The "Passion" According to Isaiah

CBS News ^ | March 1st.2004 | Efraim Goldstein

[ambrose]

CBN News, not CBS

[missyme]

Thank You..my mistake

[missyme]

ISAIAH PREDICTED THAT THE SERVANT… 700 YEARS LATER, Y'SHUA…
would be disfigured by suffering
(52:14; 53:2-3) was struck, spat on and mocked (Mark 15:17-19)
would come from humble beginnings
(53:2) grew up in Nazareth, a city with a very (53:2) poor reputation; and not where the Messiah was expected to come from (Luke 2:39-40, 51)
would be rejected by many
(53:1,3) while on the cross, was mocked, blasphemed and reviled, even by those who were crucified with him (Matthew 27:39-44)
would bear our sins and suffer in our place (53:4-6,11) "…himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed." (1 Peter 2:24)
would heal many (53:4-5) healed many (Matthew 8:16-17)
voluntarily took our punishment upon himself (53:6-7) said, "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep" (John 10:11)
remained silent during his suffering (53:7) did not defend himself to Herod, Pontius Pilate or the Sanhedrin (Matthew 26:62-64; 27:11-14; Luke 23:9)
would die (53:8,12) died on a cross (Mark 15:37; John 19:33-34)
would be buried with a rich man (53:9) was buried in the tomb of Joseph of Arimathea, a rich man (Matthew 27:57-60)
would not remain dead, but see his seed, prolong his days and be exalted (53:10-11) rose from the dead three days after the crucifixion and still lives today and millions of people see themselves as his spiritual seed (Matthew 28:1-10)

[AAABEST]

Isaiah is breathtaking, it makes my head tingle every time I read it. As someone with a scientific mind, the prophecy in the bible really gets to me.

People have said that the case for Jesus can't be made logically, but that's exactly what does it for me. The impossible, mind blowing logic.

I remember some scientific study was done regarding Christ actually fulfilling all of the prophecy regarding him, the odds were astronomical. Numerically impossible in fact.

The prophesy continued and continues:

Matthew 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world, for a testimony to all nations: and then shall the consummation come.

Christians the world over adore their Messiah, the one who changed everything, including how we count time. That in itself is miraculous.

It's enough to make you sing His praises and lift His blessed name to the highest.

[ambrose]

People have said that the case for Jesus can't be made logically, but that's exactly what does it for me. The impossible, mind blowing logic.

Really?

Since the men writing the New Testament already had the benefit of knowing the prophecies of the Tanakh, it isn't surprising that their chosen Messiah is written to have fulfilled the prophecies.

You believe that the NT was the inspired word of God, not of men simply making things up as they went along. That's a matter of Faith, not logic.

[Dog Gone]

There's no question that this passage in Isaiah is referring to a literal messiah. To argue otherwise is to dispute whether the Jews believed in an upcoming messiah at all, which they most certainly did.

While I believe this, it still does not help me understand the logic behind the Plan of Salvation. And it's not because it hasn't been explained to me. I went to private, parochial schools until I began post-graduate studies.

You've tried to give me a better explanation, but it either doesn't make sense or hasn't sunk into my thick head.

Let me make an analogy that I hope you don't think is sacreligious or flippant, because that's not how I intend it in the slightest.

I'm the Grandad and my grandkids do some bad stuff. I'm willing to forgive them, but in order for me to really forgive them, they have to round up some animals and stab them. Then, my own son has to be tortured to death.

After that, being sorry is enough.

I can certainly understand the wisdom of God in the form of Jesus coming to earth to lead an example and to teach, but transferred bloodshed, where you can put your sins on an animal or another human, or why you'd even have to, are still puzzle to me.

And I hope you don't say that it's because I've never had a real zeal for religion or a personal relationship with Christ or God. I started college as a theology major, but I couldn't get my questions answered.

