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The Truth regarding Anti-Mormon nonsense!
6/2008 | Frank Fantasia

Posted on 05/31/2008 11:59:25 AM PDT by Frank Fantasia

Parts of my article found at: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/840079/posts

(disproof-inserts added by Bro. Frank Fantasia)

"And so it was said that his name would be known for both good and evil."

--D&C

I am going to be rather bold here. I am both a proud and active member of the LDS Church and of the Fraternity of Freemasory. I have also had the privalege to study under a 9th generation Witch who is also a friend of mine. Becoming an author, I am also a University Student in Theology, History, Literature, Creative Writing, Fantasy, Philosophy and Poetry. I have been a practitioner of the ancient Japanese mystic warrior art of Ninjutsu for over a decade, a tradition handed down to me by my late master.

Many Anti-Mormons complain about Joseph Smith's family involvement in the Salem witch trials of 1692, when Joseph Smith Sr.'s great-grandfather Samuel Smith and Samuel's father-in-law John Gould testified against Mary Easty and Sarah Wilds respectively. The testimony of these relatives of Joseph Smith hanged these girls as witches. A belief in witchcraft was passed through the Smith generations.

Just because Orlando Saunders, whom Mormon apologists consider to be one of the most favorable witnesses to Joseph Smith's character, said in an interview that both Joe Smith Sr. and Jr. believed in witchcraft (Frederic G. Mather, "The Early Days of Mormonism," Lippincott's Magazine 26, Aug. 1880, p. 198).

Who cares! There is nothing wrong with real witchcraft; The Craft is the understanding and usage of universal energies; working with it, as long as it is used for good, just as the Tribes and prophets of God did in the days of old. People realy do need to get a grip on the matter and research what real magick (as it is correctly spelt) and witchcraft is all about. Magick is life force energy; it flows through all living things and elements etc, it makes up the universe. One can follow Christ and be a practitioner of magick. The Gnostic Approach is the correct and oldest form of Christianity; Joseph Smith knew this.

A true Witches Coven is made of twelve disciples and one Master; Christ had twelve disciples and was their master - the 13th. He followed the magickal way and understood the craft laid down by His Father in heaven. Bellow is proof of the way, and how at times these things became corrupted, thus, giving witchcraft a bad name...

In Romans it talks of those who followed the True Craft and Gnosis of God; they bastardized the gnostic truths to suit themselves...

Romans 1:20-21, King James Bible)

"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshiped and served creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Anti-Mormons also complain about Mormon General Authority B. H. Roberts admitting that Joseph Smith's ancestors believed in warlocks and witches, but he asserted that such belief was normal in Smith's day, "It may be admitted that some of them believed in fortune telling, in warlocks and witches. . . . To be credulous in such things was to be normal people" (B. H. Roberts, A Comprehensive History of the Church, vol. 1, pp. 26-27).

But so what is the big deal! there is nothing wrong with that. Like B.H. Roberts said, it was quit common. There is nothing wrong with witchcraft, as long as it is used for good; the Smith family were righteous in doing so.

Fayette Lapham, who spoke with the Smiths at length to find out firsthand about Mormonism, said, "This Joseph Smith, Senior, we soon learned, from his own lips, was a firm believer in witchcraft and other supernatural things; and had brought up his family in the same belief" (Historical Magazine, 7 May 1870, p. 306).

As a LDS, Freemason and Craft Mage, it is actually quite interesting and pleasing to know the great example the Smith family really were; This is a great example in following King Arthur's righteous and correct ideal to merge Christianity with Druidry; just the way it use to be in the beginning.

Anti-Mormons often critisize the Smith family for their money digging hobby. Joshua Stafford, a neighbour of the Smith family, noted that their money digging started no later than about 1820, when Joseph Smith, Jr was about fifteen years old: "[I] became acquainted with the family of Joseph Smith, Sen. about the year 1819 or 20. They then were laboring people, in low circumstances. A short time after this, they commenced digging for hidden treasures . . . and told marvellous stories about ghosts, hob-goblins, caverns, and various other mysterious matters" (H. Michael Marquardt & Wesley P. Walters, Inventing Mormonism, Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1994, p. 64).

In no way is there is anything wrong with telling fantasy or scary stories; I am a student of a Christian College; Our lecturers have always tought that fantasy & magickal story telling is perfectly ok for Christians; Fantasy was quite common back in those days. It made things all the more exiting, as TV was non-existent.

Anti-Mormons complain about Orsamus Turner's statement: Orsamus Turner said, "Legends of hidden treasure had long designated Mormon Hill as the repository. Old Joseph Had dug there and young Joseph . . . had accompanied his father in the midnight delvings, and incantation of the spirits that guarded it" (Littells Living Age, 30, July-Sept. 1851, p. 429).

There are many nature spirits. This is normal and the Smith family recognised that. Regardless, we cannot prove his claims to be fact.

In an affidavit, Henry Harris affirmed Joseph Smith's money digging and fortune telling: "I, Henry Harris, do state that I became acquainted with the family of Joseph Smith, Sen. about the year 1820, in the town of Manchester, N. York. They were a family that labored very little -- the chief they did, was to dig for money. Joseph Smith, Jr. the pretended Prophet, used to pretend to tell fortunes; he had a stone which he used to put in his hat, by means of which he professed to tell people's fortunes" (Rodger Anderson, Joseph Smith's New York Reputation Reexamined, Salt Lake City, Signature Books, 1990, p. 131).

This is a lie made up to distort the truth about the Seer-stone and Joseph Smith's gift of Prophesy. Even if he knew how to tell fortunes (which he would have) then that's a gift on its own. But I highly doubt Joseph Smith would have pretended to tell fortunes. That is a lie to make him look bad. People must look into the history of the other churches in the early days of 1900's and how they killed and raped members of the LDS church and burned their homes. Yet people look at one or a few small incidients of the LDS Church and try and prove that we LDS are demonic and preach heresy? Ridiculous! We cannot explain incidents such as the 'Mountain Meadows Massacre' or things like that, but the mistakes of certain Mormon individuals should not be placed upon the LDS Church as a whole. We are human and people make mistakes, often aided by passion.

Anti-Mormons also complain that Willard Chase, a neighbour who had employed Joseph and Alvin Smith to help dig a well, confirmed money digging by the Smith family in 1820, "I became acquainted with the Smith family . . . in the year 1820. At that time they were engaged in the money digging business" (Eber D. Howe, Mormonism Unvailed, Painesville, OH, 1834, p. 240).

I don't see what all the fuss is about...Many pore families, including my own ancestors did treasure digging during those days for any hope to make things better for their family. It gave them more to look forward to, even though the chances may have been slim; Families created stories while hunting and digging etc to make things interesting for their kids or even for themselves.

So what if historians friendly to the Mormon "church" have portrayed Joseph Smith's involvement with treasure-digging as extensive. These historians include Howard J. Booth, Wayne Ham, Marvin Hill, Jan Shipps, Donna Hill, Richard P. Howard, James B. Allen and Glen M. Leonard (D. Michael Quinn, Early Mormonism and the Magic World View, Signature Books, Salt Lake City, 1998, p. 44).

Anti-Mormons complain about official Mormon documents, Joseph Smith admitted to being a money digger (Documentary History of the Church, vol. 3, p. 29; vol. 1, p. 17; Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 120; Elders' Journal, vol. 1, no. 2, pp. 28-29).

So what!? Treasure digging is fun. This should not be an issue peoples. Find something better and more convincing to pick on.

For instance, when asked if he was ever a "money digger," Joseph Smith responded: "Yes, but it was never a very profitable job for him, as he only got fourteen dollars a month for it." (Joseph Smith, Documentary History of the Church, Vol. 3, p. 29).

Another problem among Anti-Mormons is among the Palmyra neighbors, who confirmed that Joseph Smith used his brown peep-stone in treasure digging were Willard Chase, William Stafford, Joseph Capron, Martin Harris, Abel Chase, Lorenzo Saunders, William Riley Hine and Isaac Butts (Quinn, pp. 44, 392n).

This brown peep-stone is still retained in the walk-in vault of the LDS presidency's office, together with at least one other of Smith's peep-stones (Ibid., p. 243).

When you understand the magickal properties within objects such as gems etc, this is one way you can aid yourself in many ways, even to locate things; its natural pure-forces of nature and perfectly fine.

