Posted on 10/24/2007 8:18:14 AM PDT by topcat54
An article is circulating around the Internet that carries the title “Israel Warns World War III May be Biblical War of Gog and Magog.” It is written by Ezra HaLevi and was published in Israel National News.1 The article begins with the following prophetic claims, not unlike so many evangelical and fundamentalist end-time assurances about the end:
US President George W. Bush said a nuclear Iran would mean World War III. Israeli newscasts featured Gog & Magog maps of the likely alignment of nations in that potential conflict. Channel 2 and Channel 10 TV showed the world map, sketching the basic alignment of the two opposing axes in a coming world war, in a manner evoking associations of the Gog and Magog prophecy for many viewers. The prophecy of Gog and Magog refers to a great world war centered on the Holy Land and Jerusalem and first appears in the book of Yechezkel (Ezekiel). On one side were Israel, the United States, Britain, France and Germany. On the other were Iran, Russia, China, Syria and North Korea.
M. R. DeHaan, writing in 1951, identified “the sign of Gog and Magog” to be one of the “three most outstanding signs of the coming of Christ.”2 In 1972, Carl Johnson wrote Prophecy Made Plain for Times Like These.3 His chapter on “When Russia Invades the Middle East” includes a lengthy quotation from a message Jack Van Impe gave at Canton Baptist Temple in Canton, Ohio, sometime in 1969. Like so many who claim to know what’s on the prophetic horizon, Van Impe made his case for an imminent war with Russia on what the newspapers of 1969 were reporting. This war was so close, he charged, “that the stage is being set for what could explode into World War III at any moment.”4 In 1971, Ronald Reagan, then governor of California, followed a similar prophetic script:
Ezekiel tells us that Gog, the nation that will lead all of the other powers of darkness against Israel, will come out of the north. Biblical scholars have been saying for generations that Gog must be Russia. What other powerful nation is to the north of Israel? None. But it didn’t seem to make sense before the Russian revolution, when Russia was a Christian country. Now it does, now that Russia has become Cummunistic and atheistic, now that Russia has set itself against God. Now it fits the description of Gog perfectly.5
This familiar interpretation of Ezekiel 38 and 39 has been written about, talked about, and repeated so often that it has become an unquestioned tenet of prophetic orthodoxy. The question is, does the Bible teach it?
Ezekiel 38 and 39 has been interpreted in various ways over the centuries. The most popular view is to see the prophecy as a depiction of a future battle that includes an alliance of nations led by modern-day Russia in an attack on Israel. Chuck Missler writes in his book Prophecy 20/20 that “the apparent use of nuclear weapons has made this passage [Ezekiel 38 and 39] appear remarkably timely, and some suspect that it may be on our horizon.”6 Prophecy writers for nearly 2000 years have made similar claims, of course without the reference to “nuclear weapons.” In the fourth and fifth centuries, Gog was thought to refer to the Goths and Moors. In the seventh century, it was the Huns. By the eighth century, the Islamic empire was making a name for itself, so it was a logical candidate. By the tenth century, the Hungarians briefly replaced Islam. But by the sixteenth century, the Turks and Saracens seemed to fit the Gog and Magog profile with the Papacy thrown in for added prophetic juice. In the seventeenth century, Spain and Rome were the end-time bad guys.7 In the nineteenth century, Napoleon was Gog leading the forces of Magog-France.8 For most of the twentieth century, Communist Russia was the logical pick with its military aspirations, its atheistic founding, and its designation of being “far north” of Israel. In a word, identifying Gog and Magog with a specific nation or group of nations in the past is legion.9
As the above brief study shows, when the headlines change, the interpretation of the Bible changes. The failed interpretive history of Ezekiel 38 and 39 is prime evidence that modern-day prophecy writers are not “profiling the future through the lens of Scripture” but through the ever-changing headlines of the evening news.10
A lot has to be read into the Bible in order to make Ezekiel 38 and 39 fit modern-day military realities that include jet planes, “missiles,” and “atomic and explosive” weaponry. Those who claim to interpret the Bible literally have a problem on their hands.
