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POPE APPROVES BARRING GAY SEMINARIANS
EWTN ^ | September 19, 2005

Posted on 09/19/2005 3:35:59 PM PDT by NYer

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To: TotusTuus; GSlob
Can we use chastity belts?

Since I don't know who "we" is, I'll give a comrehensive answer.

Celibate priests cannot use chastity belts for the fundamental reason that they have no wife to put it on.

Laity may use chastity belts if the husband is traveling on business, with the intent to mitigate the anxiety about the domestic situation. Chastity belts are not to be used when abstinence is dictated by the rigors of natural family planning, because they do not prevent the spilling of the seed.

It occurs to me that some couples might use a chastity belt as a prop in prelude or interlude of a marital act. This is not the belt's intended usage. However, so long as the marital act culminates in a procreative and unitive way, I do not see a problem with the practice.

101 posted on 09/20/2005 11:44:09 AM PDT by annalex
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To: dsc
You quote me: "those (men who suffer from SSAD) that have been ordained and by the grace of God have remained celibate."

Then you said: My, you will keep insisting that such things happen, won't you?

Yes. My 83-old spiritual director, who lives in poverty following the unattenuated rule of the Passionists told me so. He's a man of virtue, a venerable priest, a saintly confessor, a holy man, and a spiritual father of many other bishops, priests, deacons, nuns, laymen and women, and even Protestant ministers. I choose to believe him. You, believe what you will, and may the Lord have mercy on both our souls.

-Theo

102 posted on 09/20/2005 6:07:13 PM PDT by Teófilo (Visit Vivificat! - http://www.vivificat.org)
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To: DoirVue
May I ask are you Catholic?

Yes; however, my being a faithful Catholic who readily submits my intellect to the absolute truth the Church teaches is not really relevant to the discussion.

Here is some relevant information: -some links to documents and some excerpts:

Catholic documents and teaching on subject of homosexuality:

  1. The Truth and Meaning of Human Sexuality - Guidelines for Education within the Family

    104. A particular problem that can appear during the process of sexual maturation is homosexuality, which is also spreading more and more in urbanized societies. This phenomenon must be presented with balanced judgement, in the light of the documents of the Church. Young people need to be helped to distinguish between the concepts of what is normal and abnormal, between subjective guilt and objective disorder, avoiding what would arouse hostility. On the other hand, the structural and complementary orientation of sexuality must be well clarified in relation to marriage, procreation and Christian chastity. "Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained". A distinction must be made between a tendency that can be innate and acts of homosexuality that "are intrinsically disordered" and contrary to Natural Law.

    Especially when the practice of homosexual acts has not become a habit, many cases can benefit from appropriate therapy. In any case, persons in this situation must be accepted with respect, dignity and delicacy, and all forms of unjust discrimination must be avoided. If parents notice the appearance of this tendency or of related behaviour in their children, during childhood or adolescence, they should seek help from expert qualified persons in order to obtain all possible assistance.

    For most homosexual persons, this condition constitutes a trial. "They must be accepted with respect, compassion and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfil God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition". "Homosexual persons are called to chastity".

  2. Persona Humana - Declaration on Certain Questions Concerning Sexual Ethics

    VIII At the present time there are those who, basing themselves on observations in the psychological order, have begun to judge indulgently, and even to excuse completely, homosexual relations between certain people. This they do in opposition to the constant teaching of the Magisterium and to the moral sense of the Christian people.

    A distinction is drawn, and it seems with some reason, between homosexuals whose tendency comes from a false education, from a lack of normal sexual development, from habit, from bad example, or from other similar causes, and is transitory or at least not incurable; and homosexuals who are definitively such because of some kind of innate instinct or a pathological constitution judged to be incurable.

    In regard to this second category of subjects, some people conclude that their tendency is so natural that it justifies in their case homosexual relations within a sincere communion of life and love analogous to marriage, in so far as such homosexuals feel incapable of enduring a solitary life.