Anti-Mormons say that the scryer's stone Smith used in pretending to see buried treasure, he also used for both finding and translating the pretend golden plates. LDS author Richard S. Van Wagoner wrote about this peep-stone...

Joseph did not use it in that way in any sense! These are outragous claims. One cannot assume anything they hear just because its Anti-Mormon and sounds convincing. It was another stone called the Seer-stone he used in the translation along with the Urim & Thummem. I'm sure Joseph Smith used his other stone a few times to aid him in locating things; that doesn't mean that its the core of all his findings. The main help during the translation of the Gold-Plates was the Power of God!

Deut, 33:8. King James) Here, in the Bible is proof of the Urim & Thummin and its place amongst prophets and authority... "And of Levi he said, Let thy Thummim and thy Urim be with thy holy one, whom thou didst prove at Massah, and with whom thou didst strive at the waters of Meribah;"

Just as occult items are past from a coven witch to another; are you beginning to see the bigger picture yet?

Anti-Mormons say that this stone, still retained by the First Presidency of the LDS Church, was the vehicle through which the golden plates were discovered and the medium through which their interpretation came"(Richard S. Van Wagoner, Sidney Rigdon: A Portrait of Religious Excess, Signature Books, SLC, 1994, p. 57).

And so there it safely remains; in the hands of those who deserve to keep it.

Anti-Mormons also rave on that Joseph Smith eloped with Isaac Hale's daughter and returned to the Hale household to sponge off Mr. Hale. Peter Ingersoll, who was helping Smith move furniture, observed a touching scene between Isaac Hale and Smith: "His father-in-law (Mr. Hale) addressed Joseph, in a flood of tears: 'You have stolen my daughter and married her. I had much rather have followed her to her grave. You spend your time in digging for money -- pretend to see in a stone, and thus try to deceive people.' Joseph wept, and acknowledged he could not see in a stone now, nor never could; and that his former pretensions in that respect, were all false. He then promised to give up his old habits of digging for money and looking into stones. Mr. Hale told Joseph, if he would move to Pennsylvania and work for a living, he would assist him in getting into business. Joseph acceded to this proposition" (Howe, pp. 234-235).

*Rolls eyes* Leave the poor guy alone! Love does a lot of things to people; Joseph Smith loved Emily Hail very much, If he lied it was only to win her fathers respect. This is quite normal for a young man in love. Often a man in love would do anything for the woman he loves, even lie. Bless his heart.

Anti-Mormons then try to make Joseph Smith into a liar by saying that instead of finding honest work as he had promised Isaac Hale and Justice Albert Neely, Smith returned to his peep-stone and pretended to find "golden plates." On May 1, 1834, Joe Smith's father-in-law published an affidavit on the matter in the Susquehanna Register. In the affidavit, Isaac Hale summed up the Book of Mormon. Sometimes one's relatives can say it best: "I conscientiously believe from the facts I have detailed, and from many other circumstances, which I do not deem it necessary to relate, that the whole 'Book of Mormon' (so called) is a silly fabrication of falsehood and wickedness, got up for speculation, and with a design to dupe the credulous and unwary -- and in order that its fabricators may live upon the spoils of those who swallow the deception. ISAAC HALE." (Isaac Hale affidavit, Susquehanna Register, Montrose, PA, May 1, 1834).

Pft, there is nothing wicked or false about it; It testifies of Christ, and of the Bible, and of the Holy Prophets of God. Why automatically say 'pretended' or 'false' without proof? I'm getting annoyed.

Anti-Mormons complain that the last writings of B. H. Roberts, who was a member of the Mormon "church's" First Council of the Seventy, also try and paint the Book of Mormon as a scam. They say that towards the end of his life Roberts became disillusioned with Mormonism. Regarded by Mormons as a top scholar, Robert's six-volume Comprehensive History of the Church is still used today. Roberts concluded that the "Nephites" and other protagonists in the Book of Mormon were most likely not actual historical personages, but were the inventions of Joseph Smith's mind, and were from plagiarized sources (B. H. Roberts, Studies of the Book of Mormon, University of Illinois Press, 1985, p. 250, 271).

Roberts later fell away from the Church; that explains a lot. Men fall into temptation and doubt, Roberts was just another victim of doubt and Satan's temptation.

Then Anti-Mormons even go on about Joseph Smith's own mother, Lucy Mac Smith, that she acknowledged that he was a talented storyteller, fully capable of inventing a detailed history of a make-believe civilization. She wrote: "During our evening conversations, Joseph would occasionally give us some of the most amusing recitals that could be imagined. He would describe the ancient inhabitants of this continent, their dress, mode of travelling, and their animals upon which they rode; their cities, their buildings, with every particular; their mode of warfare; and also their religious worship. This he would do with as much ease, seemingly as if he had spend his whole life with them." (Lucy Mack Smith, History of Joseph Smith by his Mother, 1954 ed., p. 83).

I've read this in 'History of Joseph Smith: by his Mother Lucy Mack Smith;' Its not a false story in this case at all, as Joseph Smith was actually talking of the information he had received from God about the Nephites etc. Nice try to all you Anti-Mormons who pick at anything to make the Prophet into a liar.

Anti-Mormons say that some of the first people to hear of Joseph Smith's golden plates story remember Joseph telling of a bloody Spaniard ghost who guarded the plates (Marquardt and Walters, pp. 92, 94). After Fayette Lapham visited the Smith family with a friend in 1830, he reported and exagerated Smith's dream, claiming that a blood-spurting ghost guarded the plates instead of an Angel. They try and compare the dream to that of a similar pirates' tales Joseph Smith and his family relished: "He [Joseph] then told his father that, in his dream, a very large and tall man appeared to him, dressed in an ancient suit of clothes, and the clothes were bloody. And the man said to him that there was a valuable treasure, buried many years since, and not far from that place; and that he had now arrived for it to be brought to light, for the benefit of the world at large; and, if he would strictly follow his directions, he would direct him to the place where it was deposited, in such a manner that he could obtain it. He then said to him, that he would have to get a certain coverlid, which he described, and an old-fashioned suit of clothes, of the same color, and a napkin to put the treasure in . . . when he had obtained it, he must not lay it down until he placed it in the napkin. . . ." (Historical Magazine 7, May 1870, 306-307).

This is a little bit exaggerated here. Joseph Smith made up the Spaniard thing to scare people, too keep them away from the plates. People then made crazy accusations about the rest of the story. Obviously a misunderstanding and the result of a Chinese-Whisper.

Anti-Mormons then say that Joseph Smith's early story of the plates, as related by those who heard it, had more in common with Halloween tales of hobgoblins and blood spurting ghosts than it did with anything "holy" or "Godly." They lie and say that when Smith first told the story, he had not learned to smooth out the rough edges. Hiel and Joseph Lewis, cousins of Smith's wife, recalled Smith's learning of the plates from a man who had his "throat cut from ear to ear, and the blood streaming down": "He [Joe Smith] said that by a dream he was informed that at such a place in a certain hill, in an iron box, were some gold plates with curious engravings, which he must get and translate, and write a book; that the plates were to be kept concealed from every human being for a certain time, some two or three years; that he went to the place and dug till he came to the stone that covered the box, when he was knocked down; that he again attempted to remove the stone, and was again knocked down; this attempt was made the third time, and the third time he was knocked down. "Then he exclaimed, "Why can't I get it?" or words to that effect; and then he saw a man standing over the spot, which to him appeared like a Spaniard, having a long beard coming down over his breast to about here, (Smith putting his hand to the pit of his stomach) with his (the ghost's) throat cut from ear to ear, and the blood streaming down, who told him that he could not get it alone; that another person whom he, Smith, would know at first sight, must come with him, and then he could get it. And when Smith saw Miss Emma Hale, he knew that she was the person, and that after they were married, she went with him to near the place, and stood with her back toward him, while he dug up the box, which he rolled up in his frock" (Amboy Journal, Amboy, Illinois, 24, 30 Apr. 1879).

Not all his relatives were in favour; nor did they believe him either. Here, stories have obviously been exaggerated profoundly. He got the plates long before he even married Emma, so it doest make any sense. These sources are not steady sources of information at all. People were often paid to frame Smith; being poor as they were, some cowardly people fell to this temptation and did anything for money...Even betray their friends and family. Just a thought, if the bloody ghost stories were true, how would that sound to people? This wouldnt even convince me that Moroni was a demon just becuase he was bloody, it may have something to do with the way that he died. But either way, I think people are trying hard to make Joseph Smith look like a liar.

