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The Great Flood and Halloween - - A Christian response to Halloween
Peoples Church of Montreal ^ | October 27, 1997 | Frank Humphrey, Ph.D.

Posted on 10/31/2003 5:15:54 PM PST by editor-surveyor

Prepared by Frank Humphrey, Ph.D. (McGill)

Senior Pastor, Peoples Church of Montreal
revised October 27, 1997

Note the following dates given in the Bible in the flood narrative:

(1) The Commencement of the Flood:

" In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, on that day all the fountains of the great deep were broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened. (Genesis 7:11)

(2) The Ark Comes to Rest:

"...the ark rested in the seventh month, the seventeenth day of the month, on the mountains of Ararat." (Genesis 8:4)

(3) Noah, his wife, their three sons (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) and their three wives along with the animals leave the Ark:

"...in the six hundred and first year...in the second month, on the twenty-seventh day of the month..."

According to the Bible, no matter what our ethnic or national background, we all trace our ancestry back to Noah and his family. We also read in Genesis 11:1-9 that after our ancestors began to grow in numbers, they again tried to rebel against God. At the tower of Babel, the LORD confused their speech so that they began to speak different languages. Thus the human race was dispersed throughout the world. From Genesis 10:1-32 it would appear that this original division of humanity was into a rather small number of different groups.

From this original dispersion of humanity, the world’s population has grown to an estimated 5.8 billion people divided into approximately 11,900 "ethno-linguistic" groups speaking over 6,500 languages. (Patrick Johnstone: Operation World, Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids, 1993 pp.20,22). These figures are open to debate (Johnstone was giving a projected world population for 1995) but are, nevertheless, a good indicator of where we are today. Everything we know about population growth rates indicates this to be a highly reasonable time frame.

Following the dispersion at the Tower of Babel, people retained memories of the Great Flood with its great Day of Death and the new beginning with the salvation of Noah.

It is generally well known that there is a widespread diffusion of the Flood story throughout the various cultures of the world. For further documentation of this see Henry M. Morris Ph.D., and John C.Whitcomb Jr. Th.D. The Genesis Flood: The Biblical Record and its Scientific Implications, Baker Books, Grand Rapids, 1961 especially pp.37-42, 50-51.

What is often overlooked, however, is that there is also the remembrance of the "Day of the Dead" followed by a New Year. This occurs on our calendar at the end of October or the beginning of November. Note that Genesis 7:1 states that it was on the 17th day of the 2nd month that the vast cataclysm of the Flood erupted on the earth. On the Old Testament calendar employed in Genesis (similar to the modern Jewish calendar) the first month of the year runs from mid-September to mid-October (cf. Genesis 26:12 where sowing and reaping take place in the same year, thus indicating an autumn New Year). Therefore, the commencement of the Flood would be the end of October or the beginning of November. Note as well how Genesis 7:21-23 stress the theme of universal death:

(21) And all flesh died that moved upon the earth...(22) So He destroyed all living things which were on the face of the ground...(23) They were destroyed from the earth. Only Noah and those who were with him in the ark remained alive.

Furthermore, the salvation of Noah and those in the Ark is completed by their leaving the Ark and starting anew on the 27th day of the 2nd month of the following year: that is, in November.

"Thus the old world perished in November and a year later a new era commenced in the same month. Both of these facts are indelibly enshrined in the memory of the human race. To many people around the world November brings the Day of the Dead. In a number of ancient and primitive calendars November also brings a New Year at a time which has neither solstice nor equinox nor astronomical event to justify it." (Frederick A. Filby, B.Sc., M.Sc., Ph.D. (University College, London): The Flood Reconsidered, Zondervan, 1977, Fifth Printing, p.106):

The following information on the Day of the Dead and the November New Year is taken from Filby (pp.106-108) to illustrate this widespread phenomenon:

Egypt: "It has long been known that the ship of Isis and the chest or coffin of Osiris which floated on the waters for a year are confused Egyptian recollections of the Flood. Plutarch says the Osiris was shut up in his box and set afloat ‘...on the seventeenth day of the month Athyr, when nights were growing long and the days decreasing.’ [On Isis and Osiris -note that Athyr is a variant of Hathor the goddess who was guardian of the tombs of the dead]... In Plutarch’s time Athyr did in fact coincide with October-November."

