Posted on 04/22/2014 10:15:21 AM PDT by tcrlaf
Ukraine's Acting President Turchynov appears to be calling for an official break in the "truce" deal...
-UKRAINE'S TURCHYNOV URGES RESTART OF ANTI-TERRORIST OPERATION -TURCHYNOV SAYS 'TERRORISTS' HOLDING EAST UKRAINE REGION HOSTAGE -TURCHYNOV SAYS EAST UKRAINE SEPARATISTS SUPPORTED BY RUSSIA So much for Joe Biden's peace-keeping salvation mission to Kiev...
There was no “unrest” in eastern Ukraine until Putin sent in the Russian Army commandos to terrorize and create anarchy.
The more anarchy the Russians astroturf in E. Ukraine, the more the local people will want nothing to do with them. It’s completely clear to everyone on the ground save for a few bus station drunks who is acting like Al Qaeda in Ukraine. I’ll buy you a clue, it isn’t the Ukrainian authorities.
You are claiming “the elected leader had to flee a militant mob” when the evidence is to the exact contrary.
First, the protesters in the Euromaidan did not exhibit significant violence until after President Yanukovych ordered the Berkut to use violence and sometimes lethal violence to deny the protestors the right to peacefully petition their government to act and stop the criminal misconduct of the Yanukovych administration and the oligarchs plundering the nation.
President Yanukovych also used his control of the security forces to abduct dissidents, torture, murder, and/or make them disappear. These extralegal and illegal acts by Yanukovych and his administration were met with peaceful protests, until the use of force and lethal force by Yanukovych provoked a passive or a sometimes violent resort to violent force in response.
What little force, violent or not, that could be mustered by the protesters in the Euromaidan was incapable of seizing or capturing President Yanukovych, because he was at all times under the very secure protection of his Berkut and other security forces. There was one and only one threat President Yanukovych faced, and that was the beginning of the constitutional proceedings by the elected Deputies of the parliament that would ultimately result in his lawful removal from office and/or his eventual arrest and prosecution in a court of law for a number of criminal acts.
President Yanukovych was in less personal and official danger than the present senior officer of the Berkut now being held for trial in a court of law for his alleged role in the killing of the Euromaidan protesters and other dissidents before the Euromaidan protests. The Berkut officer was safely held under house arrest until now, when the court has ordered the man be held in custody until his criminal trial.
Even if someone wants to try and claim President yanukovych was unsafe in Kiev/Kyiv, subsequent events have proven he could very easily have remained far beyond the reach of the Eromaidan protesters in one of the eastern cities among his political supporters. Even if the parliament had completed the constitutional process needed to remove Yanukovych from office and order his arrest and criminal prosecution, his supporters in the eastern cities now held by the pro-Russian militias, orchestrated and led by Russian military forces, would have obstructed every effort to arrest President Yanukovych.
Since there was no credible threat or opportunity for the Euromaidan protesters or the parliamentary government of the Ukraine to apprehend President Yanukovych without his cooperation, President Yanukovych had no need to flee the Ukraine or defect to the hostile foreign nation of Russia.
What it comes down to is the fact that President Yanukovych abandoned and vacated his elected office at the behest of his Russian sponsors, who wanted a pretext to invade and intervene in the Ukraine before the next scheduled elections produced such adverse results that not even the past vote fraud and vote rigging could prevent the ouster of Russia's premier agent in the Ukrainian government.
Putin had already waited in vain for more than a decade to bring the Ukraine under his control using Yanukovych and his supporting oligarchs. Putin decided further delay risked an even greater loss of Russian control and influence within the Ukrainian government. Putin also guaged the risk of a loss of control of the U.S. Government by Obama and the Democrats could deny Putin the free hand he needed to pursue his reconquests in Europe in his lifetime. So, Putin decided to act now to settle the Ukrainian question before the conditions for such a move became considerably less favorable for many years to come.
