The 2 Worlds of Muslim-American Teenagers

The New York Times ^ | October 7, 2001 | SUSAN SACHS

[sarcasm]

The joys of multiculturalism.

[sarcasm]

ping

[BunnySlippers]

Scary

[sarcasm]

.

[isthisnickcool]

Most kids this age don't have enough experience in life to say anything coherent about anything. These "Muslim-American" kids are no different. But they seem to be much more paranoid than they should be. Why? They can do just about anything they want in this country just like everybody else. Someone is filling these young kids heads full of mush. They ought to go live in one of the "Muslim" countries for a few weeks and see what it's like. Don't they have a clue why their parents came to America?

The more I read statements by people that practice the Muslim faith the more it appears that they are taught in their religion "either you are with them or aginst them." Or maybe "you are with us or we are against you". And a lot of them have been saying things that make them seem more part time Americans than anything else.

[chatham]

Let them take their views and their cowardly asses back to Muslim world and don't come back. The U.S.A. has spent more money and more Blood protecting the world from evil than all other countries combined . I am really tired of listening to the Incoming Alien types who expound on their anti American views.. Particularly 17 year old morons who still haven't learned anything.....Let them go to Taliban World where you can be jailed or killed based on the length of your beard or your pubic hair. Take the Poll in Kuwait and see how they feel?

[kosta50]

The man we supported and helped, Bosnia's fundamentalist Muslim president Alija Izetbegovic, wrote before the war there that there can be no co-existance between Islamic and non-Islamic societies.

Now that this issue comes closer home, we realize that Islam is not Southern Baptist, Anglican, Methodist, Catholic or Greek Orthodox. Islam recognizes only one nation -- the nation of Islam. It is therefore incompatible with any other. It co-exists with others because it has to, but Koran teaches the believers that they should spread the religion, even by force. After all, Islam means submission, not peace. It treates non-believers as enemies. Koran online is availbale. Read it.

[politeia]

This article confirms my suspicion -- and fear -- that American Muslim's generally lack a belief in and support for the American political creed as expressed in our founding documents. Our system of self-government requires a consensus on these principles. The recent history of Islamic fundamentalism in the so-called "moderate" Muslim states confirms their opposition to individual liberty and what we have come to call constitutional principles. This was admitted, even though I don't think he realized it at the time, by a so-called "moderate" Muslim spokesman who was on Dr Laura Schlesinger's show on Thurs (Oct 4). I believe it was extremely revealing about the true Muslim agenda in the US, indeed in the world.

The guest was introduced as Dr. Hassan Hathout author of Reading the Muslim Mind and a spokesman for the Los Angeles Islamic Center of Southern California. This is the exchange as I transcribed it from the radio.

Question asked by “Ken” from Nevada:

Ken: “Is Islam in conflict with the US Constitution? Specifically, does the Koran instruct the faithful to strive for Islamic rule of law or government under Islamic rule of law? The fundamental question is this: Is the goal of Muslims Islamic rule of the world?"

Hathout: “For the last question, no it is not. As for the American constitution, I wish deep from my heart if all Muslim countries would take the American constitution for their constitution and live the democracy which is the essence of true Islam.”

Dr. Laura: “And take that Ken. Thank you. Did you have a follow-up or are you happy about that?”

Ken: “Well does the Koran instruct the faithful to strive for Islamic rule of law?”

Hathout: “No that’s when you are a Muslim community. If you are a Muslim community, you are required to judge your affairs… and in the Koran there is a verse that says that people of the torah should rule [unintelligible] should rule themselves with it and the people of the gospel should rule themselves with it and if you are just a Muslim majority nation, you are required by Islam to apply the Islamic law.”

Dr Laura: “However if you live in the United States of America?”

Hathout: "I belong in the law of the land. And that’s what Islam tells me."

Dr. Laura: "And that’s what Judaism tells us too."

After hearing this I returned to my Encyclopedia Britannica (1992) section on Islam and reread the material on Jihad. This is what it said:

Because the mission of the community is to “enjoin good and forbid evil” so that “there is no mischief and corruption on earth,” the doctrine of jihad, in view of the constitution of the community as the power base, is the logical outcome. For the early community it was a basic religious concept. Jihad, or holy war, means an active struggle using armed force whenever necessary. The object of jihad is not the conversion of individuals to Islam but rather the gaining of political control over the collective affairs of societies to run them in accordance with the principles of Islam. Individual conversions occur as a byproduct of this process when the power structure passes into the hands of the Muslim community.

