Posted on 09/22/2007 6:09:42 AM PDT by NYer
That is correct and, according to Scripture, He does so through the priesthood that He commissioned.
as the Father sent me, so I send you - John 20:21"If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven. If you retain the sins of any, they are retained."
John 20:23
How do we know this to be true? As freeper Quix commented above:
BECAUSE
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. – Matthew 6:9-15
The efficacy of private confession and absolution has always been recognized by the Lutheran Church; as with most secular writers employed by the MSM, Mr. Leonard has no familiarity with his subject matter.
In Orthodoxy you confess face to face with your priest. During confession my priest always asks if you have forgiven everyone from your heart, and if you haven’t he will often instruct you to go make things right.
I guess if it makes someone feel better to tell a third party, or to write their sins down and shred them, go for it. Just so they know that isn't what brings forgiveness from God.
This is a lovely quote about contrition. Yes, when you harm someone, you should recognize the wrong you have committed and apologize to that individual. That begins the healing process. BUT - we are all made in the image of God and are members of the Body of Christ. When you inflict harm on one member, other members also suffer. To intentionally harm another person is a SIN that leaves an indelible mark on the soul. It is for that reason that our Lord instituted the Sacrament of Penance.
In this Sacrament, the priest acts 'on behalf' of Christ. Jesus is there waiting for the penitent to confess their sins. Through this Sacrament, our Lord delivers sanctifying grace. Our Lord was very clear about this!
In John 20:21, before He grants them the authority to forgive sins, Jesus says to the apostles, "as the Father sent me, so I send you." As Christ was sent by the Father to forgive sins, so Christ sends the apostles and their successors forgive sins. In the very next line of the Scripture, John 20:22, the Lord "breathes" on the apostles, and then gives them the power to forgive and retain sins. The only other moment in Scripture where God breathes on man is in Gen. 2:7, when the Lord "breathes" divine life into man. When this happens, a significant transformation takes place.
So, what is this transformation? In John 20:23, Jesus says, "If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven. If you retain the sins of any, they are retained." In order for the apostles to exercise this gift of forgiving sins, the penitents must orally confess their sins to them because the apostles are not mind readers. The text makes this very clear.
You may confess your sins to others but they have not received the gift to forgive sins. Why is this confusing to so many? The Scriptural passages are clear and direct.
Well, duh! Ya sounded like a sanctified version of Retired Army on this thread http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1901601/posts?page=8#8
Well, Dear Heart,
clearly those very . . . wedded . . . to the RC edifice vs others of us will likely continue to disagree on what
SUFFICIENTLY CLEAR
precisely means in a number of instances.
But I thought that the verse on forgiveness of sins by Christ was rather starkly clear and emphatic.
AMEN! AMEN!
PRAISE GOD FOR THAT!
The point of my posting the Lord's Prayer is simply this, that every time we speak it we are asking God our Father to forgive us exactly as we forgive others.
And He will.
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. – Matthew 6:9-15
For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive [them], and ye shall have [them].
And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses. - Mark 11:22-26
To God be the glory!
I disagree.
I believe there is Scriptural support for the
PRIESTHOOD OF ALL BELIEVERS pronouncing forgiveness of sins AS LED OF HOLY SPIRIT TO DO SO.
What precisely God does with such probably depends on the factors involved FROM HIS PERSPECTIVE.
But in my construction on reality, obediently and Scripturally pronouncing forgiveness over a given individual at least “spiritually legally” so to speak—frees God’s hand a bit more in terms of redemptive options therefrom.
But this is my construction on reality from my reading of SCripture and the leading of Holy Spirit in my life.
I was rather startled in the last 20 years when a prophet type that I respected above average voluntarily asserted to me once that God had told him that I understood more about forgiveness than anyone else in the world. And IIRC, I hadn’t said anything to him about my construction on such forgiveness realities.
That notion still boggles my mind. But it was comforting that evidently I’m not off the wall from God’s perspective.
But it’s not a doctrine that I try to spread, per se. I merely share what my construction on the Scriptural reality and how I’ve felt led of Holy Spirit to relate to others regarding forgiveness. If folks’ faith is not affirmed by Holy Spirit accordingly, then they certainly should not speak in those directions. Whatsoever is not of faith is sin, as Scripture declares.
I do know from tons of experience that Believers in right standing with God and led of His Spirit in Biblical ways regarding pronouncing forgiveness can faciliate greatly changed lives; release from bondage and even profoundly miraculous physical healings as well.
All this, I might add, without a blip of a bow to ANY magicsterical—including the RC’s. GOD IS GOD AND ALWAYS WILL BE GOD.
HE IS FAR TO LARGE, BIG, AWESOME to be constrained by ANY magicsterical and their tidy boxed constructions on how HE “ought” to act according to THEIR sensibilities, traditions etc. The pharisees of Jesus’ earthly pathed days should have taught ALL Christians plenty about THAT sort of thing!
Gwarsh, blush.
Thanks. I think! LOL.
AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!
I heartily agree.
Though for clarification and greater accuracy . . . the church I mentioned that practiced such overt routine demonstrations of confession and forgiveness in all their meetings and relationships was in San Diego about 1973 or so.
My current one is a rather low key and conventional generica evangelical church that happens to be pastored by a former A of G assistant pastor and son of an A of G pastor.
Most of my convictions about forgiveness have come straight from Scripture and Holy Spirit’s patient teaching through many hard knocks and no few long dark nights of the soul. Sometimes, I think I’m still quite far from graduating from that school of hard knocks.
Indeed: TO GOD BE THE GLORY.
Truly, I suspect we all struggle with forgiveness in our walk with the Lord.
This is what has worked the best for me (so far) ...
I begin my final prayer each day by forgiving every offense of any type and source --- and then asking God’s help to utterly forget any incidents of discomfort which might cause me to remember and “pick it up again.” Then I ask for forgiveness - all before making any petitions.
I do not want to have any charge to level at any one for any thing - even though there are most likely others accusing me before Him.
I also pray never to hear those accusations lest I remember an incident and mount a defense. Instead, I ask only to hear His determination on everything. And it will be Truth and Good and Just and Right – because He is.
To God be the glory!
p.s. People have told me that I should not forget and/or pray for God’s help to forget because remembering would prevent an incident from recurring. But I cannot afford the luxury of remembering any of it, returning fire is knee-jerk reaction.
THANKS TONS.
Indeed you are wise and correct in such.
Much of that has been my practice for some time, too.
But you are helping me move more wholesale into essentially the same details. Praise God.
And I thank you for sharing your testimony, dear brother in Christ! Whenever we assemble in His Name (I'm sure whether in person or not) He is with us and He helps us.
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