The battle in Ezekiel 38 and 39 is clearly an ancient one or at least one fought with ancient weapons. All the soldiers are riding horses (38:4, 15; 39:20). These horse soldiers are “wielding swords” (38:4), carrying “bows and arrows, war clubs and spears” (39:3, 9). The weapons are made of wood (39:10), and it is these abandoned weapons that serve as fuel for “seven years” (39:9). Tim LaHaye describes a highly technological future when the antichrist rises to power to rule the world. “A wave of technological innovation is sweeping the planet. . . . The future wave has already begun. We cannot stop it. . . . [T]he Antichrist will use some of this technology to control the world.”11 How does this assessment of the near prophetic future square with a supposed tribulation period when Israelites “take wood from the field” and “gather firewood from the forests”? (39:10). There is nothing in the context that would lead the reader to conclude that horses, war clubs, swords, bows and arrows, and spears mean anything other than horses, war clubs, swords, bows and arrows, and spears. And what is the Russian air force after? Gold, silver, cattle, and goods (38:12–13). In what modern war can anyone remember armies going after cattle? How much cattle does Israel have? Certainly not enough to feed the Russians! The latest claim is that Israel will discover oil, and this is what will attract the nations to Israel. Where in the Bible do we find this claim?12
Chuck Missler attempts to get around the description of ancient war implements by claiming that the various Hebrew words “is simply 2,500-year-old language that could be describing a mechanized force.”13 The word translated “horse,” “actually means leaper” that “can also mean bird, or even chariot-rider.” He tells us that the Hebrew word translated “sword” “has become a generic term for any weapon or destroying instrument.” In a similar way, “arrow” means “piercer” and “is occasionally used for thunderbolt” and could be “translated today as a missile.” We are to believe that “‘Bow’ is what launches the [missile].”14 Is Missler trying to tell us that when Ezekiel wrote “bow” and “arrow” he really meant a launching pad for a missile? To follow his interpretive methodology requires us to believe that the meaning of the Bible has been inaccessible to the people of God for nearly 2500 years. Missler, like nearly all end-time prognosticators, breaks all the rules of exegesis.
2. M. R. DeHaan, Signs of the Times and other Prophetic Messages (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 1951), 74.
3. Carl G. Johnson, Prophecy Made Plain for Times Like These (Chicago: Moody Press, 1972).
4. Jack Van Impe, The Coming War With Russia (Old Time Gospel Hour Press, n.d.). The quotation is taken from a message that Van Impe gave at Canton Baptist Temple, Canton, Ohio. The talk was recorded and available on a as an LP. Quoted in Johnson, Prophecy Made Plain for Times Like These, 82–83.
5. From an address that Ronald Reagan gave at a dinner with California legislators in 1971. Quoted in Paul Boyer, When Time Shall Be No More: Prophecy Belief in Modern Culture (Cambridge, MA: The Belknap Press of Harvard University, 1992), 162.
6. Chuck Missler, Prophecy 20/20: Profiling the Future Through the Lens of Scripture (Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson, 2006), 155.
7. Francis X. Gumerlock, The Day and the Hour: Christianity’s Perennial Fascination with Predicting the End of the World (Powder Springs, GA: American Vision, 2000), 68.
8. T.R., “Commentary on Ezekiel’s Prophecy of Gog and Magog,” The Gentleman’s Magazine (October 1816), 307.
9. Wikipedia
10. Gary DeMar, Islam and Russia in Prophecy: The Problem of Interpreting the Bible Through the Lens of History (Powder Springs, GA: American Vision, 2005).
11. Tim LaHaye, “The Coming Wave,” in Ed Hindson and Lee Fredrickson, Future Wave: End Times, Prophecy, and the Technological Explosion (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 2001), 7–8.
12. This claim will be discussed in a later chapter.
13. Missler, Prophecy 20/20, 165.
14. Missler, Prophecy 20/20, 165.
Quite clearly lots of folks picked the wrong year...But it's interesting to read why they came to those conclusions...At least they did not say that Jesus has come already...
Of course we know that no one knows the day nor the hour of Jesus' return...BUT, we are supposed to know the 'times' and the season...
But just think, if He doesn't come back for another 1000 years or so, what will it be like??? If we have world wide nuclear war, there won't be much to come back to...The earth could actually be thrown out of it's orbit and we'd all be dead anyway...
Some scientists say that by 2050, the rate of the population will grow exponentially to the point that there won't be enough room (or food) on the earth for everyone...