They go on that Joseph Smith, who occasionally did some work for the Saunders family told a strange tale. When he told his story to Benjamin Saunders, though, the guardian of the plates was an amphibian who transformed into a man: "I heard Joe tell my Mother and Sister how he procured the plates. He said he was directed by an angel where it was. He went in the night to get the plates. When he took the plates there was something down near the box that looked some like a toad that rose up into a man which forbid him to take the plates. . . . He told his story just as earnestly as any one could. He seemed to believe all he said" (Benjamin Saunders interview, Sept. 1884, 30, fd 44, box 2, pp. 22-23, "Miscellany 1795-1948," RLDS library-archives).

And? shape-changing happens; Its common knowledge in Druidic shamanism. But how accurate Benjamin's story is is uncertain and not to be regarded as fact.

In an 1833 affidavit, Willard Chase corroborated the appearance of the amphibian: "He [Joe Smith] saw in the box something like a toad, which soon assumed the appearance of a man, and struck him on the side of his head" (Howe, p. 242).

Anti-Mormons etc claim that in books on the occult, the toad is associated with Satanism, witchcraft and sorcery (Henry Agrippa, Three Books of Occult Philosophy, London, Gregory, 1635, p. 472; Barrett, Magus, I:46).

"Umm, it may be asociated with the Craft, but it its not Satanic at all. The toad is associated with Transformation. It is a totem of metamorphosis along with other things. God himself and the Goddess, nature or other beings of sorts will often use animals as totems to deliver a message or a meaning to us; Joseph knew this. Its in the Bible. Moses transformed his staff into a serpent; he used locust and frogs etc during the plagues! He turned water to blood; parted water; Do you see? Moses was a Shaman! I will find other passages and include them later.

Anti-Mormons say that Smith also became confused about whether he was visited by Moroni or Nephi. From 1835 to 1838 the Mormon leaders taught that "Moroni" visited Smith (Jerald and Sandra Tanner, Mormonism: Shadow or Reality?, Salt Lake City: Utah Lighthouse Ministry, 1987, p. 137). In 1842, though, when Joe Smith published his history in the Times and Seasons, he had changed his mind. He had decided that the messenger was "Nephi" instead of "Moroni." The first edition of the Pearl of Great Price also gave the messenger's name as "Nephi," "In fact he was visited by both of them at different times. The incorrect name was written down by mistake; Has anyone considered that it was not Joseph that got the names confused? it was the publishers and it was a typo error. Nice try though." "He called me by name, and said unto me that he was a messenger sent from the presence of God to me, and that his name was Nephi." (Joseph Smith, Times and Seasons, vol. 3, April 15, 1842, p. 753; Joseph Smith, Pearl of Great Price, Liverpool, Eng., F. D. Richards, 1851, p. 41).

Later, when Mormon officials became embarrassed by Smith's discrepancy, they changed both the History of the Church and the Pearl of Great Price to read "Moroni." (Jerald and Sandra Tanner, Mormonism, Magic and Masonry, 2nd ed., Utah Lighthouse Ministry, Salt Lake City, 1988, p. 40).

As neighbour Parley Chase noted about Smith's golden plates story, "In regard to their Gold Bible speculation, they scarcely ever told two stories alike" (Howe, p. 248).

They go on about Joseph telling inconsistent accounts of Moroni, and that he also told conflicting accounts of his first meeting with "God" and "Jesus." Former BYU history professor D. Michael Quinn notes that Joe Smith's early narratives of the first vision were less than satisfying: "'the 16th year of my age,' 'I was about 14 years old,' and 'my fifteenth year.' Smith even required Cowdery to change his age at the first vision from '15th year' to '17th' in the first published history" (Quinn, p. 141).

I can tell you for fact, that it was because he felt that people would never believe in a 14-year old boy! Common! Think about it; it makes sense.

They say that in 1977, Richard P. Howard, historian for the RLDS Church, acknowledged Smith's lack of credibility with the First Vision: "One thing does seem certain: we cannot be certain about the First Vision. We cannot know that it occurred or, if it occurred, when or what Joseph experienced. . . . Neither Joseph Smith nor any other Latter Day Saint analyst has satisfactorily accounted for the discrepancies among the accounts on the point of the number and identity of the personage (s) appearing to him in the First Vision" ("An Analysis of Six Contemporary Accounts Touching Joseph Smith's First Vision," Restoration Studies I: Sesquicentennial Edition, p. 112).

Any LDS member would agree with me on this...I wouldn't believe anything the RLDS Church have to say. They are not real Latter Day Saints. They are a breakaway and have gone way off from the original teachings of the church. They are an embarrassing bunch of cradle snatching individuals who unnecessarily practice polygamy (which is not necessary at this current time;) along with other things, they give 'Real Mormons' a bad name.

Anti-Mormons beleave that the Book of Mormon and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints were offshoots and natural progressions of Smith's involvement with peep-stones, money digging, Freemasonry, astrology, fortune telling, water witching, a Jupiter talisman, magic parchments, a ceremonial dagger, talking toads, magic circles of black lamb's and black dog's blood, hemlock juice, necromancy, blood spurting ghosts, wizardry, demonic possession, etc. Anti-Mormons call Moroni 'the demon Moroni' that he has his antecedent in occult books about ghosts who were thought to guard buried treasure. To Joseph Smith, these enchantments needed to be broken. Appeasement through blood sacrifice to Satan was Joseph Smith's method of choice to break the enchantment and to get at the treasure. I can tell you that all that is a load of rubbish!

Anti-Mormons, keep on throwing everything you can. Gota give it to ya...you make quite a statement. It seems convincing, but you don't understand the meaning behind all of these items or organizations. Everything your saying is distorted in small or large ways; you don't understand the occult, you don't understand Masonry, you don't even understand the Bible. Joseph was no way into demon possession. Demons tried to attack him to stop him on his holy path for God; he had various dealings with demons, but not for the purpose of demonic possession. Once again hear is obvious distortion of the actual truth.

They say Smith's father influenced this belief. The newspaper Palmyra Reflector noted that Joseph Smith's father "evinced a firm belief in the existence of hidden treasure, and that this section of country abounded in them.--He also revived, or in other words propagated the vulgar, yet popular belief that these treasures were held in charge of some EVIL spirit, which was supposed to be either the Devil himself, or some one of his most trusty favourites" (Palmyra Reflector, as cited in A Witness For Christ in America, vol. 2, pp. 68-69).

Now the reason being is because it was a sacred land; It belonged to the famous Native American tribes, such as the Aztecs, Mayans, Incas etc, who's ancestors were the Lamanites. So there would be a lot of spirits around from those most ancient civilizations; both Good and Wicked.

William Stafford, who lived about a mile and a half from the Smiths, lied, aparantly corroborating Joseph Smith Jr.'s blood sacrifices to Satan: "Old Joseph and one of the boys came to me one day, and said that Joseph Jr. had discovered some very remarkable and valuable treasures, which could be procured only in one way. That way, was as follows: - That a black sheep should be taken to the ground where the treasures were concealed - that after cutting its throat, it should be led around in a circle while bleeding. This being done, the wrath of the evil spirit would be appeased: the treasures could then be obtained, and my share of them was to be four fold. To gratify my curiosity, I let them have a large fat sheep. They afterwards informed me, that the sheep was killed pursuant to commandment; but as there was some mistake in the process, it did not have the desired effect. This, I believe, is the only time they ever made money-digging a profitable business" (Howe, pp. 238-239; also reproduced in Dan Vogel, ed., Early Mormon Documents, Salt Lake City, Signature Books, 1996, vol. 2, pp. 59-61).

This guy is twisting things, talking lies. If it was true, maybe it was easier to avoid dealing with an evil spirit; say it was the only chance you had to support your family? Poor sheep though, yes, but who knows the truth behind these tales. As we all know, sacrifices were common in the Old Testament, animals etc had to be given up for various purposes; Abraham nearly sacrificed his own son! was he evil? No. I know this is a slightly different case of sacrifice, but it still holds similar values in 'some forms' of The Craft. Just because it sounds bloody does not mean its evil. I dont see animal sacrifices as necisary, but I understand how it works.

