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Rowan Williams apologises to Freemasons
Telegraph (UK) ^ | 20/04/2003 | Chris Hastings and Elizabeth Day

Posted on 04/22/2003 1:54:17 AM PDT by nickcarraway

The Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, has been forced to apologise to Britain's 330,000 Freemasons after he said that their beliefs were incompatible with Christianity and that he had rejected them from senior posts in his diocese.

Dr Williams has written to Robert Morrow, the Grand Secretary of the United Grand Lodge of England, in an attempt to defuse the row prompted by comments he made last year. In his letter, the Archbishop apologises for the "distress" he caused and discloses that his own father was a member of the Craft.

Freemasons, many of whom are active members of the Church of England, reacted angrily to his disclosure that he "had real misgivings about the compatibility of Masonry and Christian profession" and by his admission that, as Bishop of Monmouth, he had blocked the appointment of Freemasons to senior appointments.

His comments about Freemasons were in a private letter leaked to the media shortly after Downing Street confirmed his appointment as head of the Church of England.

Subsequent attempts by his advisers to defuse the row only caused further offence. A spokesman said the Archbishop was worried about the ritual element of Freemasonry, which has been seen as "satanically inspired".

In his letter of apology, Dr Williams tries to distance himself from his own reported comments. He claims that his views were never meant to be public and were distorted by the media.

He wrote: "I have been sorry to learn of the distress of a considerable number of Freemasons . . . In replying to private correspondence, I had no intention of starting a public debate nor of questioning the good faith and generosity of individual Freemasons and I regret the tone and content of the media coverage."

He added: "The quoted statements about the 'satanic' character of the Masonic ceremonies and other matters did not come from me and do not represent my judgment. Since my late father was a member of the Craft for many years, I have had every opportunity of observing the probity of individual members."

Dr Williams does not, in his letter, deny that he has misgivings about the role of Freemasons within the Church.

He wrote: "Where anxieties exist, however, they are in relation not to Freemasonry but to Christian ministers subscribing to what could be and often is understood [or misunderstood] as a private system of profession and initiation, involving the taking of oaths of loyalty."

He ends his letter by stating that Freemasons' commitment to charity and the community is beyond question.


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To: Cap'n Crunch
And remember that Jobs Daughters are tied to the Masons.
101 posted on 04/22/2003 10:22:34 AM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Cap'n Crunch
**I understand the statue stands on public property. I wonder why those who want the "Stars and Bars" torn down all over the country haven't demanded that this statue be torn down.**

Good question!
102 posted on 04/22/2003 10:24:07 AM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Qwerty
I have Jewish friends who are Masons, very active in the order, and very well-known to be practicing Jews. They do not believe in the triune God of Christianity.

Are you sure about the requirement of believing in the Christian God?

Is it not true that one is actually to believe in the Grand Architect of the Universe which is a sort of invitation to fit the God or god you worship in under that rubric?

And, is it not also true that the Masonic Order also functions (however carefully) in Islamic nations, and various pagan nations again using the Grand Architect of the Universe as the generic substitute for whatever God or god the member worships?

Is it not also true that, in addition to the Roman Catholic ban on mebership in the Masonic order, there are also Protestant denominations such as Missouri Synod and Wisconsin Synod Lutherans that prohibit Masonic membership?

All that having been said, I know a fair number of Masons and have yet to meet a Satan-worshipper among them. The Catholic objection as I understand it is to what is viewed as the religious indifferentism of the order (that it does not really matter what you believe so long as you believe in a Supreme Being of some sort) and certain aspects of the oaths of several degrees.

If the order kept away altogether from religious concepts and were merely a service group of some sort and also avoided some of the more blood-curdling male-bonding mumbo jumbo such as an oath expressing hope that one's heart be torn from one's chest and eaten by jackals if one should violate the secrecy of the order or whatever, there might be less in the way of religious objections to the order.

It is very hard to deny the good work done by the Shriners and the status of many Masons as good family men who are pillars of their communities, however silly the rituals.