    In the pastoral field, these homosexuals must certainly be treated with understanding and sustained in the hope of overcoming their personal difficulties and their inability to fit into society. Their culpability will be judged with prudence. But no pastoral method can be employed which would give moral justification to these acts on the grounds that they would be consonant with the condition of such people. For according to the objective moral order, homosexual relations are acts which lack an essential and indispensable finality. In Sacred Scripture they are condemned as a serious depravity and even presented as the sad consequence of rejecting God. This judgment of Scripture does not of course permit us to conclude that all those who suffer from this anomaly are personally responsible for it, but it does attest to the fact that homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered and can in no case be approved of.

  3. Letter to the Bishops of the Catholic Church on the Pastoral Care of Homosexual Persons

    10. It is deplorable that homosexual persons have been and are the object of violent malice in speech or in action. Such treatment deserves condemnation from the Church's pastors wherever it occurs. It reveals a kind of disregard for others which endangers the most fundamental principles of a healthy society. The intrinsic dignity of each person must always be respected in word, in action and in law.

    But the proper reaction to crimes committed against homosexual persons should not be to claim that the homosexual condition is not disordered. When such a claim is made and when homosexual activity is consequently condoned, or when civil legislation is introduced to protect behavior to which no one has any conceivable right, neither the Church nor society at large should be surprised when other distorted notions and practices gain ground, and irrational and violent reactions increase.

    11. It has been argued that the homosexual orientation in certain cases is not the result of deliberate choice; and so the homosexual person would then have no choice but to behave in a homosexual fashion. Lacking freedom, such a person, even if engaged in homosexual activity, would not be culpable.

    Here, the Church's wise moral tradition is necessary since it warns against generalizations in judging individual cases. In fact, circumstances may exist, or may have existed in the past, which would reduce or remove the culpability of the individual in a given instance; or other circumstances may increase it. What is at all costs to be avoided is the unfounded and demeaning assumption that the sexual behaviour of homosexual persons is always and totally compulsive and therefore inculpable. What is essential is that the fundamental liberty which characterizes the human person and gives him his dignity be recognized as belonging to the homosexual person as well. As in every conversion from evil, the abandonment of homosexual activity will require a profound collaboration of the individual with God's liberating grace.

  4. Some Considerations Concerning the Response to Legislative Proposals on Non-discrimination of Homosexual Persons

    II. Applications

    10. "Sexual orientation" does not constitute a quality comparable to race, ethnic background, etc. in respect to non-discrimination. Unlike these, homosexual orientation is an objective disorder (cf. "Letter," No. 3) and evokes moral concern.

    11. There are areas in which it is not unjust discrimination to take sexual orientation into account, for example, in the placement of children for adoption or foster care, in employment of teachers or athletic coaches, and in military recruitment.

    13. Including "homosexual orientation" among the considerations on the basis of which it is illegal to discriminate can easily lead to regarding homosexuality as a positive source of human rights, for example, in respect to so-called affirmative action or preferential treatment in hiring practices. This is all the more deleterious since there is no right to homosexuality (cf. No. 10) which therefore should not form the basis for judicial claims. The passage from the recognition of homosexuality as a factor on which basis it is illegal to discriminate can easily lead, if not automatically, to the legislative protection and promotion of homosexuality. A person's homosexuality would be invoked in opposition to alleged discrimination, and thus the exercise of rights would be defended precisely via the affirmation of the homosexual condition instead of in terms of a violation of basic human rights.

  5. Third World Meeting of Families: Conclusions of the Pastoral Theological Congress

    Mention should also be made of recent attempts to legalize adoptions by homosexual persons, and this must be strongly rejected. It is obvious that this is not the situation for authentic up-bringing and personalizing growth. “The bond between two men or two women cannot constitute a real family, nor much less can the right be attributed to a union of this kind to adopt children without a family”. With regard to foster care and adoption, the great principle to be applied is always the child’s higher interests which much prevail over other considerations.

  6. Fourth World Meeting of Families: Conclusions of the Pastoral Theological Congress

    We reaffirm the rights and dignity of all children. They should never be neglected and abandoned on the streets. They should be protected, especially when threatened by exploitation through prostitution, pornography, child-labor, drug trafficking, homosexual adoption and immoral "sex education". A new threat to children is posed by the misuse of the Internet, when this intrudes into family life and undermines the rights and duties of parents.

    Children are the "crown of marriage", the real wealth of humanity. The natural place for their education is the family. It is here, in the community of life and love, that they are formed as members of Christ's Church. It is here that, honoring and loving their parents, they can enrich the lives of all members of the wider family.