Jesus needs to come back NOW, while He's got something to come back to...
“So do not worry about tomorrow; for tomorrow will care for itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."
Article 2 years old - but at end it lists some apostate churches teaching end times demonic lie
No Understanding of Bible Prophecy
World Watch Daily ^ | 12/29/2005 | Bill Koenig
Note from Bill:
Today there are approximately 100 million American church members who have very little to no understanding of Bible prophecy. These church members are from replacement theology churches that don’t teach Bible prophecy and who look at prophetic scriptures as allegorical and not literal. Consequently, they do not understand the importance of Israel to the God of Israel or God’s redemptive plan for Israel and the nations. (To Read “The Error of Replacement Theology” - By Clarence H. Wagner Jr. click here.)
These church members also have no understanding of the biblical significance of what is transpiring today in Israel, Russia, China, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Turkey, and in other Middle East nations. They are also not aware of the significance of the formation of the European Union, new ID technologies and much more.
I have shared the biblical significance of our times with some of these people and almost all of them can’t process the information mentally, emotionally, and spiritually. And due to fear they do not want to hear more. They also have no point of reference in which to start if they had interest.
The good news is those who understand Bible prophecy are fully aware of the significance of Israel, God’s time clock, and are watching the times with great interest and expectancy.
We will continue to post articles under Update and Commentary and under the Error Exposed category under Page Two News to inform you of the official church positions, their recent statements calling on Israel to leave her land, and writings and statements that speak against pro-Israel Christians.
Below is a list of the 25 largest churches in America. The churches that are highlighted in bold are confirmed replacement theology churches. We are still attempting to confirm a few of the smaller church positions.
The Church
U.S. Membership Denominational Ranking: Largest 25 Denominations/Communions —2004 Yearbook of American and Canadian Churches
1. The Roman Catholic Church - 66,407,105 2. Southern Baptist Convention - 16, 427, 736 3. The United Methodist Church - 8,251,042 4. The Church of God in Christ - 5,499,875 5. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints - 5,410,544 6. Evangelical Lutheran Church in America - 5,038,006 7. National Baptist Convention, U.S.A., Inc. - 5,000,000 8. National Baptist Convention of America, Inc. - 3,500,000 9. Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) - 3,407,329 10. Assemblies of God - 2,687,366 11. The Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod - 2,512,714 12. African Methodist Episcopal Church - 2,500,000 13. National Missionary Baptist Convention of America - 2,500,000 14. Progressive National Baptist Convention Inc. - 2,500,000 15. The Episcopal Church - 2,333,628 16. Churches of Christ, Corsicana, Texas - 1,500,000 17. Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America - 1,500,000 18. Pentecostal Assemblies of the World, Inc. - 1,500,000 19. American Baptist Churches in the U.S.A. - 1,484,291 20. African Methodist Episcopal Zion Church - 1,430,795 21. United Church of Christ - 1,330,985 22. Baptist Bible Fellowship International - 1,200,000 23. Christian Churches and Churches of Christ, Joplin, Mo. - 1,071,616 24. Jehovah’s Witnesses - 1,022,397 25. Church of God, Cleveland, Tenn., - 944,857
tHANKS.
REF MARKER
The economy of FDR, the revolutionary era economy, and the economy of the antebellum south would all signify an style and ordering of an era.
Of course, Paul's Ephesians 1:
3 Blessed [is] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who did bless us in every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 according as He did choose us in him before the foundation of the world, for our being holy and unblemished before Him, in love, 5 having foreordained us to the adoption of sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, 6to the praise of the glory of His grace, in which He did make us accepted in the beloved, 7 in whom we have the redemption through his blood, the remission of the trespasses,
according to the riches of His grace, 8 in which He did abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, 9 having made known to us the secret of His will, according to His good pleasure, that He purposed in Himself, 10 in regard to the dispensation (ECONOMY) of the fulness of the times, to bring into one the whole in the Christ, both the things in the heavens, and the things upon the earth -- in him;
11 in whom also we did obtain an inheritance, being foreordained according to the purpose of Him who the all things is working according to the counsel of His will, 12 for our being to the praise of His glory, [even] those who did first hope in the Christ, 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth -- the good news of your salvation -- in whom also having believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of the promise, 14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, to the redemption of the acquired possession, to the praise of His glory.