Then a BYU Professor M. Wilford Poulson noted Wallace Miner's saying, "I once asked Stafford if Smith did steal a sheep from him. He said no, not exactly. He said, he did miss a black sheep, but soon Joseph came and admitted he took it for sacrifice but he was willing to work for it. He made wooden sap buckets to fully pay for it" (Brigham Young University Studies, Spring 1970, p. 249)

I thought Joseph Smith asked Stafford? This contradicts the above. So who's telling the truth here? Does anyone see what's wrong with this information?

Then C. R. Stafford testified about the same incident: "Jo Smith, the prophet, told my uncle, William Stafford, he wanted a fat, black sheep. He said he wanted to cut its throat and make it walk in a circle three times around and it would prevent a pot of money from leaving" (Naked Truths About Mormonism, January 1888, page 3; also in Vogel, vol. 2, p. 197)

Hehehe...Every time the story changes a bit more. People lie an go on about the dagger Smith aparently used for animal sacrifices to Satan. The Smith family dagger was listed in the inventory of Hyrum Smith's "relics." An authorized biography of Hyrum Smith described the artefact as "Dagger, Masonic [--] ten inch, stainless steel--wooden handle--Masonic symbols on blade" (Pearson Corbett, Hyrum Smith, Patriarch, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book, 1963, p. 453).

Pft, Hahaha! Joseph Smith never made sacrifices to Satan, what a load of hogwash! A Masonic dagger is used as an Athame (ritual dagger.) it is not designed to spill blood of anything in the physical. In The Craft it is used to cut in the Astral only; and also for ceremonial purposes like in Masonry and raising energy in witchcraft.

Slides of the dagger were screened at the Sunstone Theological Symposium, August 24, 1985, Salt Lake City, Utah. Symbols on the blade are not "Masonic," but they are used in ceremonial magic. One side of the blade has the seal of Mars. The other side of the blade has a symbol for the "Intelligence of Mars," the zodiac sign for Scorpio and the Hebrew letters for "Adonai." Occult books recommend the inscription of "Adonai" for those seeking a treasure-trove (Agrippa, Fourth Book of Occult Philosophy, 1655, p. 81; Ebenezer Sibly, New and Complete Illustration of the Occult Sciences, illustration opposite p. 1103; Francis Barrett, Magus, 1801, II:110). These magical signs were inscribed according to instructions for inscribing occult symbols (Henry Agrippa, Three Books of Occult Philosophy, London: Gregory Moule, 1651, p. 245; Barrett, Magus, I: illustrations opposite pp. 143, 174; Melton, Encyclopedia of Occultism & Parapsychology, vol. 2, p. 1179). Mars is the governing planet of Smith Sr.'s birth year (1771).

So what if Smith Sr may have been given the dagger for his birth sign! that's often how it is in witchcraft tradition; But has anyone considered the fact that its just by chance that it resembles his ruling planet? As people should know by now - the stars and the Zodiac are used countless times in the Bible. A dagger like that can be used in Masonry; individuals wouldn't understand how that is either. Not my place to explain to a non-Freemason.

Anti-Mormons go on about stories by Dr. William D. Purple, a respected Bainbridge physician and a personal friend of Justice Neely, who took notes at Joseph Smith's 1826 court trial. Justice Albert Neely listed the case as "Joseph Smith The Glass looker--March 20, 1826." Some of Dr. Purple's recollections of the trial were printed in the Chenango Union. In a snippet from that article, one notes that Smith lured Josiah Stowell into sacrificing a lamb to an "evil spirit." During the blood sacrifice to an evil spirit, Smith sprinkled the lamb's blood to make a magic circle, just as he had done with the black lamb from William Stafford's flock. Dr. Purple wrote, "In this emergency the fruitful mind of Smith was called on to devise a way to obtain the prize. Mr. Stowell went to his flock and selected a fine vigorous lamb, and resolved to sacrifice it to the demon spirit who guarded the coveted treasure. Shortly after the venerable Deacon might be seen on his knees at prayer near the pits while Smith, with a lantern in one hand to dispel the midnight darkness, might be seen making a circuit around the pits sprinkling the flowing blood from the lamb upon the ground, as a propitiation to the spirit that thwarted them" (William D. Purple, "Joseph Smith the Originator of Mormonism: Historical Reminiscences of the town of Afton," Chenango Union, Norwich, NY, May 2, 1877, p. 3).

Neither is there proof in this. Its an exageration and lie trying to make an old Pagan ritual of the craft look like something evil. But I highly doubt this story is true. Just more rumors. I believe that the information here is a distortion of the 'real ritual' that actually did happened.

Hiel Lewis so tried to affirme that Smith translated the Book of Mormon by means of the same enchanting spirit that directed Smith to make dog sacrifices. Dr. Quinn wrote, "A cousin of Smith's wife Emma reported that Smith 'translated the book of Mormon by means of the same peep stone, and under the same inspiration that directed his enchantments and dog sacrifices; it was all by the same spirit' (H. Lewis 1879)" (Quinn, 1987 edition, p. 144).

Again, lies like that of Mrs Harris. Women like Mrs Harris did anything to bring Joseph Smith down, there is heaps of fact you can find to prove how much of a bag Mrs Harris really was, and why Martin Harris later divorced her; Harris came back into the Church and remained faithful to his last days. Why do people forget that part of his life! He said all the accusations he and his wife made against Joseph Smith had been false. There is an actual letter that Mrs Harris forced her husband Mr Harris to write, trying to disprove the authenticity of the Gold Plates; in court, Martin Harris tore up the letter and said something like..."I have known this man to be a good man. If Joseph Smith is a true Prophet, then I will not be a victim of Gods punishment." As God had punished Harris beforehand by fire I think it was, or a storm that destroyed his farm....After the courtroom event Harris had divorced his wife an re-joined the LDS church in repentance and was forgiven. The false torn up letter was then collected by someone and pieced together, kept to this very day. I will add information here later when I can dig it up.

When Joseph Smith started his "church" in 1830, the local Palmyra newspaper Reflector ran an article making fun of the Book of Mormon and Joe Smith's aparent animal sacrifices (Dogberry, pseud. [Abner Cole] "Book of Pukei," The Reflector, Palmyra, NY, June 12, 1830, p. 36). Early Mormon convert Emily M. Austin lied an said she recalled Joseph Smith's urging animal sacrifice, ". . . in the time of their digging for money and not finding it attainable, Joseph Smith told them there was a charm on the pots of money, and if some animal was killed and the blood sprinkled around the place, then they could get it. So they killed a dog and tried this method of obtaining the precious metal. . . . Alas! how vivid was the expectation when the blood of poor Tray was used to take off the charm, and after all to find their mistake . . . and now they were obliged to give up in despair (Mormonism; or Life Among the Mormons, 1882; Wesley P. Walters, "Joseph Smith's Bainbridge, N.Y., Court Trials" Westminster Theological Journal, 1974, part 2, p. 125).

Lies. An exageration of the truth. People back then were great story tellers; this was a way that they entertained themselves. If someone didn't like some one else, then making up a convincing tale was quite common.

Justice Joel King Noble, who tried Smith in an 1830 trail in Colesville, N.Y., related in a letter that when Joseph Smith and others were digging "for a Chest of money," they acquired a black dog and offered it as "a sacrafise [blo]od Sprinkled prayer made at the time (no money obtained) the above Sworn to on trial. . . ." (Letter of Justice Noble, dated March 8, 1842, photographically reproduced in Walters, "Joseph Smith's Bainbridge, N.Y., Court Trials," p. 134).

Once again...all lies to come up with so-called 'convincing evidence' to get Joseph Smith thrown in Jail. These kind of things still happen today. Innocent people get framed and blamed.