[missyme]

I think you bring up some god questions, but I think since G-d gave us free will that brought up how G-d could relate to us.
In the creation of Man, G-d created everything good, the world, the animals, the enviroment was pure, since we made a choice to "Sin" G-d has been IMO letting us live by a lesson a lesson we could understand, so that we could enable ourselves to make Peace with G-d,and ask G-d for sincere forgiveness for not loving him like we should, or honoring his word and commandments. This I think leads us to a right relationship with G-d so we may be part of his divine kingdom....

[juzcuz]

"Why is the omission so striking? We've left out a portion from our own prophets, ostensibly because of what Christians think about it."
----

Interesting! This reminds me of Pharoah ordering Moses' name stricken from Egypt's stoned carved history.

[PetroniusMaximus]

Ping for later response.

[PetroniusMaximus]

***After that, being sorry is enough.... but transferred bloodshed, where you can put your sins on an animal or another human, or why you'd even have to, are still puzzle to me.***

God is alien to you...

[DouglasKC]

I'm the Grandad and my grandkids do some bad stuff. I'm willing to forgive them, but in order for me to really forgive them, they have to round up some animals and stab them. Then, my own son has to be tortured to death. After that, being sorry is enough.

I had the exact same questions. Here's how I visualize it:

God (the father) lies outside of our physical universe. The nature of God, the essence of God, is that we lose our ability to communicate with him when our thoughts turn to what has been defined as "sin" (i.e. the ten commandments).

In order to re-establish communications, God (the father) had to engineer a solution where he could commune with us.

The solution was that he manfiested in the flesh a part of the Godhead, Christ, the logos in which he *could* have constant commune provided that the logos in the flesh never sinned.

While Christ was alive, this channel of communication stayed open. When Christ died, this channel remained open because there was no longer any sin or possibility that any sin could close it because it was no longer attached to flesh. Instead it is attached to the spirt of Christ, which cannot sin.

(Joh 10:9 "I am the door; if anyone enters through Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out, and find pasture. )

When we accept the indwelling of God's spirit, the spirit of Christ, then we have access to this channel through the spirit of Christ. Note that we can still "block" it with sin, or we can reject the spirit, but it can never be closed by us because it is not of us.

(Joh 15:5 "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, he bears much fruit; for apart from Me you have the power to do nothing. )

That is WHY Jesus the man had to live and die.

The concept of sacrifice is of course related. God set up a system that emphasized sacrifice so that when the time came to accept God's spirit, we would understand what was involved. What is involved is sacrificing our own selves, our own thoughts, ideas and sins, and embracing the mind of God which we have access to thorugh Christ.

The sacrifice of animals also foretold of course the sacrifice of the physical Christ.

Being sorry isn't enough. Repentence is what is required. When we attempt to live our lives (which invariably is sin) then we need to repent and remember that the channel to God thorugh Christ is only open as long as we are letting Christ lead our lives. In response, our very naturei is transformed day by day to become more like the nature of Christ.

This may just sound like senseless ranting, but I think the problem with theology is that they never try to relate it to real world scenarios...it always seems so distant and ethereral.

[ambrose]

You believe that the OT was the inspired word of God, not of men simply making things up as they went along. That's a matter of Faith, not logic. So take your anti-Christ attitude and just buzz off!

You have no idea what I believe.

So take your anti-10 Commandments attitude and just buzz off!

[ambrose]

My post was neither nasty nor antagonistic and you are engaging in hysterics.

[ambrose]

"We"..

Who is we?

And tell me what that "cheap shot" was.

[LCPI]

Always remember that God created this universe and he alone makes the rules. Perhaps a greater understanding will be derived from adopting the point of view of an Israelite living during the time of Moses. Specifically study the Book of Leviticus. All the rules of sacrifice are introduced and many good studies of this book will help you understand God's plan for salvation. One which I recommend is Allan Ross's "Holiness is the Lord".

[alpha-8-25-02]

read hebrews9
the blood of the Lamb is the last covenant