Posted on 11/27/2005 11:07:28 AM PST by Incorrigible
The Rev. Mariano Gargiulo, now an Episcopal priest in the Newark Archdiocese involved in a long-term relationship, said he believes an expected Vatican edict this week banning most gay men from entering the seminary also will force many priests from the clergy.
"It will push many of them away," Gargiulo said of the document, expected to be released Tuesday. "The Vatican ... says that homosexuality is intrinsically disordered, and how many times can you be told that before you start to say, 'Hey, maybe I should go somewhere else.'"
A report released by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops last year said a "homoerotic culture" and a "gay subculture" took root at the nation's Catholic seminaries in the 1960s...
Newark's Episcopal bishop at the time, John Shelby Spong, urged Gargiulo to meet with his Catholic archbishop before leaving Catholic ministry.
Gargiulo said McCarrick told him he wanted him back as a priest, but that he would have to be celibate. Gargiulo told McCarrick he would not return.
Gargiulo was then shocked, he said, by a letter he received three years later from McCarrick's replacement, John J. Myers, in response to a letter from Gargiulo saying he had decided to become an Episcopal priest.
Myers' letter told Gargiulo he was classified as a schismatic and thus automatically excommunicated. (James Goodness, a spokesman for Myers, said the excommunication had nothing to do with Gargiulio's sexual orientation.)
"He invited (my partner) up, and he had us on each side of him, and he grabbed both our hands. He said, 'I want to thank you for being an example in the church of what a gay couple can be and how a loving gay couple can be part of the church community.'"
(Excerpt) Read more at nj.com ...
Isn't that special...
McCarrick/Myers comparison bump!
Let not the door...
I think it's repulsive.
Though I beleive gay celibates should be allowed to be priests (molestors are not celibate), this guy is being intellectually dishonest. How the heck is he in any sense, not schismatic? He made a choice, let him live with the consequences.
They still do that? Wow!
I was a little confused about who was grabbing these guys' hands and gushing - reading the article reveals that it was none other than "Jack Croneberger, who had recently become Newark's Episcopal bishop."
Personally, I think it's great that they are just leaving voluntarily. But the one thing that really puzzles me is that all these years, they have obviously never been bothered in the least by the fact that they were in conflict with Church teaching - on so many levels, it's hard to know where to begin. Talk about lousy catechetics and lousy seminary formation...
Excellent Post.
When I saw the title my first response was, "And?". They're not gone yet... what's the holdup?
It's time to burn off the chaff.
later pingout.
Of course... they haven't done it enough, that's why you didn't know. Had it been nipped in the bud...
Late is better than never.
Until I read the original article, I thought that quote came from Myers. Actually, it was stated by the Episcopal bishop who took this renegade in.
Attention gay priests!
Become Episcopalians and you'll never have to leave your buddy's behind!
..."The Vatican ... says that homosexuality is intrinsically disordered, and how many times can you be told that before you start to say, 'Hey, maybe I should go somewhere else.'"...
Or maybe you should say, "Hey, maybe they are right."
Become Episcopalians and you'll never have to leave your buddy's behind.
You do know that can be taken in different ways. I do hope the imagery leaves my mind very soon.
They're not gone yet... >>
they're going to stay so they can benefit from the retirement program. If they leave now, they get no place to live and if they stay they can retire in the diocesan retirement home.
He meant it that way. It's an old joke but still very funny. Here's another: "He who laughs last.....did not get the joke"
Just keep FReepin'. Some of the funniest humor on the net is right here.
That's actually the truth - I think a lot of them will stay around simply because it's been an easy living all these years and they want to make sure they get all the bennies they can. Although judging by the number who seem to have condos and get-aways where they take their boy-toys, it sounds as though they have been diligently feathering their nests throughout their careers, and may not exactly be depending on the old priests' home when they retire!
Somehow, I think these people have gotten the idea that they are in the majority. There aren't "many" queer priests in the Church. It just seems like it because they are so obvious. Even if every one of them took a pro-queer priest or nun under each arm as they went out the door, they wouldn't do as much harm as they have done by staying. It can't happen a minute too soon. Good riddance.
Why read any more after this..... Isn't/wasn't Bishop Spong (Spawn of Hell) from Newark too?
Yeah, I was in a bit of a rush when originally posting. I usually try to make my excerpts a little more congruous.
Yep. It was Bishop Sprong who brought him over.