Anti-Mormons also state that Smith also urged human sacrifice to Satan. In 1880, Lippincott's Magazine noted: "On a wilderness-hill--now a part of Jacob J. Skinner's farm--his peek-stone discovered a ton of silver bars which had been buried by weary Spaniards as they trudged up the Susquehanna. An expedition for their recovery was undertaken as soon as Smith could muster enough followers to do the work. . . . The third hole had been sunk fifteen out of the necessary twenty feet when the treasure once more jumped to the other side of the big hole. Then the prophet had a vision: the blood of a black sheep must be shed and sprinkled around the diggings. Black sheep were scarce, and while they waited for one the faithful obtained their needed rest. At length, no sheep appearing, Joe Said that a black dog might answer. A dog, therefore, was killed, and the blood was sprinkled on the ground. After that the silver never went far away. Still, it waltzed about the big hole in such a lively manner that frequent tunnelling to effect its capture availed nothing. At the last the prophet decided that it was of no use to dig unless one of their number was made a sacrifice. None of the faithful responded to his call, and thus the magnificent scheme was abandoned. Oliver Harper, one of the diggers who furnished the money, was soon afterward murdered. The prophet thought this might answer for a sacrifice: he again rallied the diggers, but the charm remained stubborn and would not reveal the silver" (Lippincott's Magazine, 1880, pp. 199-200).

All lies created by various angry mobs and ex-members kicked out of Josephs Masonic Lodge or the LDS Church for immoral behaviors etc. I will add information here once I've dug it up.

History of Susquehanna County lied as they so noted Joseph Smith's saying that "one of the company should die before the enchantment could be broken" (Emily C. Blackman, History of Susquehanna County, 1873, p. 580). On April 23, 1880, the Salt Lake Tribune published a document showing Joseph Smith's involvement with Oliver Harper's widow in an agreement about money digging shares (Daily Tribune, Salt Lake City, April 23, 1880). The History of Susquehanna County notes that "Oliver Harper was murdered by Jason Treadwell. . . ." (Blackman, p 97). Treadwell was part of Smith's money digging group (Gerald and Sandra Tanner, Mormonism, Magic and Masonry, Utah Lighthouse Ministry, Salt Lake City, 1988, p. 35). Treadwell was executed for the murder on January 13, 1825 (Blackman, p. 325).

They say that according to Joseph Capron, Joseph Smith claimed to see "infernal spirits" in his peepstone (Howe, p. 259). Lies that Smith was mesmerized by evil spirits. Spellbound, he could watch them in rapt absorption for hours. William Stafford's affidavit notes Smith's protracted enthrallment with evil spirits: "He returned and said that Joseph had remained all the time in the house looking it the stone and watching the movements of the evil spirits. . . ." [Given under oath before Judge Th. P. Baldwin, Dec., 1833] (Charles A. Shook, True Origin of the Book of Mormon, Cincinnati, Ohio, 1914, pp. 28-31)

Well, some people are prepared to lie even when giving an oath. Money talks and BS walks.

Aparently, Dr. William D. Purple so recorded the process of Joseph Smith's becoming demon possessed. Anti-Mormons beleave that our LDS doctrine of Eternal Progression, of men becoming gods, originated when Smith deluded himself and lifted up his heart with feelings of ecstasy and godhood: "With some labour and exertion he found the stone, carried it to the creek, washed and wiped it dry, sat down on the bank, placed it in his hat, and discovered that time, place and distance were annihilated; that all intervening obstacles were removed, and that he possessed one of the attributes of Deity, an All-Seeing-Eye." (Dr. William D. Purple, Chenango Union, Norwich, NY, May 3, 1877)

And maybe he did; well good on him. I hope to receive the same kind of thing. But people don't understand what that means. Enlightenment can happen for anyone.

Since some Satanic rites require blackness, Anti-Mormons say that accordingly the demon Moroni required Joseph Smith to wear black clothing at their rendezvous. Smith Sr. told neighbour Willard Chase that Joe Smith Jr. was required to wear "black clothes" and to arrive on a "black horse" (Quinn, 1998 edition, p. 165). Lorenzo Saunders recalled that blackness was also a requirement for the rendezvous (Ibid., p. 65). In an interview with Fayette Lapham, Joe Smith Sr. referred to a requirement of wearing clothing of the same colour (Vogel, 1:459).

I don't see the problem with this. Its common when you practice magick; it doesn't mean your a Satanist. Wearing black is a tradition, even in Masonry.

Anti-Mormons go on about another issue...According to Lucy Mack Smith, Dr. Gain Robinson was "an old friend" of the Smith family (Ibid., 1:316). He owned a store in Palmyra, and he recorded purchases made by the Smiths from 1825 until 1829. The first time that any one of the Smiths purchased lampblack from his store was September 18, 1827, only four days before Joseph Smith's visit with the Moroni who Anti-Mormons claim to be a demon. (Lampblack was almost pure carbon. It was made from soot, and it was used to paint objects black.)

I'm really starting to get annoyed! Why do people keep referring to the Angel Moroni as 'the Demon Moroni" you have no right to say that, such blasphemy of ignorance indeed.

Dr. Robinson's accounting entry for this particular purchase of lampblack was abbreviated "L.Blk," and Dr. Robinson noted that Smith Sr. bought the lampblack for his son Joe Smith Jr. (Gain Robinson Store day book 1827-29, 301 King's Daughters' Library; Quinn, p. 166). People go on and talk about how Black is mentioned as a requirement in Reginald Scot's Discovery of Witchcraft and Discourse Concerning Devils and Spirits (pp. 215, 218-20, 226) and Ebenezer Sibly's New and Complete Illustration of the Occult Sciences (pp. 1102, 1104).

Smearing lampblack on the palms was practiced in divinatory scrying (Northcote Thomas, Crystal Gazing: Its History and Practice, London, Alexander Moring, 1905, pp. 32, 48-50, 68).

So? divination is not evil; Lampblack is used by both good and wicked witches; people automatically associate black with evil; a common stereotype and misconception.

Smith prepared for the meeting about midnight September 21, 1827, and he took Emma (Quinn, p. 166). Joseph Smith's sister said that Joseph was commanded to go at 2 a.m., September 22, 1827 (Katharine Smith Salisbury letter to "Dear Sisters," Vogel, I:521). For the 1823 meeting, Mormon scribe Oliver Cowdery wrote that Smith began praying to commune with "some kind of messenger" about "eleven or twelve" (Cowdery to Phelps, "Letter IV," 78-79; Jessee Papers of Joseph Smith, 1:50-51).

Just becaus Occult tradition specifies that spirit conjurations should begin at 11 o'clock at night, Anti-Mormons use this against Joseph Smith. Joseph Smith established the Moroni visit of September 21, 1923 as "after I had retired to my bed for the night." (Joseph Smith History, Pearl of Great Price, verse 29) Magic instructions also teach that if nothing results, the same experiment must be renewed in the following years. Smith wrote, "[Moroni] told me that I should come to that place precisely in one year from that time, and that he would there meet with me, and that I should continue to do so until the time should come for obtaining the plates." (Ibid., verse 53)

Yes, that's just the way things work. Magick is after all, the same energy God and the Angels use; so they go by that system. You can find things like this in the Bible again and again. A witches coven is made up of twelve disciples and one master. Was Jesus and the disciples practitioners of so called demonic-witchcraft? NO! perhaps they followed the same system. So why should all these similarities automatically be associated with Satan and Demons and all that nonsense? Why not recognize that witchcraft was originally pure in its origin; yes, it has been used for both good and evil. There have been various Christians who have and are still committing immoral deeds, just as some Catholic Priest's call themselves Christians and rape little boys; Does this mean that all Christians, or all Catholics are evil? NO! My two cents.

All of Smith's yearly meetings with Moroni were at night, and all followed the new moon and autumnal equinox at the major witchcraft festival of Harvest Home (Janet ~ Stewart Farrar, Eight Sabbats for Witches, Robert Hale, London, 1981, pp. 26, 116). People go on about how these were auspicious conditions for occultic treasure digging and the conjuration of demons. Dr. Quinn cites a comprehensive study of the magic arts, and he notes that all three distinctive forms of ritual magic were extant in Smith's meetings with Moroni: necromancy, transformation, and theurgy (Quinn, 1987 ed., p. 133). Anti-Mormons say that Smith's encounter with the so called demon Moroni is a textbook case of sorcery.

Nonsense! it is not sorcery. Once again a blasphemy attempt to call the Angel Moroni a demon. The Autumnal Equinox is not for the conjuration of demons in true witchcraft tradition, it is to commune with spirits of the other world, good/neutral spirits; evil are also present, but that doesn't mean you worship them either. The world is made up of both Good & Evil, Positive & Negative; you can't help having evil around in the world, its inevitable. Within a fruit container their is usually always one bad fruit, you discard it and eat the rest. Are all fruit so off because of the one bad fruit?"

