vote is only part of it...this shell game that some play to minimize their taxes, while legal, ends up hurting everyone. And now the draconian rules are made to punish a few who will never feel the effects of it


13 posted on 04/19/2014 9:49:14 AM PDT by Nifster
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

“Guess they’ll just stay in Florida then.”

I think for the most part they live close to family and have maintained a vacation home elsewhere. I understand you have to be out of California for 18 months before you can avoid state income tax. Even then, if you’re still a member of a church or have a bank account there, you’re taxed. Eventually, all of the harshest rules will be universally applied.

I interviewed with a CEO who runs a company in Florida, but whose wife lives in New Jersey close their kids. He fly’s home on the weekends. He said the audit was hell and they made the argument that even though he owns a house in Florida he really lives in New Jersey and commutes to Florida. I don’t know how it came out.


14 posted on 04/19/2014 9:52:42 AM PDT by Gen.Blather
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To: TurboZamboni
The new income tax bracket for the wealthy is projected to generate $1.1 billion in new revenue over two years, 5.4 percent of all individual income tax revenue for the state. In total, the 257,000 households in the top 10 percent for income are projected to pay $4 billion in income taxes in 2015, or 55 percent of all state individual income taxes.

It won't generate the money they expect because enough of the the targeted wealthy will likely flee to a low tax state, or make certain they don't meet the residency criteria.

So that projected $1.1 billion may actually end up being lowered by a half to two-thirds. Then the state will complain that revenue is down and they have to raise whatever taxes/fees the legislature thinks they can get a pass on from the voters.

Another great example of American tax policy; raising tax rates that REDUCE tax receipts...which result in MORE tax rate increases. Insanity!

15 posted on 04/19/2014 9:54:13 AM PDT by floozy22 ( "Government is not the solution to our problem, government IS the problem." Ronald Reagan)
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To: TurboZamboni

Just one more reason I hate this state and can’t wait to get out.


16 posted on 04/19/2014 9:55:26 AM PDT by Solson (The Voters stole the election! And the establishment wants it back.)
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To: TurboZamboni

9.85% state income tax rate has to be one of the highest of the 57 states, no?


17 posted on 04/19/2014 9:56:00 AM PDT by nascarnation (Toxic Baraq Syndrome: hopefully infecting a Dem candidate near you)
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To: Nifster
i did, the way i see it is, where ever you are legally registered to vote is your state of residence...

just like owning multiple property in my own state, i couldn't vote in another town that i owned property in because i don't live there even though i pay village/town/county/school property taxes there

18 posted on 04/19/2014 10:01:33 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: Nifster
As with most rules, they come about because a few folks abuse the freedom they have

The problem with residency for retirees is often complicated. The rules vary from state to state, and are sometimes contradictory about where to get a driver's license, where to vote, what taxes are owed where, how medical plans cover expenses and care in a second state.

I try to keep things simple. If I were to spend extended time somewhere else, I'd rent, and keep my footprint in that other area as minimal as possible. I'm upper-poor, so OH tax isn't that bad a burden as a retiree.

19 posted on 04/19/2014 10:05:24 AM PDT by grania
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To: Nifster
If you have enough money that you can afford to play these games over taxes then I don’t have a lot of sympathy for your ‘plight’.

It's not about rich and poor - it's about states and the Federal Government through tax laws and legislative obscenities like NAFTA attempting to claim ownership of your productive output, and thus, your person.

If they aren't stopped cold - right now - they'll get down to your level, eventually.

20 posted on 04/19/2014 10:10:52 AM PDT by Mr. Jeeves ([CTRL-GALT-DELETE])
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To: TurboZamboni

Can’t wait to leave. Two months and counting.


21 posted on 04/19/2014 10:12:24 AM PDT by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: nascarnation

IIRC, MN is now is 4th highest in the US.


22 posted on 04/19/2014 10:15:39 AM PDT by TurboZamboni (Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.-JFK)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
Guess they’ll just stay in Florida then.

Not all.

We will get a lot here in NC as "half-backs".

They move south to Florida, discover that it is hot in the summer and then move half-way back to the North...

"Half-backs"

23 posted on 04/19/2014 10:40:44 AM PDT by BwanaNdege
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To: TurboZamboni

Given the typical 183 day residency rule, what happens if one has three residences in three different States. Can one be not a resident of any State of territory?


24 posted on 04/19/2014 10:47:38 AM PDT by Paladin2
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To: TurboZamboni

Given the typical 183 day residency rule, what happens if one has three residences in three different States. Can one be not a resident of any State or territory?


25 posted on 04/19/2014 10:47:48 AM PDT by Paladin2
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To: Gen.Blather

Actually you only end up with an issue in CA during the year of split residency. I was transferred to MD from CA. I documented how much was earned in each state and filed appropriately. It helped that it was a clean break (no residual houses, cars, or voting). I kept a small account open by accident, but that was not a problem. I had adequate documentation to show that I had clearly moved.

What I did see in CA was people working in CA and declaring legal residency in NV. It works pretty well if you follow the checklists and behave yourself.