I think the conclusions are clear. If and when Muslims are in the majority, they will use the power of the vote to conform our laws with Islamic law. This is what our leaders are ignoring. However "moderate" Muslims in America may seem, their religion recognizes no separation between church and state and is therefore fundamentally inconsistent with our political principles -- indeed with all of Western civilization. If America continues the open door immigration policy we may find that it is our political and religious principles that are merely "tolerated" by a Muslim majority while they pursue Islamic rule.

[80skid]

My 2 words.

Get Out.

Not really down with anyone not willing to fight for the very country and lifestyle they enjoy.

[GuillermoX]

Their ideal society would follow Islamic law and make no separation between religion and state.

This is what all of America needs to understand about these people. Their goal is the overthrow of the US Government and to impose their way of life on us. Mohammedans will get along with anybody else, as long as it is on their terms, fully and completely

"Maybe," he said, after recounting the number of calls from the neighborhood expressing good will, "we are too paranoid."

Their worldview is totally dependent on wild conspiracy theories. They believe the Mossad and the CIA were behind the attacks.

[isthisnickcool]

There is a medical term that mostly describes what you are talking about. In the human body it's a cancer.

[areafiftyone]

But few students said they thought that newspapers should be forbidden to write things about Islam, the prophet Muhammad or the Koran, topics that writers in most of the Muslim world stay away from out of fear of offending Muslim clerics.

Sorry kids - Freedom of Speech is a basic right in this country - If you don't like it go home to your country and see what you're missing out on by living at home. Their parents are isolating them by sending them to an Islamic school to shield them from our American culture. I sense that these kids are starting to become anti-american.

[GuillermoX]

You're absolutely right. Islam is a cancer. Too bad our President is so busy running from mosque to mosque barefoot, too busy inviting terrorists to the WH and National Cathedral to "pray" to realize this.

[ikanakattara]

So ... if the US Supreme Court rules that vouchers for private religious schools are constitutional, how do you all feel about this school getting tax money to spread anti-Americanism?

[SauronOfMordor]

If and when Muslims are in the majority, they will use the power of the vote to conform our laws with Islamic law.

Not just when they are in the majority

When they are a significantly large minority (say, 5-10%) they will use violence and threats of violence to get their way. Media outlets that are judged "anti-Islamic" will either change their tone, or face an endless series of assaults, sit-ins, protests, etc

Any author who speaks out will risk getting murdered, with the murderer either getting sprung by an "OJ jury" or becoming a celebrity on Death Row (like Mumia Abu Jamal) while filing endless appeals

Any teacher who says anything disliked by Muslims will be hounded from the school system, etc, etc

[NoControllingLegalAuthority]

Notably absent from this piece is any shock or horror from these young people at the senseless slaughter of thousands of innocent human beings (many Muslim) on September 11th.

This piece demonstrates the bitter fruit of "diversity" and "multiculturalism." In the past, all immigrants, who became U.S. citizens, were Americans first. Now, we have an enormous fifth column of traitors who bear no allegiance and will fight against the rest of America.

I will never again trust the allegiance of any Muslim in America. Their religion has no place for national allegiance.

They have no respect for the religious freedom allowed in the United States, and under which they practice their faith HERE, in contrast to the murderous intolerance toward non-Muslims in predominately Muslim countries.

Islam is a dangerous faith and the enemy of freedom throughout the world.

[porte des morts]

It would certainly seem that all those profiling,bigoted,"Iwon't fly on a plane with Arab types",Islam is anti-American,the problem is in our midst, bigots,may have been on to something..........

I sure hope all the Islam apologists here on FR read this.

And once again remember;in any war,there are only two sides.

[SauronOfMordor]

"It comes down to the proof," said Mazen Kased, 17. "If you prove a Muslim did it, that's a different story."

For an example of a level of proof that still would not satisfy these people, look at the OJ trial

[TheOtherOne]

You're absolutely right. Islam is a cancer. Too bad our President is so busy running from mosque to mosque barefoot, too busy inviting terrorists to the WH and National Cathedral to "pray" to realize this.

I would have expected it from Clinton or Gore, but I am shocked that Bush is more concerned about offending and codling of the enemy - than protecting American citizens.

[isthisnickcool]

So ... if the US Supreme Court rules that vouchers for private religious schools are constitutional, how do you all feel about this school getting tax money to spread anti-Americanism?

Considering all the left wing Anti-Americanism being spread today in our gov't schools having vouchers would help a great deal. If that means it would fund schools like this, so be it....