Posted on 06/27/2009 10:01:54 AM PDT by Salvation
How Old Is Your Church?If you are a Lutheran, your religion was founded by Martin Luther, an ex- monk of the Catholic Church, in the year 1517. If you belong to the Church of England, your religion was founded by King Henry VIII in the year 1534 because the Pope would not grant him a divorce with the right to remarry. If you are a Presbyterian, your religion was founded by John Knox in Scotland in the year 1560. If you are a Protestant Episcopalian, your religion was an offshoot of the Church of England founded by Samuel Seabury in the American colonies in the 17th century. If you are a Congregationalist, your religion was originated by Robert Brown in Holland in 1582. If you are a Methodist, your religion was launched by John and Charles Wesley in England in 1744. If you are a Unitarian, Theophilus Lindley founded your church in London in 1774. If you are a Mormon (Latter Day Saints), Joseph Smith started your religion in Palmyra, N.Y., in 1829. If you are a Baptist, you owe the tenets of your religion to John Smyth, who launched it in Amsterdam in 1605. If you are of the Dutch Reformed church, you recognize Michaelis Jones as founder, because he originated your religion in New York in 1628. If you worship with the Salvation Army, your sect began with William Booth in London in 1865. If you are a Christian Scientist, you look to 1879 as the year in which your religion was born and to Mrs. Mary Baker Eddy as its founder. If you belong to one of the religious organizations known as 'Church of the Nazarene," "Pentecostal Gospel." "Holiness Church," "Pilgrim Holiness Church," "Jehovah's Witnesses," your religion is one of the hundreds of new sects founded by men within the past century. If you are Catholic, you know that your religion was founded in the year 33 by Jesus Christ the Son of God, and it is still the same Church. |
No. The religion Lutherans practice was founded by the Lord God Almighty in the Garden of Eden with the first promise of the gospel, Genesis 3:15. ;^)
Luther initially started off talking about removing the corruption within The Church -- something that he could have done WITHIN the Church. . . .
Not after the Pope booted him out! That was in 1520. But even for decades after, Luther wanted a general council of the church to deal with the issues. When Trent finally came, after Luther's death, it failed to correct the errors and even anathematized the Lutheran teachings. And Rome has still not corrected her errors on the central article of the Christian faith, i.e., justification. (That JDDJ of ten years ago was a farce, agreed to only by very liberal "Lutherans.")
I don’t see ONE Roman church. I hear hundreds of voices making radically different points all the time.
Most Protestant/evangelical sects don’t preach an “underground” church but rather a “universal” or “invisible” one comprising all people who believe directly on Christ for eternal salvation. Baptists have a long history of bitter difference with the CoC over just this kind of issue, the CoC being almost as dogmatic as the RCC about the unique power of baptism in their local houses of worship, and the Baptists saying no, salvation is based on personal relationship with Christ which in turn is based on hearing the Bible message, and baptism is a ceremony of witness. The Baptists match up with most other Protestants and evangelicals in this regard. The question of canonical Christian scripture was settled before the church got into anything which is anathema to most Protestants and evangelicals (e.g. alliance with a pagan government).
So how old is “my church”? As old as creation.
Pfft! So-called "apostolic succession" does not make a true church; faithfulness to Christ's commands does.
Nobody said it didn’t happen. It isn’t biblical though. There is NOTHING in Scripture to instruct the churches (and there is a LOT of instruction there) to baptize infants or non-believers.
Yes, but these founders didn’t wake up one day and find gold engraved plates revealing a “new Gospel” on those dates. They were taking the existing faith in the direction they felt the Spirit was leading them.
Ping for later
That's irrelevant.
This thread is about 'Churches' and Christianity..
The Catholic Church is the only church that can claim to have been founded by Christ personally. Every other church traces its lineage back to a mere human person such as Martin Luther or John Wesley. The Catholic Church can trace its lineage back to Jesus Christ who appointed St. Peter as the first pope. This line of popes has continued unbroken for almost 2,000 years.It's not about Paganism, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, the Zoroastrians, Islam, the Druids, or the 'gods' of ancient Egypt, Greece or Rome.God rules, instructs and sanctifies His people through His Church. Under her teaching office, the Catholic Church preserves the Word of God. She is the custodian, keeper, dispenser and interpreter of teachings of Christ. And she accomplishes this under the protection of the Holy Spirit.
Nice try though. Have a nice day.
Ok,....Let's STOP right here! Stop the Protestant bashing!
Lutherans are **Christians**. Christ is the foundation of Christianity! Their faith and church goes back to Christ. Martin Luther merely got their Christian faith ( founded by Christ) back on track, and correctly **reformed** the faith, and threw out the corruption and abuse that had infiltrated it.
You are kind of missing the point of why the protestant churches sprang up, which basically stems from their belief (not altogether unjustified) that the Roman Church had strayed so far from the message and meaning of Christianity with the decadence, corruption and hypocrisy of its clergymen at all levels that it was felt that a clean break and a return to what they believed was the true message of Jesus and the Bible.... The Church of England and the Lutherans still have apostolic succession, as does the Orthodox and Coptic Churches.
The fact that the Bishop of Rome somehow became the most important clergyman is a mere reflection of the fact that Rome was at the time of the foundation of the Papacy the centre of the known world....
***“If you are Catholic, you know that your religion was founded in the year 33 by Jesus Christ the Son of God, and it is still the same Church.”
Ummm...you DO realize that only Roman Catholics accept that last statement as true?***
Only Catholics accept that last statement as true.
Tell that to the Greek/Eastern Orthodox Church. They lay as much claim to the direct lineage to Rome as the Catholic Church does.
***Baptists are much older. Baptists organized in England around that time, but to say that is when they started is simply historically inaccurate.***
Do you have any evidence? The earliest Baptist attribution I’ve ever seen is Smyth in Holland.
Here the deal. Most of those churches are called “protestant” churches. A couple are heretical anti-trinitarain cults. It is wrong to lump these cults into the same class as protestant churches. All of the protestant churches in your list affirm both the Apostles Creed and the Nicean Creed which states “I believe in the holy catholic church”. So what does this make those of us who belong to “prostestant” churches? It makes us “protest-ant” that is protesting catholics. All orthodox western Christians are branches from same tree the root of which was established by Jesus Christ in 33 AD. The Roman catholic church is one branch, the partiarchal orthodox churches are another branch. The protestant churches are branches off the roman catholic branch, but we all share the same root.
***I am part Jewish ***
Which part?
***Islam is what 1300 years old? This thread is retarded and sad that some Catholic apologists have to resort to specious and vapid sophomoric arguments.***
Are you a practicing Jew?
Excellent point.
I am a former Catholic.
One of the things that I deeply resent about the Catholic faith was its **cultish** teaching that leaving the faith meant certain damnation in the fires of hell. They were the “true” faith and the only possessors of the ordinances of salvation.
Ok...So I am past that and the Catholic cult no longer has any emotional hold on me.
Generally, the Catholic Church as a lot that is correct about it. Our nation would be stronger if we had a lot more Catholics who truly believed in and followed every word of their catechism.
But...Please, **stop** bashing Protestants as somehow having their faith founded by Luther, Knox, or Henry...or anyone else. Our faith was founded by **Christ**!
***The Catholic Church isn’t any different or any better then any of the other sects of the church.***
The Catholic Church isn’t a sect.
***We could always ask how many people were burned at the stake by Baptists vs Catholics, lowest number wins.***
We could also ask which Church preserves the Gospel of Jesus and the Faith that we were instructed in by God and not man. The man with the right map and who is Judged worthy of salvation by the Grace of God gets eternal, well, salvation.
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