Assyria and Babylon: "In ancient Assyria the ceremonies for the souls of the dead were in the month Arahsamna, which is Marcheswan [=the month of Heshvan on the Jewish calendar, which is mid-October to mid-November]. In Arahsamna the Sun God became Lord of the Land of the Dead [S. Langdon: Babylonian Menologies and Semitic Calendars, London 1934 p.36]. The month was held sacred to the-rain-and-thunder-god, while in Babylon Marduk was called, in connection with this month, ‘Lord of the Deep’ and also ‘Lord of Abundance who causes plenty of rain to fall’."

India: "The Hindu ‘Durga’-festival of the dead-was originally connected with their New Year which commenced in November."

Iran: "The Persians commenced their New Year in November in a month which was named Mordad-month, i.e. the month of the angel of death."

Australia: "[Aboriginal Australians} at this time of the year paint white stripes on their legs and arms to resemble skeletons."

Society Islands (French Polynesia): "...the inhabitants...pray for the spirits of departed ancestors at the end of their New Year celebration in November."

Peru: "In Peru the [Inca] New Year commenced in November and the festival called Ayamarka - carrying of a corpse - concluded with placing food and drink on graves."

Mexico: "The Mexican [Aztecs], too, kept the Day of the Dead at the same time of the year."

Europe: "November 2 is All Souls’ Day - the Day of the Dead. In France it is Le Jour des Morts - Christianized now for centuries but still at heart the old Day of the Dead when flowers are taken to the tombs... Early Anglo-Saxons called November Blood-Month...." Celtic inhabitants of Britain "...kept their New Year in November. The Manx mummers sang, ‘Tonight is New Year’s Night, Hogunnaa’ - on Halloween, October 31. Further, November 1 (Old Style) was kept as New Year’s Day in the Isle of Man until relatively recent times. Frazer sees the ancient Irish custom of kindling fires on Halloween, or the eve of Samhain as showing that November 1 was New Year’s Day. The Celtic festival of Samhain or Samhagen held in November is connected with the Cornish New Year festival of Allantide and the Irish Geimredh (E. Sykes: Dictionary of Non-Classical Mythology London, 1961). In Wales and Scotland early November is the time for ghosts to be remembered. Samhain is connected in legend with Avalon, the Kingdom of the Dead, to which Arthur was taken across the waters of a lake." [As late as 1818 G.S.Faber cited Davies’ Mythology of the British Druids saying, ‘Bardic songs are yet extant in which is celebrated the return of the mythological Arthur with his seven companions from their voyage over a boundless ocean, beneath the waves of which all the rest of mankind had been overwhelmed.’ " (Filby p.125)] { Presumably the name of Arthur replaced the name of the original hero of the story.}

Remember that Noah traveled over a boundless ocean with seven companions!

Implications:

The legends cited above are found all over the world in cultures radically distinct from one another. Note that for those in the northern hemisphere the Day of the Dead and its New Year are in the middle of the fall as winter is approaching. Those in the southern hemisphere are in the middle of spring awaiting the warmth of summer. And yet they all have in common this remembrance of death and a new beginning at the end of October and the beginning of November. Furthermore they are often connected with tales of a great flood.

This is strong circumstantial evidence for the historicity of the Flood of Noah. The idea that Halloween is just the remnant of a druid celebration (the High Sabbath of the occult calendar) is misleading. It is, instead, a reminder both of God’s judgment on human rebellion and His offer of deliverance to those who put their trust in His mercy.

Furthermore, in the Flood narrative of Genesis we see a foreshadowing of two subsequent acts of Judgment and Salvation: The Exodus and the Resurrection of Christ.

Note that in Genesis 8:4 it states that "...the ark rested in the seventh month, the seventeenth day of the month, on the mountains of Ararat." This of course is based on the Genesis or civil calendar. Years later, God told Moses that in light of the events of the Passover (both judgment on Pharaoh’s Egypt and salvation for the people of Israel) the New Year would now be reckoned from the month of Abib (later known by the name Nisan) [Exodus 12:2; 13:4]. That corresponds to the seventh month of the Genesis calendar. Therefore the ark rested on the seventeenth day of the Passover month. According to Exodus, chapter 12, the Passover lambs were slain on the 14th of the month. The Israelites, and the Egyptians who joined them, then left the land of Egypt. They encamped by the Red Sea and were pursued by Pharaoh’s army. By the grace of God they passed through the waters. Pharaoh’s army perished beneath the waves and by the 17th of the month, the people were at rest, having come through their own version of the Flood.