A few months before Kaduri died at the age of 108, he surprised his followers when he told them that he met the Messiah. Kaduri gave a message in his synagogue on Yom Kippur, the Day of Atonement, teaching how to recognize the Messiah. He also mentioned that the Messiah would appear to Israel after Ariel Sharon’s death. (The former prime minister is still in a coma after suffering a massive stroke more than a year ago.)
In the consummated new heavens and new earth there will be no sin, suffering, or death.
Even the futurist millennium still has all three.
Only a theologian who fundamentally misunderstands the nature of God’s covenant with His people and who continues to divide the people of God along racial lines would make such a preposterous statement.
“IIRC, I contributed toward the Temple when I was in Israel in 1973.”
The physical temple was destroyed in 70 AD (and there’s no mention of a third, future temple in the NT) for very good reason: Christ is the Temple.
So, hotshot . . . could you please explain to our readers . . .
just
HOW
is the Anti-Christ going to set up his image
INSIDE OF CHRIST THE MESSIAH???
Thought I’d heard of everything. Sheesh.
Are you talking about the likes of Hal Lindsey and Chuck Smith?
Jesus needs to come back NOW, while He's got something to come back to... Sez who?
Are you going top let pagan science and scientists dictate you view of the future? Such pessimistic notions are almost always wrong. Man is incredibly adaptable. God has made him that way.
The fact is there are no conditions on the earth that require God’s immediate, apocalyptic intervention. Chicken Little’s sky has been falling for numerous generations of Christians who wish to be dazzled by current events.
Oh, and where in Christ’s physical body
is THE HOLY OF HOLIES for the Anti-Christ’s image to be set up in?
His head? Naw.
His heart? Naw.
His lungs? Naw.
His little pinky toe? Naw.
Quite mystifying.
Mostly from watching too much TBN (Jack Van Impe, Grant Jeffrey, John Hagee, Hal Lindsey [until he got the boot]) and not enough Bible reading and thinking for themselves.
For this reason, they *will* build a Third Temple, just as described in 2nd Thess and Revelation 11.
Many don’t believe this. Well, just wait and see. It’s coming ...
= = =
Good points.
On the other hand . . . with different fingers . . . I’m beginning to conclude that . . . a lot of folks have some sort of spiritual blindness or willful blindness or strange incapacity to avoid seeing the noses on their faces . . .
This is not rocket science. Some Scriptures are a bit obscure but many on these issues are startlingly clear—especially when lined up with today’s news stories.
Shessh.
It’s God’s Word.
He’s not impressed with rubber Bible mangling of it!
and not enough Bible reading and thinking for themselves.
= = =
That’s my explanation for the perspective your side seems to hold.
“..there’s no mention of a third, future temple in the NT..”
***
2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
==> 2Thes 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
==> Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, whoso readeth, let him understand: (Daniel 9:27)
OK, fair enough. But there is not anything to suggest the division of time into many distinct "dispensations". All Ephesians is affirming is that when Christ came into the world everything changed as far as heaven and earth being one kingdom under the Kingship of Jesus. Paul was a herald of this new kingdom reality, and an administered of the gospel message.
in regard to the dispensation (ECONOMY) of the fulness of the times, to bring into one the whole in the Christ, both the things in the heavens, and the things upon the earth -- in him;Christians properly speak of BC and AD. Those are the only "dispensations" known in the Bible. Before Christ came most of the world lived in utter darkness. The gospel was not found anywhere outside of a small insignificant nation of people living in the middle east. Today, the gospel has gone out into all the world. People from every nation, tribe, and tongue worship before the true God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Ironically, one of the most closed and hardened societies to this good news is that nation which claims the covenant name of "Israel". What was once the light of the gentiles now lies in darkness. Only as more and more gentiles nations are converted to Christ will jealousy provoke that ancient people of faith in the Messiah of Israel.
All this will be accomplished without some great apocalyptic tribulation ala the futurist fantasy. Faithful gospel preaching and spiritual worship is what is required to bring men to God. "Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God."
==> Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, whoso readeth, let him understand:
= = =
I suppose the Calvinists would insist that some are destined to not understand . . . They sure prove prime candidates on that score, in any case.
It’s still mystifying that so much clear Scripture gets so easily mangled all completely out of whack way beyond imagining.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.