I doubt that there are as "many" as they like to imply, but even if 50% of the priests are homosexuals (the high number sometimes offered by some of them), we'd be better off without them. Good priests won't come in until the bad ones can no longer portray themselves as the majority or even look like they constitute a significant number.
I suspect that the priesthood, as it is now, is very attractive to gay men, because it gives them instant respect, giving them a whole squadron of little old ladies to gush over them, it's not very hard work (the way they do it), they are now fairly well paid, it requires nothing out of them in terms of discipline, very little in terms of studies (none of the hard stuff like philosophy - just silly "therapeutic" courses), etc. Homosexual men are often considered not to have matured, and the priesthood as it is now is unfortunately tailor made for them.
Time to bring back demanding studies, prayer, discipline, making hospital visits at 3:00 a.m., etc. There are no doubt some who still do this, but they seem to be the exception.
Not in those dioceses run by homosexual bishops. Cardinal Mahony has already stated that he will ignore this directive. In certain dioceses (like Albany), the already paltry priesthood would practically disappear, were all the homosexual priests to leave.
This directive will be well received, embraced and implemented by solid bishops. As for those of us mired in the other dioceses, we will have to wait for our bishops to retire and pray that they are replaced by solidly orthodox bishops who are young enough to clean up the mess and rebuild the Church. I pray I live to see this.
In contrast, Archbishop Myers is viewed as more conservative and orthodox, especially in New Jersey and in comparison to when Cardinal McCarrick ran the Newark archdioceses. I view the quotes from the former Fr. Gargiulo as a dig at Myers.
Is that you, Cardinal Mahoney?
I thought "forcing" unrepentant sinners away from the priesthood was the whole idea of the edict? This guy suggests that it will have exactly that effect. How is this a bad thing?
"Gargiulo said McCarrick told him he wanted him back as a priest, but that he would have to be celibate."
Then he leaves. Good for the Bishop to tell him that.
Dang! It just kinda happened.
Excellent. Faster please.
I knew a guy that I taught with at the college level who got kicked out of the Jesuits back in the 70s for writing homoerotic poetry about boys, then publishing it under his own name.
Suspect he might not have been kicked out yet if he hadn't written the poetry.
If only the vatican could draft some document stating that any priest defending the homosexual lifestyle or professing that homosexual tendancies are natural and acceptable were automatically schismatic and excommunicated.
You are blessed, and I know there are many - we had a "retired" priest, Fr. Jim, in my former parish who was in his 80's and did everything from celebrating one of the regular parish Sunday masses to hearing confessions several hours a week, to visting the sick in really remote hospitals and going to the mission parish for the migrant laborers. He has Parkinson's, on top of that. But he is a truly holy man, and I think he has affected us all profoundly.
I just hope the new generation coming up produces men like him, and I think chances will be greatly improved if they kick out these time-wasting self-serving queens and go back to the formation and spirituality that gave us men like Fr. Jim.
Many people hope that will be next. They're starting with the seminarians because it is a good point of approach - and it looks like some of the homosexual priests are getting the message and looking around for greener pastures. But it wouldn't surprise me if something comes out censuring priests and BISHOPS for defending and promoting the homosexual lifestyle. IMHO, the bishops are the real problem.
Catholic priest are to be involved in a "long-term relationship" of a spiritual kind.
'Hey, maybe I should go somewhere else.'
Very perceptive dude. Episcopalians are welcome to you. You and your friends have done enough damage to our church.
As Lawrence Welk might have said: "Adios, au revoir, auf wiedersehen!"
We''ll TRY to survive somehow!
Boy ......... that's a fact. The "Caption this ....." threads are a riot.
"I beleive gay celibates"
There is not, never has been, nor ever will be any such thing as a "gay celibate." You might as well say that you believe hobbits should be allowed to be priests.
"it sounds as though they have been diligently feathering their nests throughout their careers, and may not exactly be depending on the old priests' home when they retire!"
Hey, those trips to the boy-brothels of Asia aren't cheap, you know.
I'm not loading the image, what is it?
"If only the vatican could draft some document stating that any priest defending the homosexual lifestyle or professing that homosexual tendancies are natural and acceptable were automatically schismatic and excommunicated."
They'd just ignore it.
I'd like to see the Holy Father and a squad of the Swiss Guardsmarch into the Taj Mahoney unannounced, klonk Mahoney over the head with his crozier, rip his vestments off him, frog-march him in his underwear out the door and into the street, and fling him into the gutter -- vewy woughly.
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