Yanukovych was prevailed upon by Putin to vacate his presidential office to give Russia a pretext for the invasion and annexation or control by Russia before the Ukraine could be lost to the European Union and/or an alliance with NATO. So, Yanukovych committed treason and vacated his office before the Euromaidan, the parliament, Svoboda, or anyone else could even remotely become a danger to his person without his participation and cooperation. So, there was no coup and there can be “no evidence of a coup” by the opponents of Yanukovych.
“Freedom went out the window when the coup happened.”
Your statement is a lie. Yanukovych vacated his office befoe his opponents had any opportunity to remove him from his office. So, there was no coup by the opponents of Yanukovych.
“Now folks who were happy with the election are facing military from the thugs who burned their way into the kiev statehouse and being told by us press and countless freepers that if they dont roll over they are against freedom and democracy.”
Your statement is a repetition of Russian lies used as disinformation supportive of Russian false war propaganda. The parliament you falsely accuse of “being the thugs who burned their way into the kiev statehouse” were lawfully elected Deputies years before Yanukovych abandoned and vacated his office before the parliament or anyone else could have any opportunity to apprehend Yanukovych or remove him from office. The deputies could hardly have “burned their way into the kiev statehouse” by being elected in the years prior to the Euromaidan protests.
The pro-Russian separatist minority of the population are indeed against freedom and democracy, because they are using lethal force under the leadership and supply of a foreign invader, Russia, to keep the majority of the population from holding fair elections that have in the past and would tomorrow favor Ukrainian sovereignty.
Your comments amount to no more than false propaganda favoring the Russian aggressors and pro-russian aggressors.
Ok Goebbels
You are right on the money with our comments.
I am amused at the irony of watching so called small government conservatives, who flail away at the slightest government interference here in the US., and yet are appeasers and supporters of a rogue Russia, annexing and invading other weaker nations.
There are jokes and laughingstocks here at FR. Worse than statist RINOs really, because even some RINOs will stand up to naked aggression from natural American enemies.
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Yeah, Dupont and Monsanto, they are some clever clandestine paramilitary smooth operators.
Listmaker conspiracy loons are the worst, right up there with the numerology of Farahkhan.
Ping, interesting article from 2001.
10 year “anniversary” of US government efforts.
Thanks WhiskeyX.
Of course you didn’t make the list.
It’s a commmon Chamber of Commerce / Business Council type of list that shows investment in Ukraine.
You made the association of the list to Russian agents/spies.
You continue to make silly associations regarding “absorbing the Ukraine”. It is simple investment. Put the conspiracies away, turn off the Jones and Noory.
I see the Ukraine situation as very complicated, basically intractable with blame to go all around.
That said, your insistence on using the insulting “kid” and ridiculous invective is evidence of an inability to communicate effectively. It is you who sounds like a petulant “kid”.
I will make sure to avoid perusing any of your comments in the future as they seem to have little in the way of fact or evidence and are heavy on the immature name calling.
You avoid the article from 2001.
It proves that the US government was actively influencing Ukraine since 1991.
The USUBC and the US-Ukraine Foundation are financially supported by businesses like those, and NGOs, and USAID (US government) money.
Why not admit this ? It’s been a huge success. Ukraine is almost in the EU. Why not celebrate it ?
Just say “yes, we’ve been meddling in there for 25 years, we’ve had great success at transforming the whole country and it’s almost done”.
If the globalistas were honest, and just admitted that they support the US/UK establishment financial elites, maybe they’d get some support from conservatives who just threw in the towel, and said “we can’t beat those globalists, let’s just join’em. At least we’ll be minions for the globalists, maybe they’ll take care of us better than the rest of the sheeple”.
“You avoid the article from 2001. It proves that the US government was actively influencing Ukraine since 1991.”
The more recent stuff is what is important.
A US Blog called PANDO warned about USAID moving to direct funding of Ukraine opposition groups in Oct, 2013, after the Syrian debacle. Up until then, the funding had been funneled through Pierrie Omidyar’s Omidyar Network.