103 posted on 04/22/2003 10:36:48 AM PDT by BlackElk (Viva Cristo Rey! Ubi Petrus Ibi Ecclesia (Where Peter Is, There is the Church!))
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To: wideawake
I was raised in a Christian family and my brother, father, grandfather, uncles ... all belonged to the F&AM Lodge. On my 21st birthday I was invited and became a 3rd degree Mason (giving someone the 3rd degree came from the Masons)

The short of it is, the "G" in the symbol stands for God and the Bible is the great Light of the Masonic Order. The square and compass represent elements of life's lessons and are used to express good judgment and work ethic to prospective Masons. There is a Chaplain at every meeting and every meeting is begun and concluded with prayer. The degrees, passwords and such are all based on the stone masons that built the temple for King Salomon.

In my opinion, the reason that the Masons were originally formed was to educate young men in how to become a good citizen, offer fellowship and provide a way to financially protect the members families if a fellow Mason died. Each Lodge has a widows and orphans fund and also helps fellow Mason whom fall upon hard times. The ceremonies were colorful, insightful and full of tradition. Oaths were passed down from generation to generation by memory (some states allow code books) by the more active members meeting with the young men and speaking the oaths until they were remembered.

After joining I was first treated as a peer by both my male family members and other Masons of all ages.
104 posted on 04/22/2003 10:38:05 AM PDT by Diver925
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To: patent
Maybe they haven't been initiated that far up yet. Perhaps I can help them out. Here's a little bit from a 30 degree Mason ceremony.

"The Grand Master approaches a table on which are three skulls. One is adorned with a papal tiara, a second wears a regal crown, and the third is festooned with a laurel wreath.

"The Grand Master stabs the skull bearing the papal tiara, as the candidate repeats: "Down with imposture! Down with crime!....the candidate takes a second oath to "strive unceasingly... for the overthrow of superstition, fanaticism, imposture and intolerance."

The fourth oath taken by a Knight Kadosh focuses again on the "cruel and cowardly Pontiff, who sacrificed to his ambition the illustrious order of those Knights Templar of whom we ar the true successors."

They probably didn't want us to hear that part.

105 posted on 04/22/2003 10:41:46 AM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Cap'n Crunch
The fourth oath taken by a Knight Kadosh focuses again on the "cruel and cowardly Pontiff, who sacrificed to his ambition the illustrious order of those Knights Templar of whom we ar the true successors."

They probably didn't want us to hear that part.

Yech! neither a faithful Catholic nor a faithful Protestant would have any truck with that kind of ceremony.

106 posted on 04/22/2003 10:48:03 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck
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To: Salvation
I remember when Bill Clinton made his famous statement: "That depends on what your definition of 'is' is." When he said that I knew he was a Mason because they do not believe in the strict law, they believe the law is as you interpret it. The same way God, or the "Grand Architect of the Universe" can be anything you interpret. Masons on this website have said that.

Sure enough, they say Bill was once in the Order of De Molay. I heard they had a nice little display honoring him but took it down when his troubles came to light.

Though I don't know why they would do that, from what I understand, and have heard from a guy who was in the Masons, it's OK to sleep around, as long as you don't sleep with another Masons wife.

107 posted on 04/22/2003 10:49:34 AM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Diver925
You got hoodwinked.
108 posted on 04/22/2003 10:51:01 AM PDT by babylonian (Eyes have not seen, nor ears heard, what we can build. - Bill Clinton)
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To: Salvation
In the Albert Pike monument, which you can view on-line, Albert Pike is holding a copy of "Morals and Dogma" under his left arm.

Unbelievable.

They wanted to tear down statues of Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson all over the country but in Washington D.C., on public property, stands a monument to this Confederate General, who was indicted for treason no less. He led a band of indians who committed attrocities against Union soldiers.

109 posted on 04/22/2003 10:55:41 AM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Qwerty
Seriously, I have had two grandfathers who were Masons.. and one was a 33rd Degree. He was a carpenter, the local fire chief, and a devout Christian. Some people just want to see Satanic influence in everything.