The New Testament says that Christ is our Passover (1Corinthians 5:7). He died for our sins. Because of His sacrifice, the wrath of God "passes over" all who put their trust in the risen Saviour. John the Baptist said of Jesus,

"Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!"(John1:29)

When did Christ die and rise again? He celebrated the Passover with His disciples on the 14th of Nisan (Luke 22:14). He was crucified on the 15th of Nisan. He rose triumphant over sin, death, hell and Satan on the third day - the 17th of Nisan - the same day of the calendar that the ark rested and the same day that Israel was delivered. Christ did not go above the waters of death but went down into them. He delivered not just eight souls but an innumerable host.

Halloween also reminds us of the words of Jesus Christ concerning His second coming:

"But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch, therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming." (Matthew 24:37-42).

Note on a possible mechanism for the Cataclysm:

A current geophysical model of rapid catastrophic plate tectonics with runaway subduction developed by geophysicist John Baumgardner, Ph.D.(UCLA) at Los Alamos National Laboratory in New Mexico seems to be a good explanation for what happened at the time of Noah. Ongoing research is being funded in part by NASA as one of their nine "grand challenge projects" in their High Performance Computing and Communication initiative.

In an interview Baumgardner briefly summarizes this view:

Q: We understand you’ve shown that as these floating blocks of rocks [the ‘plates’] push down into the material below, things get hotter, so the ‘slipperyness’ increases and there’s a runaway effect. The faster they sink the hotter they get, so the faster they can sink.

JB: Yes - rock that represents the ocean floor is colder, and therefore denser than the rock below it and so can sink into the earth’s interior. And the properties of the rock inside the earth, especially at the high temperatures that exist there, make it possible for the colder rock from the earth’s surface to peel away and sink in a runaway manner down through the mantle - very rapidly.

Q: So this happens on your computer model all by itself, from the laws of science - over a short time-scale, not millions of years?

JB: That’s correct. Exactly how long is something I’m working to refine. But it seems that once this sinking of the pre-Flood ocean floor (in a conveyor-belt-like fashion down into the earth, pulling things apart behind it) starts, it is not a slow process spanning millions of years - it’s almost certain that it runs to completion and recycles all of the existing floor in a few weeks or months.

Q: You’re part of a team of top creation scientists which is developing a model of catastrophic plate tectonics based on this mechanism, which believes the continents broke up (from a single landmass) during, not after the Flood as some have proposed.

JB: Yes. There is compelling evidence from the fossil bearing sediments on the continents that the breakup occurred during the time these sediments were being deposited. We are convinced that this ‘continental sprint’ as it’s been called, was during the time of the Flood, and part of the mechanism for it.


TOPICS: General Discusssion; History; Moral Issues; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: deathculture; flood; halloween; origins
Interesting how it is celebrated on the same day in all cultures, dating back to ancient times. It does seem to tie together well.
1 posted on 10/31/2003 5:15:54 PM PST by editor-surveyor
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To: 185JHP; 2sheep; Alex Murphy; asformeandformyhouse; Augustine_Was_Calvinist; BibChr; bonfire; ...
Tonight the Death Culture celebrates their "day."
2 posted on 10/31/2003 5:19:59 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: editor-surveyor

Happy Halloween!!!


3 posted on 10/31/2003 5:31:50 PM PST by Calpernia (Innocence seldom utters outraged shrieks. Guilt does.)
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To: editor-surveyor
My sentiments exactly.
4 posted on 10/31/2003 5:40:42 PM PST by Ladysmith (Low-carbing works!! (223.0 (-37.6)))
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To: editor-surveyor
Actually, today is also Reformation Day.

It is also the pre-cursor to All Saints Day.

Boo.
5 posted on 10/31/2003 5:40:45 PM PST by rwfromkansas ("Men stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up as if nothing had happened." Churchill)
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To: editor-surveyor
Today a little kid said "I am a ninja turtle"

Today some little kids got to understand pretending.