Yes, that is EBAY’s Omidar, friend of both Obama, and Hamas. And all of this US/Omidar money was spent to benefit one person, Oleh Rybachuk, whose bio reads like a KGB novel.
Also remember what it was that really kicked the Maidan off, the Money-laundering investigations into the USAID/Omidar-funded NGO’s.
The more I dig into this, the deeper the web gets. It’s too bad we no longer have this thing called “Journalism” in America. This would be Pullitzer Prize-winning stuff, if it didn’t make the God-King of the Queer Media look so bad.
I don’t read the jones guy, noory I don’t know who that is.
I posted a link to the actual text of the Association Agreement here on FR.
Its clever, open-ended, yet innocent-sounding terms certainly are a stepping stone on the path to assimilation.
You’ll never understand the conspiracy without understanding the implicity enslavement represented by government debt.
“Ok Goebbels”
You are one of the people who is using this forum to disseminate one lie after another lie in virtual disregard of the evidence being brought forth which refutes your lies, just like Goebbels did. You are gainsaying and engaging in denials in the absence of valid evidence. for one example, you have yet to present any valid evidence whatsoever to show where in the Ukrainian constitution the President has the power to vacate his office in the Ukrainian jurisdiction, order the commission of mass murders, and join with a foreign enemy to subvert the constitutional government of the Ukraine in a treasonous conspiracy to incite civil war and bring the nation into submission to the foreign enemy. Please show us where in the constitution the president has the power to commit such acts and the elected parliament does not have the power and the duty to punish such acts by the president.
Kiev Post, Feb 10
““Police are investigating Center UA, a public-sector watchdog funded by Western donors, on suspicion of money laundering, the group said. The group’s leader, Oleh Rybachuk, said it appears that authorities, with the probe, are trying to warn other nongovernmental organizations that seek to promote democracy, transparency, free speech and human rights in Ukraine.
“According to Center UA, the Kyiv economic crimes unit of the Interior Ministry started the investigation on Dec. 11. Recently, however, investigators stepped up their efforts, questioning some 200 witnesses.
“… Center UA received more than $500,000 in 2012, according to its annual report for that year, 54 percent of which came from Pact Inc., a project funded by the U.S. Agency for International Development.
Nearly 36 percent came from Omidyar Network, a foundation established by eBay founder Pierre Omidyar and his wife. Other donors include the
****** International Renaissance Foundation, whose key funder is billionaire George Soros,*******
and National Endowment for Democracy, funded largely by the U.S. Congress.”
https://www.kyivpost.com/content/politics/rybachuk-democracy-promoting-nongovernmental-organization-faces-ridiculous-investigation-336583.html
Just to note, NED is supposed to be heavily tied into CIA.
I have little patience for internet trolls, especially ones that act like 12 year olds, with multiple ID’s that all show up within minutes of each other, all screeching the same exact thing.
Via its constant flaming, it has managed to run off most posters on the Ukraine threads, simply because they don’t want to deal with the headache.
Disagreement is fine, that is why we discuss things. Flaming someone to try and bury whatever the point of the article is, isn’t.
Actually, I’m reluctant to read the Ukrainian threads because of certain posters such as yourself. They continually spew Russian propaganda. But if anyone quotes something from, say, the Kyiv Post, well then it’s a biased source and can’t be trusted.
I also noticed that this particular group tend to stay away from threads that contain hard evidence of Russian interference. Or if they do show up, they are the ones eschewing logical fact-based discussion in favor of straw-man arguments, innuendo, mockery, and outright lies.
It’s unfortunate, because I have mostly written off FR as a source of analysis about the ongoing troubles in Ukraine. And I really need some good analysis. My wife lived in Ukraine until late 2001. She has immediate family there, including relatives in some of the most troubled areas. And I am sick to death of hearing about Nazi Ukrainians running things, and causing all the trouble, Putin is a great guy because he hates gays, Russia is completely in the right and should invade Ukraine killing as many Ukrainians as necessary, and besides, if Obama is on Ukraine’s side, they must be the bad guys. [spit]
You guys don’t know jack about what’s really going on there.
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