Ruling on area man's quest to stop child support sets a new tone

TimesLeader.com ^ | April 1, 2003

[longtermmemmory]

"I hate to tell you guys, but this ruling will cause more men to lose parental rights and visitation ....

you can't have it both ways....you can't claim that the father is just as important as the mother when you get rulings that because it was not your sperm, your fathering of that child MEANS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO THE COURTS.....

be careful what you ask for....

BUT if you think that your fatherhood means no more than your sperm or your money...then this ruling is great for you.... how very very sad "

The courts already have a system for non biological fathers, its called adoption. A properly done adoption will terminate the biological fathers claim and as a matter of law, make the adopting man completly and legaly the father. If the father is truly unknow, there are mechanisms to deal with this. Most times a biological father will sign away parental rights if there is going to be an adoption. For women who lied about the father, tough you lied and created the mess. If a man is that serious about raising the child, he must legally adopt the child. (fatherhood is not a hobby)

[Orangedog]

See, YOU are a real man! We need more like you in this country.

IMO, what would be fair is for the woman who commited the fraud to be forced under threat of jail time to repay every penny that he paid plus interest starting the day after the child's 18th birthday. After all, that is what HE was threatened with when he was ordered to pay. He should also be able (even encouraged) to retain his visitation rights.

[OneVike]

What happens when the mother decides to move to another state? Then to another without telling you, then another, then another. Finally after 13 years she goes to court because you have not paid child support in 13 years. However a court does not care that you are not the father, or that you did not know where to send the check. A judge (Female in this case) rules that you owe all that back support. Even if DNA proves you are not the father, and she has been living with on the average of 2 different men a year. But the judge in her "MOTHERLY MODE" Only thinks of the child. Even though the child will be 18 in one month.

No you need rethink your {I think like a mother} attitude!

[honeygrl]

"I would never go out with a woman who had a child because I had no desire to raise someone else's child. "

You obviously don't realize how truly wonderful being a parent is. Just to be sure that I wasn't only seeing this as a mother I asked my husbands opinion on this same article.. he agreed with me and told me there is nothing better than being a father. Children need real fathers, not sperm donors.

[misterrob]

If you bothered to read my post you would see that I would NOT cast the child aside. However, just because a child needs a father does not give women the right to lie to men.

And for the record, what does the child's biological father have to say about it? If he didn't know about the child shouldn't he have rights as well?

[honeygrl]

"The more pressing reason to advocate this is to alert the child to the fact that his mother is a schemer who will lie to him and use him as a tool to protect herself."

I really don't think a 4 year old needs to know things like this. A 4 year old needs to know his parents love him and not think that he's screwing up anyone's life.

[Orangedog]

I could pass up that one...

[longtermmemmory]

I am only interested in raising my own children. period. you assume much. We also need real mothers who stay home and do not park their chidren at day care. Its all a matter of personal choice, if you husband is fine with raising someone else child fine. You can only hope the biological father does not show up one day demanding visitation.

[Dark Knight]

>>It may be Justice on the father's side but I can't help but feel horribly for the poor child.. can you imagine the person you thought was your father and thought loved you unconditionally decides, "oh wait, I changed my mind." A father is more than just a sperm donor. This story tears me in two directions because I can see his side of it but I still can't see hurting a child that you thought was yours so long and developed a love for like your own as badly as this must hurt this boy. I think a real man would've continued to be the father every child needs. Maybe it's just the mother in me talking.<<

I've never been involved in one of these cases, but as I read more and more about them they seem to be a little different. They are almost always divorce cases. The family is going to be split. Guaranteed. Mom goes off with new husband, and the biological father in many cases. The ex husband and payer of child support is on the hook and then figures out that his wife had been cheating on him during the marriage and the child may not be his.

By now, in fact, he is not the father, he does not have custody, and even if he wanted vistations are either nasty or non existant. He has been cut out of the child's life by the mother. The only part of fatherhood he retains is that of a bill payer.

So when he finds out that he has been cheated in marriage and cheated in fatherhood, then he is cheated by the courts when they force him to continue to pay for a fraud that the mother committed.

She may now have an intact family, a steady source of outside income from a fraud, and living better than her ex. If he is lucky enough to find a good woman, (and honeygr1 from your empathetic post I know you are a good one!), his new family gets to have him work 2 jobs, new wife has to work and they live in fear that he will have to go back to court because if he makes anything, his ex will ask for more. What is fair about that?