William Stafford recalled the Smiths' belief that treasure digging success "depended in a great measure on the state of the moon" (Anderson, p. 144). Reginald Scot specified, "And in the composition of any Circle for Magical feats, the fittest time is the brightest Moon-light" (Reginald Scot, Discovery of Witchcraft, 1665, p. 215).

According to folk magic, one should do nothing without the assistance of the Moon (Agrippa, Three Books of Occult Philosophy, 1651, p. 279; Francis Barrett, Magus, I:148).

The moon was created to aid us in our works. So find all the occult information you want, it doesn't matter because witches follow the same system laid down by God; just because Joseph Smith understood how to follow the moon, including the starts, does not make him evil. Just like the prophets of old and the Three Wise Men who were Mages from the east; Why should truth make Joseph Smith evil? It doesn't. Bellow I have placed references to proof of original occult and shamanic understanding in the Bible. As a Latter Day Saint and a Freemason, have chosen to stay true and use the King James Bible; while the New King James Version of the Bible is just fine to, I believe the older language has more meaning and feeling and allows the reader to be more receptive to the Holy Ghost...

(Psalms 19:1-4, King James Bible) Here it talks of the importance of the stars as signs...

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handiwork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. There is no speech or language, where their voice is not heard. Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun..."

Psalm 147:4, King James Bible) Here it talks of the Zodiac... "He telleth the number of the stars; he calleth them all by their names.

(Job, 26:13. King James Bible) Here it talks of how the signs are part of Gods teachings, yet some do not recognize their importance... "By his spirit he hath garnished the heavens; his hand has formed the crooked serpent. Lo, these are parts of his ways: but how little a portion is heard of him? but the thunder of his power who can understand?

(Job 38:31-33, King James Bible) Here its clearly talks of following the signs of the stars to help us on earth, just as Joseph Smith did with Moroni... "Canst thou bind the sweet influences of Pleiades, or loose the bands of Orion? Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season? or canst thou guide Arcturus with his sons? Knowest thou the ordinances of heaven? canst thou set the dominion thereof in the earth?"

(Matt. 2:1-10.) The wise men are directed by a star to Jesus-Joseph takes the child to Egypt-Herod slays the children in Bethlehem-Jesus is taken to Nazareth to dwell... "Now when Jesus was born in Bethlahem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of Jews? for we have seen the star in the east, and are come to worship him....."

Genesis 1:14-18.) And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let there be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth: and it was so. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, And to rule over the day and the night, and to divide the night from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

Genesis 37:9.) In the bible it often talks of dreams...Dream-therapy and messages have always been an important part of Witchcraft. Here it also talks of the Zodiac etc... "And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me."

Genesis, Ch 49-21) Here it talks of the tribes being represented by the signs and totems, just as in shamanism or witchcraft...

Isaiah. 40:26. King James) Here it talks of how God has named the Zodiac... "Lift up your eyes on high, and behold who hath created these things, that bringeth out their host by number: he calleth them all by names by the greatness of his might, for that he is strong in power; not one faileth.

Amos 5:8, New King James) "He made the Pleiades and the Orion...."

Isaiah 13:10) "For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine." Acts. 28:11.) Here it talks of St Paul's ship he named after the sign of Gemini (Castor & Pollux) "And after three months we departed in a ship of Alexandria, which had wintered in isle, whose sign was Castor & Pollux" Does this make Paul Evil? No! But it shows his awareness of the cosmic energies.

Numbers, 2:1-2, King James) Its was tribal standard that each tribe had its own special 'sign' depicted. That's why it is called the 'Ensign.' Ancient Hebrew authorities declare that each tribe had one of the Zodiac signs as its own; and it is most likely that, even from scripture, that four of the tribes carried its 'sign'; and that these four were places at the four sides of the camp.

Deut, ch 33-17,King James) Here it talks of the representation of the Taurus. Also the symbol of the Aaronic Priesthood used in the LDS church. As seen by many at our Open House...it can be seen in our Temple beneath the Baptismal font. People often comment on the Bulls and say we are devil worshipers. Well listen to this... "His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Manasseh." ...Here it talks of Unicorns. Does this encourage belief in occult creatures? yes, it does. Here we see Shamanism in its pure form.

What does the Sphinx represent? Built around 4500 years ago? this means it rivals the great pyramids of Gizeh in age, and runs a parallel with astronomy in time. Could it supply a missing link? The word Sphinx comes from the Greek word Sphigo, and means to bind closely together. It therefore holds a secret. With the head of a woman and the body of a Lion! what is this but a never-ceasing monitor, telling us the vital truth namely...to begin with Virgo and to end with Leo! In the Zodiac in the temple of Esneh, in Egypt, a Sphinx is placed between the Signs of Virgo & Leo! this shows us the close connection with the Sphinx and the Zodiac, confirming the truth of where to break the circle of the Zodiac.

...The Sun, the Moon, and all these other signs and seasons are suppose to be followed and they testify of Christ. They confirm the presence of the God & Goddess.

Anti-Mormons claim that LDS members later rewrote Smith's account and deleted the blood-spurting Spaniard ghost, the transforming amphibian, the animal sacrifices to evil spirits that along with other things, they foolishly claim to be clear giveaways to the true nature of Mormonism--the Halloween religion as they call it. Aparently, they say that before Mormons rewrote the story, Moroni was an apparition who had his throat cut ear-to-ear, blood streaming down his clothing, a hobgoblin who was murdered to guard treasure as an enchantment. Just becuase Smith's story was similar to the kind of tale he told his money digging associates. They claim the milieu and genre were identical to that of his money digging tales. The requirements to arrive at a new moon, during an autumnal equinox, to wear black clothing, to smear his hands with lampblack, to bring a specific person, etc., were not taken from specific books on the occult, as Dr. Quinn's research found. They were known and passed down by Smiths family. The Book of Mormon identifies Moroni as an ancient and righteous Nephite who is now dead. Anti-Mormons use this against us LDS members; they say "What does the Bible tell us about communicating with dead people?" Necromancy, or communication with the dead, is strictly forbidden They try and use the following passages against us...(Deut. 18:9-12). Those who communicate with the dead are an abomination unto the Lord (Deut. 18:10-12).

Moroni is an Ascended being; an Angel. Many prophets become divine beings in the spirit world as they minister unto to others. This is not the same as communicating with the dead. The Bible is not specific on that fact, as spirits live in the spirit world; they are allowed to communicate with us at certain times, this is not the same as calling upon spirits. Get that right!

Another thing used aganst the LDS Church, is that Book of Mormon witness Oliver Cowdery corroborated that when Joseph Smith first went to the Manchester hill he "beheld the prince of darkness, surrounded by his innumerable trains of associates" (Oliver Cowdery letter to W. W. Phelps, LDS Messenger and Advocate, vol. 2, October 1835, p. 198).

Fayette Lapham recalled Smith's telling of devils who screeched, screamed and wounded Smith: " . . . Joseph took the pillow-case and started for the rock. Upon passing a fence, a host of devils began to screech and to scream, and made all sorts of hideous yells. . . . Joseph then turned the rock back, took the article in the pillow-case, and returned to the wagon; the devils, with more hideous yells than before, followed him to the fence; as he was getting over the fence, one of the devils struck him a blow on his side, where a black and blue spot remained three or four days. . . ." (Historical Magazine, 7 May 1870, p. 306).

Yes, Joseph Smith was attacked by evil on various occasions to stop him in his progression. People exaggerate these stories and change things that they see or read to suit them and to frame the True Prophet Joseph Smith.

Then Anti-Mormons relate the Ancients Book of Magic (p. 15) notes that demons, during an encounter with a magician, can make shocking displays: "Thus attired, and standing within the charmed circle, the magician repeats the awful formot exorcism; and presently, the internal spirits make strange and frightful noises, howlings, tremblings, flashes, and most dreadful shrieks and yells, as the forerunner becomes visible."

Nothing to do with Smiths incident. There is realy no proof of any of this blasphemy and ridicule that has been blatantly and ignorantly written here by Anti-Mormon fools who do not understand the true nature of the Universal Truths.

As a Masonic Mormon, as I call myself, I can say that we invite all those willing to come and receive the light. May the universal truths be revealed to you through the great mysteries and signs placed by the Great architect of the universe.

