Hitler’s Control-The lessons of Nazi history

National Review ^ | 5-23-03 | Dave Kopel

[theFIRMbss]

>It was no coincidence that homosexuals were among those who founded the Nazi Party.

It's an example,
too, of what politicians
do to extremists

once the extremists
have served their purpose helping
to achieve power...

[theFIRMbss]

>Hitler had a belief that England would sue for peace. ...

Thanks for the update.
This has always seemed to me
the war's strangest thing.

[ffusco]

The extended-arm ``Sieg Heil'' salute, for example, was a ritual of the Wandervoegel (``Wandering Birds'' or ``Rovers''),

Hardly, Hitler emulated Mussolini who used the Roman salute. ( Ironic that Germany also uses the Roman Eagle on their flag yet they were in fact the barbarians, Some would say they still are.

[f.Christian]

The strength of the Germans become their weakness !

To overcome fear and panic (( effectively use it against your enemy )) in battle ...

they use discipline // loyalty to the extreme which in the beginning and the end eternally blinds ---

dooms them !

This would be called a very fatal character flaw !

Just substitute guilt for fear -- panic ...

and you got the definition of a liberal !

[stainlessbanner]

ping

[tracer]

In a related development:

Miniature Dogs Chase Off Flasher

May 23

BERLIN (Reuters) - A German flasher exposing himself to a woman in a forest was forced to run for cover when she set her three small pug dogs on him, police said on Friday.

Police in the southern town of Straubing said the man, who was about 30, was naked when he surprised the 55-year-old woman with the dogs.

"He had Bermuda shorts and a T-shirt in one hand and his private parts in the other," said police spokesman Klaus Pickel.

The woman spurred the lap dogs into action, one of which bit the man on the calf before he fled through the trees.

"The dog was too small to bite him anywhere else," said Pickel. The man is still on the loose.

[r9etb]

I'm sorry, but this is quite simply a horrible article. Its central premise is laughably wrong. Hitler didn't gain and keep power because of gun control.

The real key -- which Kopel ignores in his rush to confront the wrong issue -- is found in this little nugget:

the judge who gave Hitler a ludicrously short prison sentence after he committed high treason at the Beer Hall Putsch.

Kopel apparently does not consider the possibility that Hitler's short prison term (of which he served only about half) was no mistake. The judge agreed with Hitler. The German people gave agreed with him. They liked what he stood for, gave him dictatorial powers, and were willing to fight and die in large numbers on his behalf.

Gun rights are swell -- but they're pointless if the gun-owners agree with the dictator.

Kopel had better pull his head out and realize that.

[ffusco]

Exactly, The German people bought the whole Nazi Bill of Goods and most happily turned in their Jewish neighbors, said nothing during Kristalnaacht. Millions of Germans were responsible for the Nazi's. "We were just following orders..." they all said. "We didn't know about the Holocaust...."

Barbarians once. Barbarians still- albiet very clever ones.

There is a special place in hell for these folks.

[VOA]

(from the article) the judge who gave Hitler a ludicrously short prison sentence
after he committed high treason at the Beer Hall Putsch.

Also, no mention of the Nazi legislators doing an en-masse walk-out to disrupt
the government...just like those Texas Democrats.

Bet that wasn't the picture the producer of "Hitler: Rise of Evil" wanted the
audience to get!

[aristeides]

In a book I have of Nazi laws (Ingo von Münch, Gesetze des NS-Staates,) very much present is the decree of Nov. 11, 1938 against Jews possessing weapons (Verordnung gegen den Waffenbesitz der Juden vom 11. Nov. 1938, Reichsgesetzblatt I p. 1573). If the private possession of weapons had already essentially been outlawed, this decree would have been unnecessary.

[Jason_b]

bump

[LS]

I'm going to have to read this book, as I said, because the Jewish pro-gun group has referred to this law many times and there is considerable controversy in historical circles if it is a genuine law or an "urban legend." I'll see what Halbrook says.