And sometimes, it's easier to ignore satanic influences when they are obvious.
110 posted on 04/22/2003 10:57:48 AM PDT by Antoninus (In hoc signo, vinces †)
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To: patent
Why are you so afraid of Masonry? But don't worry, we won't invite you to join.
111 posted on 04/22/2003 10:58:56 AM PDT by AxelPaulsenJr (Get High on Life, Not Drugs)
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To: Diver925
I'm a third degree Mason, as well, although I haven't been involved in the organization actively in quite some time. I move around way too much.

At my first meeting the ravens cicled the meeting hall three times and landed on a crucifix hanging upside down near the alter where we bled ourselves into a golden cup, mingling the blood so we could become bonded as brothers when we drank it.

Then we spent some time discussing our fundraisers for Children's hospitals. Then we prayed about how we could help the academically gifted son of a deceased Mason pay for college. Then we had a sign-up to build a wheelchair ramp at a small local church for one of it's members who had been in a serious automobile accident.

After that kind of stuff was taken care of, we worshipped Satan as we danced around ring of burning Bibles. Then we went home, except for the World Domination Sub-Committee, who had a splinter meeting.

Where do people get their notions?

112 posted on 04/22/2003 11:00:22 AM PDT by TontoKowalski
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To: patent
What is the ritual for becoming a 33rd degree Mason, for example?

I wouldn't know. I am only a 32nd degree. The 33rd degree is reserved for those who have exhbitited great service to the order.

Where did Christ ever say, go into the world and make it Catholic?

113 posted on 04/22/2003 11:00:44 AM PDT by AxelPaulsenJr (Get High on Life, Not Drugs)
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To: American in Israel
I've read that too. People don't realize the significance of this. M
114 posted on 04/22/2003 11:01:15 AM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD is still in control!)
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To: patent
Anti-Masonic posts usually run from, the "I have a relative who is a Mason", or I read some book on Masonry which says that this about Masonry....."

So, as a woman who is skeptical about Freemasonry, how do you suggest I find out more about it (good or bad) without reading books or talking to friends and relatives? All the information I've found from the Freemasons themselves is very vague and recommends talking to someone from The Fraternity to get more information. Yet members of The Fraternity are reluctant, and some even say prohibited, from speaking with me about The Craft.

115 posted on 04/22/2003 11:01:18 AM PDT by FourPeas
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To: Salvation
Oh, Pike was indicted, tried and found guilty of treason.

He was pardoned by President Andrew Johnson... another Mason!

Ain't it great to have friends in high places?

116 posted on 04/22/2003 11:02:13 AM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Cap'n Crunch
Well Pike didn't gore anyone's ox who means anything. The Indians have no reason to oppose him, and he's too obscure to mean anything to the Blacks.
117 posted on 04/22/2003 11:02:53 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck
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To: narses
John Rice also wrote a book about it years ago.
118 posted on 04/22/2003 11:02:56 AM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD is still in control!)
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To: Diver925
As I implied above, I have no objection to Masonry as it is practiced in North America.

As a Catholic, I believe it is incompatible with my Christian witness to take secret oaths of any kind. I don't believe that American Masons take secret oaths for immoral or occult purposes, or that American Masons are bad people.

However, Masonry in Latin America and Europe is a very different phenomenon - a phenomenon which is quite immoral.

119 posted on 04/22/2003 11:04:22 AM PDT by wideawake (Support our troops and their Commander-in-Chief)
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To: patent
That its wrong. You hurl insults, yet you completely fail to address any of the issues. You fail to support all your claims.

Try to change the subject all you like, the fact is that Masonry is incompatible with the First and Second Commandments.

patent +AMDG

You have no idea of what you speak. And would you please address the issue of child molesting priests.

If you would allow priests to marry as the first priests and popes were, you might not have such a big problem in the Catholic church as you do today.

You might consider tackling that problem and not worry about the Masons so much.

120 posted on 04/22/2003 11:06:01 AM PDT by AxelPaulsenJr (Get High on Life, Not Drugs)
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