  7. Considerations Regarding Proposals To Give Legal Recognition To Unions Between Homosexual Persons

    4. There are absolutely no grounds for considering homosexual unions to be in any way similar or even remotely analogous to God's plan for marriage and family. Marriage is holy, while homosexual acts go against the natural moral law. Homosexual acts “close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved”.

    7. Homosexual unions are totally lacking in the biological and anthropological elements of marriage and family which would be the basis, on the level of reason, for granting them legal recognition. Such unions are not able to contribute in a proper way to the procreation and survival of the human race. The possibility of using recently discovered methods of artificial reproduction, beyond involving a grave lack of respect for human dignity, does nothing to alter this inadequacy.

    Homosexual unions are also totally lacking in the conjugal dimension, which represents the human and ordered form of sexuality. Sexual relations are human when and insofar as they express and promote the mutual assistance of the sexes in marriage and are open to the transmission of new life.

    As experience has shown, the absence of sexual complementarity in these unions creates obstacles in the normal development of children who would be placed in the care of such persons. They would be deprived of the experience of either fatherhood or motherhood. Allowing children to be adopted by persons living in such unions would actually mean doing violence to these children, in the sense that their condition of dependency would be used to place them in an environment that is not conducive to their full human development. This is gravely immoral and in open contradiction to the principle, recognized also in the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, that the best interests of the child, as the weaker and more vulnerable party, are to be the paramount consideration in every case.

  8. Religiosorum Institutio

    30. Those To Be Excluded; Practical Directives

    Advantage to religious vows and ordination should be barred to those who are afflicted with evil tendencies to homosexuality or pederasty, since for them the common life and the priestly ministry would constitute serious dangers.


103 posted on 09/20/2005 6:08:20 PM PDT by DBeers (†)
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To: NYer
The ACLU Fundamentalists are going to have a tizzy fit over this!! Probably filing their nails as we speak for the Crucifixion. What a great Pope!

Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters

104 posted on 09/20/2005 6:13:26 PM PDT by bray (Pray for the Freedom of the Iraqis from Islam)
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To: Teófilo

"He's a man of virtue, a venerable priest, a saintly confessor"

It's been my experience that very good men are often the last to see perfidy in others.

How often I have seen good men manipulated into unknowing complicity in evil by trusted, but untrustworthy, subordinates.

If he as as you describe, I'm sure he believes what he has told you. However, I'd no more take his word for that than I would if he told me the Earth was flat.


105 posted on 09/20/2005 6:25:51 PM PDT by dsc
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To: bray
What a great Pope!

It takes tremendous courage of conviction to step forward with such a signed document. I am reminded of his homily, while still Cardinal, delivered at the 'Pro Eligendo' Mass, just before the Conclave was convened to select the next pope.

* * * * *

How many winds of doctrine have we known in recent decades, how many ideological currents, how many ways of thinking. The small boat of the thought of many Christians has often been tossed about by these waves - flung from one extreme to another: from Marxism to liberalism, even to libertinism; from collectivism to radical individualism; from atheism to a vague religious mysticism; from agnosticism to syncretism and so forth. Every day new sects spring up, and what St Paul says about human deception and the trickery that strives to entice people into error (cf. Eph 4: 14) comes true.

Today, having a clear faith based on the Creed of the Church is often labeled as fundamentalism. Whereas relativism, that is, letting oneself be "tossed here and there, carried about by every wind of doctrine", seems the only attitude that can cope with modern times. We are building a dictatorship of relativism that does not recognize anything as definitive and whose ultimate goal consists solely of one's own ego and desires.

FULL TEXT

106 posted on 09/20/2005 7:41:37 PM PDT by NYer
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To: NYer
Thanks, finally a Pope who is not afraid to speak the truth. Moral Relativism and Liberalism have destroyed the Church by watering down the message and this is a great first step.

Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighters

107 posted on 09/20/2005 7:52:55 PM PDT by bray (Pray for the Freedom of the Iraqis from Islam)
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To: NYer

good news bumpus ad summum


108 posted on 09/20/2005 8:31:54 PM PDT by Dajjal
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