SO MOTE IT BE!

Bro. Frank Fantasia(Latter Day Saint, Freemason, Craft Mage, and disciple and instructor in the mystic Japanese warrior arts of Ninjutsu.)


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: antimormon; boggsforgovernor; conspiracy; cult; falseprophets; frankfarkel; magick; magickmushrooms; newbie; occultism; tinfoil; zot
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1 posted on 05/31/2008 11:59:25 AM PDT by Frank Fantasia
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To: Frank Fantasia

IBT LDS Mason Witch Zot


2 posted on 05/31/2008 12:01:08 PM PDT by thecabal
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To: Frank Fantasia

3 posted on 05/31/2008 12:01:38 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Frank Fantasia

Man, that sure was a lot of writing just to ride the lightning.


4 posted on 05/31/2008 12:02:15 PM PDT by SIDENET (Hubba Hubba...)
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To: thecabal

It already got zotted before the first reply!


5 posted on 05/31/2008 12:02:29 PM PDT by LibFreeOrDie
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To: Frank Fantasia

You has a smell.

6 posted on 05/31/2008 12:06:55 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Preach the Gospel always, and when necessary use words". ~ St. Francis of Assisi)
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: Frank Fantasia; aculeus; AnAmericanMother; Billthedrill; Constitution Day; Petronski
Becoming an author ...

Heaven help us.

8 posted on 05/31/2008 12:09:24 PM PDT by dighton
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To: LibFreeOrDie; shibumi

Pffft.

*I* wanted to hear about the “transforming amphibian”.

Could it have been.....a SALAMANDER?!?

Now I’ll never know....8:(


9 posted on 05/31/2008 12:09:39 PM PDT by Salamander (And don't forget my Dog; fixed and consequent......)
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To: big'ol_freeper; Frank Fantasia; darkwing104
IATZ
10 posted on 05/31/2008 12:12:31 PM PDT by darkangel82 (If you're not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. (Say no to RINOs))
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To: LibFreeOrDie; shibumi

Bah.
Never mind.
It was just a toad.


11 posted on 05/31/2008 12:12:37 PM PDT by Salamander (And don't forget my Dog; fixed and consequent......)
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To: Frank Fantasia; P-Marlowe; xzins
I am also a University Student in Theology, History, Literature, Creative Writing, Fantasy, Philosophy and Poetry.

I see your spelling has improved considerably in the short time we've known you. You do know don't you, that Harry Potter isn't real?

12 posted on 05/31/2008 12:14:03 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: Frank Fantasia


"Well... Isn't that special!"

13 posted on 05/31/2008 12:14:04 PM PDT by DocRock (All they that TAKE the sword shall perish with the sword. Matthew 26:52 Gun grabbers beware.)
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To: Religion Moderator

oh that’s cool!


14 posted on 05/31/2008 12:14:45 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: dighton

Chief: "Ugh. Troll standards getting lower every day."

15 posted on 05/31/2008 12:14:46 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: Frank Fantasia

So, Frank, what planet do you hail from again?


16 posted on 05/31/2008 12:17:27 PM PDT by Virginia Ridgerunner ("We must not forget that there is a war on and our troops are in the thick of it!"--Duncan Hunter)
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To: Religion Moderator

youre hysterical LOL


17 posted on 05/31/2008 12:17:45 PM PDT by Revelation 911
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To: Frank Fantasia; P-Marlowe; Tennessee Nana; Elsie; restornu
Mountain Meadows Kitty Zot


18 posted on 05/31/2008 12:18:56 PM PDT by Gamecock (The question is not, Am I good enough to be a Christian? rather Am I good enough not to be?)
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To: Frank Fantasia
Next time, please be sure to read and understand the essay question before you start writing your answer.

The question was:

Describe the similarities and differences between the biochemical pathways of aerobic respiration and photosynthesis in eukaryotic cells. Include in your discussion the major reactions, the end products, and energy transfers.

19 posted on 05/31/2008 12:19:09 PM PDT by The Electrician ("Government is the only enterprise in the world which expands in size when its failures increase.")
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To: Frank Fantasia; timpad; TBarnett34; MeekOneGOP; PetroniDE; Lady Jag; mhking; glock rocks; ...
You are going to burn....

Please let me know if you want ON or OFF my Viking Kitty/ZOT ping list!. . . don't be shy.

20 posted on 05/31/2008 12:19:09 PM PDT by darkwing104 (Lets get dangerous)
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To: Frank Fantasia; P-Marlowe; greyfoxx39

ping

looks like sparky found the lite switch


21 posted on 05/31/2008 12:19:20 PM PDT by Revelation 911
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To: Frank Fantasia
Could you summarize this in 25 words or less?

No?

Well, I can:


22 posted on 05/31/2008 12:24:18 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd (Yo prometo lealtad a la bandera de los Estados Unidos de America, y a la Republica que representa...)
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To: Frank Fantasia
I have also had the privalege to study under a 9th generation Witch

Unfortunately, you didn't also have the good fortune to study under a 3rd grade English teacher.

23 posted on 05/31/2008 12:27:03 PM PDT by IronJack (=)
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To: Frank Fantasia
Becoming an author...

Instead of wasting your time posting things like this here, perhaps you should learn to write if becoming an author is your desire.

Just one early sentence alone:

I have also had the privalege (spelling!) to study under a 9th generation Witch who is also (awkward!) a friend of mine.

24 posted on 05/31/2008 12:27:58 PM PDT by Allegra (If you lived here, you'd be home by now.)
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To: darkwing104

25 posted on 05/31/2008 12:28:16 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN, 3/5 Marines, RVN 1969. St. Peregrine, patron saint of cancer patients, pray for us.)
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To: The Electrician
The question was:

Describe the similarities and differences between the biochemical pathways of aerobic respiration and photosynthesis in eukaryotic cells. Include in your discussion the major reactions, the end products, and energy transfers.

You forgot the second part: "What is the synaptic stage of meiosis in which two chromosomes pair intimately?"

26 posted on 05/31/2008 12:30:33 PM PDT by redhead (I used to be an anarchist, but I quit--too many rules.)
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To: Frank Fantasia

27 posted on 05/31/2008 12:31:09 PM PDT by Allegra (If you lived here, you'd be home by now.)
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To: redhead
"You forgot the second part: "What is the synaptic stage of meiosis in which two chromosomes pair intimately?"

OOPS. "Synaptic" should be "homologous." Now. Doesn't that make just a whole LOT more sense?? I thought you'd like that.

28 posted on 05/31/2008 12:33:52 PM PDT by redhead (I used to be an anarchist, but I quit--too many rules.)
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To: Frank Fantasia
Bro. Frank Fantasia(Latter Day Saint, Freemason, Craft Mage, and disciple and instructor in the mystic Japanese warrior arts of Ninjutsu.)

Your application for joining the Non-denominational caucus has been noted.

29 posted on 05/31/2008 12:34:03 PM PDT by Harmless Teddy Bear (A good marriage is like a casserole, only those responsible for it really know what goes into it.)
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To: darkwing104

IATZ...sadly.


30 posted on 05/31/2008 12:37:08 PM PDT by rabscuttle385 (History is a story written by the finger of God. — C.S. Lewis)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
You said: Your application for joining the Non-denominational caucus has been noted.

Now that's funny! I don't care what anybody says!

31 posted on 05/31/2008 12:38:30 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Preach the Gospel always, and when necessary use words". ~ St. Francis of Assisi)
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To: Allegra

The spelling, oh don’t forget the spelling!!! You’d think a 9th generation witch could teach him to spell.


32 posted on 05/31/2008 12:38:45 PM PDT by texgal (end no-fault divorce laws return DUE PROCESS & EQUAL PROTECTION to ALL citizens))
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To: redhead; The Electrician
Funny essay questions! After skimming through the looooooong LDS posting, I could not help but recall the dialogue from Billy Madison:

"What you've just said ... is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

33 posted on 05/31/2008 12:39:09 PM PDT by NewJerseyJoe (Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")
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To: Frank Fantasia

"You don't get out of your mom's basement much, do you dweeb?"

34 posted on 05/31/2008 12:39:52 PM PDT by webschooner
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To: Frank Fantasia; darkwing104



Shriek..I smell a troll!