All the history has valid points, there is no reason we can't take out the dark side and move this day to some innocent kidsafe fun.

(besides its candy binge day :-) )
6 posted on 10/31/2003 5:57:39 PM PST by longtermmemmory (Vote!)
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To: rwfromkansas
Actually, today is also Reformation Day.

Be sure to go and see the new (unadvertized) movie,..."Luther",...

NOW showing at a few theaters near you,...check each theater's own 'time schedule' listings.

Don't miss this movie......a great new history adventure!

(Romans 10:17)

enjoy!

7 posted on 10/31/2003 6:27:45 PM PST by maestro
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To: editor-surveyor

Boo!  BWaHaHaHa!

8 posted on 10/31/2003 6:28:03 PM PST by RJayneJ
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To: longtermmemmory
(besides its candy binge day :-)


9 posted on 10/31/2003 6:30:56 PM PST by SpookBrat (The devil is a liberal)
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To: maestro
I'm looking forward to seeing Luther!
10 posted on 10/31/2003 6:38:14 PM PST by TaxRelief (Ask me about the connection between Socialism, Communism, Drug Warlords and Vodka.)
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To: longtermmemmory
"there is no reason we can't take out the dark side..."

If there is no reason, then why don't we? There must be some reason...

11 posted on 10/31/2003 6:41:39 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: editor-surveyor
Great stuff, Ed. What's your understanding of the beings that "looked on the daughters of men" and had offspring by them? Were they confined somewhere by our Lord, after the flood?
12 posted on 10/31/2003 6:43:04 PM PST by 185JHP ( Not much quag. Even less mire.)
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To: maestro
Have you seen it?

Is it factual?

13 posted on 10/31/2003 6:43:23 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: 185JHP
What's your understanding of the beings that "looked on the daughters of men"

Since they are called "sons of God" they had to be individually created beings, not men, so they had to be angels as Jude said.

Have you read The Book of Enoch?

14 posted on 10/31/2003 6:51:22 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: editor-surveyor
Thanks. Haven't read it.
15 posted on 10/31/2003 7:22:16 PM PST by 185JHP ( Not much quag. Even less mire.)
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To: editor-surveyor
Good answer and reason why Christ says that one of the signs of His return will be a repeat of those days of "Noe".

So guess we should be expecting some visitors in the future.
16 posted on 10/31/2003 7:42:40 PM PST by Just mythoughts
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To: editor-surveyor
When did Christ die and rise again? He celebrated the Passover with His disciples on the 14th of Nisan (Luke 22:14). He was crucified on the 15th of Nisan. He rose triumphant over sin, death, hell and Satan on the third day - the 17th of Nisan - the same day of the calendar that the ark rested and the same day that Israel was delivered.

Interesting stuff, however Messiah was crucified on the 14 of Nisan, not the 15th, as all Passover lambs were. He had to be removed from the cross before the 15th, which began the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

17 posted on 10/31/2003 9:05:45 PM PST by Zack Attack
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To: editor-surveyor
Have you seen it?

YES!

Is it factual?

YES!

See it as soon as possible,....it will be 'yanked' soon.

Sit very close to a speaker if you can,.....conspiracy talk on screen is done at a whisper.

Really enjoy this excellent film!

m

18 posted on 10/31/2003 9:10:41 PM PST by maestro
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To: Zack Attack
Your#17..... Interesting stuff, however Messiah was crucified on the 14 of Nisan, not the 15th, as all Passover lambs were. He had to be removed from the cross before the 15th, which began the Feast of Unleavened Bread.

Yep,.......Jesus of Nazareth,....."Messiah-God".....was crucified on WEDNESDAY (not on Friday).

Shalom ev Christ (Messiah)......Romans 5:1

(Resting ev Him)

Romans 10:17

19 posted on 10/31/2003 9:25:10 PM PST by maestro
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To: editor-surveyor
Those zany pagans celebrated rituals for each season. Winter and Summer solstice, Vernal and Autumnal equinox.

They also had rituals for marking the halfway point of each season.

Midway through winter they celebrated something called Imbolc. We call it Ground Hog Day.

In the spring, April 30 Was known as Beltane and also Walpurgisnacht.