Answer. Paternity needs to be established at birth using testing. Parties will be informed and make their own decisions based on facts. 30% of the fathers today aren't. That was from a study of blood records that shocked the people doing the study. That also correlates pretty well to a source in the psych community that says that 50% of women will be unfaithful during their marriage. He did not have a figure on guys, sorry.

Bottom line, fraud should never be sanctioned by the government. If the children suffer, blame the mother and the real father. The cuckholded husband and the child born outside of the vows, are the victims. As far as I'm concerned, when it comes to them, I believe they should decide what the penalty is, not the suspects. Suspects always minimize their crimes.

DK

[longtermmemmory]

""If you bothered to read my post you would see that I would NOT cast the child aside. However, just because a child needs a father does not give women the right to lie to men.

And for the record, what does the child's biological father have to say about it? If he didn't know about the child shouldn't he have rights as well? ""

And a child growing up knowing its mother lied and cheated some man into paying money to her because it had the misfortune of having her for a mother, is supposed to be ok for the child's development? You are right the child needs a FATHER not some man who was MANIPULATED into paying money. The courts must have no jurisdiction over a man in a support case through fraud. It is not the best interest of the child at play here, it is best access to money that is at play here.

[rolling_stone]

Father Shopping is No Way to Establish Paternity. Did you know that in over 30% of tested paternity cases the wrong man is identified as the father? Once the Court has established paternity that man is responsible for paying child support for the next 18 years (or more) -- even if the man is later proven not to be the biological father. This gives a big incentive for a promiscuous female (including married women) to identify the highest earner from among her sexual partners as the father. There is no penalty for a female if she knowingly commits paternity fraud.

http://www.paternityfraud.com/

My comments, deception & fraud are not the basis of a good relationship either as a parent or spouse, paternity fraud is out of control and damages society by promoting fraud. I suggest anyone that would not willingly parent or pay for a child that is not theirs resolve the situation at time of birth with a DNA test...If it doesn't bother you then don't do it...unfortunately love sometimes is blind....

[Eaker]

While I do agree the mother was wrong to do what she did, having her spill her guts to the child would only punish the child and help ease her guilty conscience(sp?).

The kid deserves to know that it is the MOTHER'S fault that "Daddy" left.

[honeygrl]

Well, my comments here pertain to the case stated in this article. Every case is different and the one you are describing doesn't sound that similar to the one we've been discussing in this article. Sounds like you are taking your anger for someone I don't even know out on me AND it sounds like you would be biased on the side of the father no matter what he did because of your bad experience. No matter what you may think, I don't think the courts are always fair in these cases. I've known many men who really were screwed by the system but in the case described in this article I stand by the opinion that it was the child who was screwed this time.

[Yeti]

See, YOU are a real man! We need more like you in this country.

I shouldn't say what I think about women who think men should be suckers and victims.

You talk about the victim not being a real man, but have nothing bad to say about either of the people who made this child and handed it a life of lies.

I'll tell you what, you raise your son to be like the "Real Man" you describe, And I'll be the guy who f#cks his wife while he's at work. Then we'll ask his wife who is the Real Man, and who is a pathetic joke. Let me thank you in advance for raising your sons to support my offspring.

[OneVike]

I wish I could have put it as diplomatically as you did. Thanks for a little insight into the world of a legaly abused innocent ex-husband.

[honeygrl]

"We also need real mothers who stay home and do not park their chidren at day care"

That's one point on which we agree :) Which is why I'm a stay at home mom and will likely homeschool both of mine.

[Dark Knight]

A fraudulent contract used to be unenforceable in courts. In other words, if the mom lied to get child support, according to most other law a court would say to the man paying "We will not attempt to enforce this contract, what you do is your business." If he wants to pay, he can. If he does not, no government entity will force him.

I think I knew a woman like you described. At the time I knew her, I felt terribly when I thought about her nine year old daughter. Now I'm a little clearer why.

DK

[RnMomof7]

It is about time..This ruling is wonderful news for men burdened by supporting other mens children

[honeygrl]

Finally a well thought out disagreement! I now totally see the other side of the issue. :)

[429CJ]

"The only person done dirty is the child. I feel sorry for a child who has been abandoned."

BULLCRAP!!

The man has also been done dirty.

What we really need is a way to punish the woman without punishing the child. I'm not sure how to do that.

I do like the idea someone posted about the man being able to sue the mother for all the child support payments after the child turns 18.

Throw some of the bit*hes in jail also appeals to me.