[YoungHickey]

That is quite possibly the most disturbing picture I have ever seen. I'm not going to sleep for a week. Thanks a lot.

[Ancesthntr]

Thanks for this post.

I know (well) two of the people at the heart of the JPFO project to translate the Weimar and Nazi weapons laws. They also cooperated on a book about 20th century genocides in other countries. They have emphasized to me, time and time again, that the actual danger of gun control is not at the time of enactment, when a generally reasonable government is enacting the controls for some "reasonable" purpose. No, the true danger comes later, when a tyrant acquires sufficient power to get access to the information so freely given to a trusted government and to enforce the laws (usually through emergency decrees).

The 1928 Weimar Republic registration law gave the Nazis, once they assumed power, enough information to disarm most of their actual and potential opponents. Similar laws in other countries gave the Nazis a perfect tool to quash resistance, once the Wehrmacht had defeated the defending armed forces thereby allowing the Gestapo access to the police stations.

The historical lesson is: don't EVER let registration happen, because inevitably some person or group with no morality of any kind or respect for the rule of law will come to power. He or they will use everything at his/their disposal to destroy opposition, and a list of who has which guns and where they live is the most valuable information such people could ever acquire.

I, as someone who lost many relatives in the Shoah (a.k.a. Holocaust) will not allow myself to be disarmed. Ever. Period. I know all too well what happens to Jews who have no guns. One of my wife's close relatives, whom I have had the privilege of getting to know well, survived Bergen-Belsen, and has the tatoo to prove it (though he doesn't talk about it much). He saw his father and brother killed, and lost his whole family. He has lots of guns, including at least one full-auto Uzi, and always has at least one gun with him. I'll take my lessons from him.

If I somehow lose my guns, I WILL acquire more, even if I have to hit someone over the head with a rock, brick or baseball bat (let's see them outlaw those). With regard to what to do with a single gun against a tyrannical regime, the following threads are, shall we say, interesting:

What good can a handgun do against an Army?
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a37519eb3511d.htm

What good can a handgun do against an Army? Thread II
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a38fcb918771f.htm

What good can a handgun do against an Army? Thread III
http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a3b8a3ddb4869.htm

[tet68]

The wandervoegle as far as I have read was NOT a homosexual
organization but was comprised of youth of both sexes and
was made up of many various groups.

Camping and treking was a favorite of German youth, quite a few of which were killed in the Kindermord on the western front WW I.

"I love to go a wandering among the trees so green........"

[armed_in_sydney]

In Mein Kampf he argued the case for Britain to be Germany's natural ally.The Nazi's were also,for an unknown reason,begging for a treaty before they bombed London,but the Brits refused.

Thins would've turned out quite differently if a treaty between the two were signed.

[theFIRMbss]

>Bet that wasn't the picture the producer of "Hitler: Rise of Evil" wanted the audience to get!

Hitler -- and NAZI
power in general -- got
financial support

from lots of strange "friends."
That probably was out of bounds
for a TV film.

[Lessismore]

While I used to believe in the theory that an armed populace was an effective guard against tyranny, I'm rethinking that position. It appears that modern tanks and APCs, helicopter gunships, precision weapons, body armor and small unit tactics have been quite successful in overcoming any armed resistance on the ground in Iraq. I would think that a disorganized rabble with hunting rifles would be even easier to overcome than the Iraqi armed forces.

In fact, it may be that democracy is at an end. The basic premise of democracy is that by counting heads you can more or less approximate the outcome of an armed conflict. For the past couple centuries, the amount of manpower on the battle field was a rough determinant of success.

It now appears that highly skilled, very well trained, and very expensively equipped manpower determine the outcome of battle. This returns us to the situation which prevailed when the armored knight ruled the battlefield.

Therefore, I would expect democracy to decline and something more similar to feudalism to flourish.

[Travis McGee]

I know all too well what happens to Jews who have no guns.

Well, in this case, friends will gladly lend you some to tide you over.

;^)