Midway through summer, it was called Lammas and midway through Autumn it was called Samhain, now known as Hallowe'en.

They're only points in the ever changing seasons.

I guess any culture can make out of them whatever it will.

But as long as the kids just try to extort candy from me, I'm not going to give it any further thought.

If they start to demand a blood sacrifice from me for Satan, that's something else again.

Their are, currently,too many real devils to contend with. They take the form of lawyers, judges, and politicians.

20 posted on 10/31/2003 9:35:19 PM PST by isrul
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To: maestro
Interesting perspective on the mechanism of the flood. I hadn't considered the possibility of large tectonis plates in the ocean sinking, giving cause to high heat at the ocean floor, thereby vaporizing large volumes of water, which after rising may have distributed themselves worldwide in the atmosphere to the point of releasing a 40 day rain.

It might also foreshadow the burning of the chaff. Perhaps the next time there are major volcanic eruptions on the continents, producing destruction by fire.

Those prophecies always seemed to be possible via a nuclear holocaust, but the volcanism scenario seems very plausible.
21 posted on 11/01/2003 2:28:16 AM PST by Cvengr (0:^))
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To: editor-surveyor
It is a complete non day for us and I like it that way. My mom usually has a bunch of kids come around her house but last night just one! I guess it was too cooolld!!! It was about 23.

MCD
22 posted on 11/01/2003 2:53:46 AM PST by MSCASEY
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To: longtermmemmory
I agree. Yes, there is a bad history. Part of the deal is the Catholic church tended to cover up bad holidays with its own.

Therefore, if we are going to knock Halloween, we must also knock Easter and Christmas due to their histories.

I hope your kids had fun trick-or-treating and enjoying life last night.

I will never coop my kids up inside because of the history of a holiday, only if I have a problem with the way it CURRENTLY is presented. And I have no problem with Halloween.
23 posted on 11/01/2003 6:32:38 AM PST by rwfromkansas ("Men stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up as if nothing had happened." Churchill)
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To: Cvengr
Those prophecies always seemed to be possible via a nuclear holocaust, but the volcanism scenario seems very plausible.

Yep,........and the releasing of violent demons held therein.....during the Great Tribulation horrors.

(Romans 10:17)

Maranatha!!

24 posted on 11/01/2003 7:24:42 AM PST by maestro
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To: Cvengr; TrueBeliever9; Prodigal Daughter; 2sheep; Jeremiah Jr; editor-surveyor
I hadn't considered the possibility of large tectonis plates in the ocean sinking, giving cause to high heat at the ocean floor, thereby vaporizing large volumes of water, which after rising may have distributed themselves worldwide in the atmosphere to the point of releasing a 40 day rain.

Come to think of it, the "fountains of the great deep" may have been boiling hot springs, such as that which exist at the colliding of these plates:

 

Deildartunguhver

25 posted on 11/01/2003 8:55:54 AM PST by Thinkin' Gal (<541>)
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To: Thinkin' Gal
"fountains of the great deep" may have been boiling hot springs, such as that which exist at the colliding of these plates

The plates were likely created at the beginning of the flood, when the crust of the earth ruptured, releasing the water below under great pressure world wide simultaneously. The curtain of water gushing up would have reached 10 miles or more in the air with that much pressure being applied all at once.

26 posted on 11/01/2003 2:38:30 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: editor-surveyor
I should have put the emphasis on boiling. Death by boiling water, now that would have really steamed the antediluvians. :-]
27 posted on 11/01/2003 3:24:38 PM PST by Thinkin' Gal (<541>)
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To: Thinkin' Gal
"Death by boiling water, now that would have really steamed the antediluvians. :-]"

I see your point. Kind of like a big Lobster Feed with nobody to enjoy it!

28 posted on 11/01/2003 3:39:00 PM PST by editor-surveyor ( . Best policy RE: Environmentalists, - ZERO TOLERANCE !!)
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To: editor-surveyor
I wouldn't say the water in liquid form was pushed up 10 miles, rather some interesting thermodynamic phenomenon may have arisen. A saturated atmosphere simply awaiting a catalyst to dump. There might even be some arguments posed to support glacier formation by this mechanism.
29 posted on 11/01/2003 6:16:25 PM PST by Cvengr (0:^))
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