35 posted on 05/31/2008 12:40:20 PM PDT by MEG33 (God Bless Our Military)
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To: Frank Fantasia

I am a student of a Christian College; Our lecturers have always tought that fantasy & magickal story telling is perfectly ok for Christians;

Gosh Frank what Christian College is that ???

Is spelling among the requirements to graduate ???


36 posted on 05/31/2008 12:43:03 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Frank Fantasia
either way...You've been ZOT!....¡ʇoz
37 posted on 05/31/2008 12:44:55 PM PDT by skinkinthegrass (just b/c you're paranoid,doesn't mean "they" aren't out to get you..our hopes were dashed by CINOs :)
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To: Frank Fantasia

Mr. Fantasia, what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.


38 posted on 05/31/2008 12:45:18 PM PDT by dfwgator ( This tag blank until football season.)
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To: Frank Fantasia

Anti-Mormons also rave on that Joseph Smith eloped with Isaac Hale’s daughter and returned to the Hale household to sponge off Mr. Hale. Peter Ingersoll, who was helping Smith move furniture, observed a touching scene between Isaac Hale and Smith: “His father-in-law (Mr. Hale) addressed Joseph, in a flood of tears: ‘You have stolen my daughter and married her. I had much rather have followed her to her grave. You spend your time in digging for money — pretend to see in a stone, and thus try to deceive people.’ Joseph wept, and acknowledged he could not see in a stone now, nor never could; and that his former pretensions in that respect, were all false. He then promised to give up his old habits of digging for money and looking into stones. Mr. Hale told Joseph, if he would move to Pennsylvania and work for a living, he would assist him in getting into business. Joseph acceded to this proposition” (Howe, pp. 234-235).

*Rolls eyes* Leave the poor guy alone! Love does a lot of things to people; Joseph Smith loved Emily Hail very much, If he lied it was only to win her fathers respect. This is quite normal for a young man in love. Often a man in love would do anything for the woman he loves, even lie. Bless his heart.

Anti-Mormons then try to make Joseph Smith into a liar by saying that instead of finding honest work as he had promised Isaac Hale and Justice Albert Neely, Smith returned to his peep-stone and pretended to find “golden plates.”
____________________________________________________

All this is about how it all happening..

The false prophet Joseph Smith was a lazy bum and Emma’s father should have shot the mangy cur and saved Emma a lot of unnecessary misery..


39 posted on 05/31/2008 12:47:33 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Frank Fantasia
Latter Day Saint, Freemason, Craft Mage, and disciple and instructor in the mystic Japanese warrior arts of Ninjutsu.

Creating these titles in The World of Warcraft doesn't make you any of these in the Real World. Your obvious attempt to put false information out to bash Freemasons and Mormons by trying to tie to video game knowledge of 'witchcraft'. The interesting part is the only reference to 'Frank Fantasia' I can find is of a Catholic deacon in Massachusetts. Tell me, what does the term 'bearing false witness' mean to you? Or, if who you claim to be is true, are you rough or finished?

40 posted on 05/31/2008 12:50:33 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: Frank Fantasia
I have also had the privalege [sic] to study under a 9th generation Witch [sic] who is also a friend of mine. Becoming an author,[sic] I am also a University Student [sic] in Theology, History, Literature, Creative Writing, Fantasy, Philosophy [sic] and Poetry. I have been a practitioner of the ancient Japanese mystic warrior art of Ninjutsu for over a decade, a tradition handed down to me by my late master.

Frank, no one who is a university student writes "University Student" or spells "privilege" as "privalege." And you forgot the comma before the penultimate item in a list. And with all that to keep you busy, you still have time to be so logorrheic?
41 posted on 05/31/2008 12:50:41 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: webschooner
You just made my day! My eyes thank you as does the rest of me on my 79th birthday! ;-)
42 posted on 05/31/2008 12:58:40 PM PDT by LuigiBasco (It's almost too late to restart The Crusades. (What are we waiting for))
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To: Frank Fantasia

Love does a lot of things to people; Joseph Smith loved Emily Hail very much, If he lied it was only to win her fathers respect. This is quite normal for a young man in love. Often a man in love would do anything for the woman he loves, even lie.
_____________________________________________

A man in lust might stoop to any nummber of things..

But a man who loves a woman as Christ loves the Church will be honest and trustworthy and will deserve the love of a maiden..

If Joseph Smith had turned up in my yard sniffing after my daughter, I would have had the law after him...

Lies do not win respect...

Respebct is earned through truth and honest dealings...

Joseph Smith had to lie becaise there was nothing decent in h9im...

Only lies and deciet...

Hardly the type of husband that a man wants for his only daughter...

Emma’s father loved her and tried to protect her from a demon possessed piece of scum..

Mr. Hale knew what Joseph Smith was and tried to run him off..

Poor man..he must have been heart broken when the mangy cur Jopseph Smith sneaked into his house and stole his daughter...

The false prophet joseph Smith had a history of wanting and taking by force what he had no right to..

He was so puffed up with his imigingings of grandiose that he objected when people said no to him and thought he had a right to murder them and steal from them for the “insult”

He was an adulterer and cheated on Emma right in her own house...

What a louse Joseph Smith was..


43 posted on 05/31/2008 12:59:57 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Frank Fantasia

This account has been banned or suspended.
Okay
You Got Banned!
Aww Gee....
Poor Widdle Twoll
Him Got Banned

44 posted on 05/31/2008 1:03:09 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: 1000 silverlings
You do know don’t you, that Harry Potter isn’t real?

O ye of little faith, do you feel lucky?

;-)

45 posted on 05/31/2008 1:03:39 PM PDT by dighton
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To: Frank Fantasia; A.Hun; Aircop_2006; AliVeritas; Allosaurs_r_us; AmericanInfidel0; amxfan2002; ...

///// #PPPPPPP

DTG 312104Z MAY 08

T O P S E C R E T VIKINGKITTEN

SUBJ: ECCLECTIC ZOT

RE: POST 1

1. WATCH NCOIC HAS CONFIRMED REPEAT CONFIRMED TROLL SIGHTING, THIS DTG, THIS LOCATION. FR MOD COMMAND HAS INITIATED SNAP-SHOT ZORCH ON TARGET (QUICKZOT).

2. DUE TO UNUSUAL NATURE OF TROLL IN EVENT RE. 1, ALL ELEMENTS ARE ADVISED TO SUSPEND ALL DISBELIEF OPERATIONS THIS OCCASION. ALL ELEMENTS ARE FURTHER ADVISED TO OBSERVE EVENT WITH ADDITIONAL USE OF SALT, INDIVIDUAL, SINGLE-USE DOSE.

3. ALL ELEMENTS ARE AUTHORIZED TO EXECUTE OPTION “DOGPILE” UPON RECEIPT OF THIS MSG. WATCH NCOIC WILL CONDUCT BATTLE DAMAGE ASSESSMENT FOLLOWING STRIKE TERMINATION ORDER.

4. GENERAL ORDER ONE IS SUSPENDED THIS OCCASION. ALL ELEMENTS ARE DIRECTED TO RALLY POINT URSULA FOR AUTHORIZED LINE-DANCE UPON TROLL REMAINS. CONSUMPTION OF ADULT BEVERAGES IS ENCOURAGED.

5. CHALLENGE/PASSWORD: VALHALLA-OVERLORD.

#/////

NOTHING FOLLOWS

EOM EOM EOM


46 posted on 05/31/2008 1:04:59 PM PDT by Old Sarge (CTHULHU '08 - I won't settle for a lesser evil any longer!)
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To: Frank Fantasia; darkwing104

You seem to have mistaken us for people who care what you think.

IBTZ


47 posted on 05/31/2008 1:05:19 PM PDT by Monkey Face ("Science has proof without any certainty. Creationists have certainty without any proof.")
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To: Frank Fantasia

48 posted on 05/31/2008 1:05:34 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: LibFreeOrDie

have also had the privalege to study under a 9th generation Witch who is also a friend of mine.
_____________________________________

Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. Exodus 22:18

Thou shalt zot a witch. Exodus 22:18


49 posted on 05/31/2008 1:07:30 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Frank Fantasia

Learn some HTML. This should have been posted in alternate line colors of red, blue and green like it’s written in your notebook.


50 posted on 05/31/2008 1:09:42 PM PDT by Stentor
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