26 posted on 04/19/2014 11:19:15 AM PDT by Starwolf
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To: Mr. Jeeves
NAFTA = FATCA. Typing skills problem this morning... :)
27 posted on 04/19/2014 11:54:44 AM PDT by Mr. Jeeves ([CTRL-GALT-DELETE])
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To: Paladin2

Unlike moving to a foreign country, establishing residency in Puerto Rico has some tax edges.


28 posted on 04/19/2014 12:01:53 PM PDT by Southack (The one thing preppers need from the 1st World? http://tinyurl.com/ktfwljc .)
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To: Paladin2

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc901.html


29 posted on 04/19/2014 12:03:11 PM PDT by Southack (The one thing preppers need from the 1st World? http://tinyurl.com/ktfwljc .)
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To: TurboZamboni

bookmark


30 posted on 04/19/2014 12:07:51 PM PDT by gitmo (If your theology doesn't become your biography, what good is)
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To: TurboZamboni

My company tracks my labor hours by zip code and allocates
state income tax accordingly. I’m an Idaho resident.
That’s where my home, family, property and voting
is done. California gets a large portion of state
income taxes. Nebraska will get some this year as
well. The multi-state income tax filing is a real
pain in the butt.


31 posted on 04/19/2014 1:28:16 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: TurboZamboni

First of all, THANKS to you TurboZ for keeping us updated on MN.

MN has to keep their Somali population on bennies by sharing the snowbird monies.


32 posted on 04/19/2014 2:22:51 PM PDT by SgtHooper (I lost my tag!)
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To: Gay State Conservative
Which of the three states you mentioned are you referring to as the Gay Syate?


33 posted on 04/19/2014 2:27:01 PM PDT by gitmo (If your theology doesn't become your biography, what good is)
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To: gitmo

Massatwoshits.


34 posted on 04/19/2014 2:34:27 PM PDT by Hoodat (Democrats - Opposing Equal Protection since 1828)
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To: TurboZamboni

Why would they live in Minnesota?


35 posted on 04/19/2014 2:35:40 PM PDT by AppyPappy
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To: TurboZamboni

Combine that high tax scenario with global cooling and you have a recipe for declining population....


36 posted on 04/19/2014 2:37:40 PM PDT by nascarnation (Toxic Baraq Syndrome: hopefully infecting a Dem candidate near you)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Arizona.......


37 posted on 04/19/2014 2:39:51 PM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... History is a process, not an event)
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To: Chode

You and I agree. Where you vote is where you should live......and it is where you should pay taxes


38 posted on 04/19/2014 4:58:58 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: grania

If you have multiple places that you have a place to lay your head a night you are more than ‘upper poor’. Most folks IF they even get to retire have one place they call home.... not one for the summer and one for the winter


39 posted on 04/19/2014 5:00:43 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: Mr. Jeeves

I didn’t say it was about rich and poor. I did suggest that some folks have enough money to do as they wish.... and if you one a home for summer and a home for winter (which is what snow birds do) then you are in the status of having enough to do what you want. You are not eating casseroles, deciding whether you have enough to go to the doc, or any of a dozen other things. Understand clearly, I am not complaining about the fact that these folks have worked hard to get to where they are. they have used legal means to do so. My comments were meant to indicate that there is a difference between what is legal and what is ethical.

To bring NAFTA into this discussion is so far off the wall I won’t even comment on it.


40 posted on 04/19/2014 5:04:37 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: Nifster
yup...
41 posted on 04/19/2014 5:08:53 PM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: TurboZamboni

I lived in California several decades ago. The state of California set up a FIELD OFFICE in Las Vegas. The purpose was to find California retirees in Nevada and make them pay California income tax, even though they no longer lived there. The claim was that they earned their pay in CA, had it tax-deferred income there, and therefore needed to pay taxes later, regardless of where they lived.

I was in my 20s, but I knew that it was time to skedaddle, and I went to Texas as fast as I could. One could argue that CA had a point, but I didn’t care to find out either way. If they had that attitude, I wanted NOTHING to do with them.


42 posted on 04/19/2014 7:24:25 PM PDT by BobL
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To: gitmo
Which of the three states you mentioned are you referring to as the Gay State?

From my profile page:

...my FR "nom de guerre" is a play on the official nickname of Massachusetts (The Bay State) and the recent decision by the Chief Justice of our Supreme Court,Margaret Marshall (a South African who's married to that Fellow Traveler at the NY Times,Anthony Lewis) that homosexual marriage is guaranteed by our Constitution...thus,"Gay State Conservative".

43 posted on 04/19/2014 9:11:25 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Stalin Blamed The Kulaks,Obama Blames The Tea Party)
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To: TurboZamboni

Its even worse if you are an expat...if you spend 38 days in the US its as if you spent the whole year here. Thus all your income earned abroad is subject to US income taxes.


44 posted on 04/20/2014 5:50:00 AM PDT by bjorn14 (Woe to those who call good evil and evil good. Isaiah 5:20)
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To: Gay State Conservative

ThwnK you.


45 posted on 04/20/2014 4:21:42 PM PDT by gitmo (If your theology doesn't become your biography, what good is)
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