Chris Matthews / Bishop Thomas Tobin
Posted on 11/24/2009 1:34:17 PM PST by NYer
.- On Monday Bishop Thomas Tobin tangled with television pundit Chris Matthews on MSNBC’s “Hardball” about the relation between religion and politics as well as the legal status of abortion. Matthews’ comments, which charged that the bishop has overstepped his authority, were criticized as a “rant” and an “extended lecture.”
Bishop Tobin, of the Diocese of Providence has been critical of Rhode Island U.S. Rep. Patrick Kennedy’s attacks on the Church for opposing abortion. Rep. Kennedy recently revealed that the bishop had asked him to refrain from receiving Holy Communion in 2007 because of his public contradiction of Catholic teaching.
Chris Matthews began the Monday evening “Hardball” segment with a clip of remarks by Rep. Kennedy’s uncle President John F. Kennedy, the first Catholic U.S. president. In his political campaign President Kennedy had said that a politician should not accept “instruction on public policy” from the Pope or any other ecclesiastical source.
In response, Bishop Tobin emphasized that all religious believers, including Catholic politicians, should put their faith before their career.
“Nothing can become more important than your relationship with God,” he told Matthews, who is Catholic.
Bishop Tobin endorsed a return to U.S. law before the pro-abortion Supreme Court decision Roe v. Wade. Matthews pressed him on this point, asking what laws he would write if he were a member of Congress.
“I am not a member of Congress, but if I were, I would never be in a position of supporting any abortion legislation that encourages abortion,” the bishop replied.
“What law would you pass?” Matthews pressed. “You’re coming down on Congressman Kennedy and other public officials. …Would you outlaw abortion?”
“That’s the direction our nation ought to move,” the prelate responded.
Asked to tell Catholics how they should vote as members of Congress, he said Catholics should vote for laws that “preserve and protect human life.”
Matthews asked Bishop Tobin to be specific, asking whether women who procure abortions should be thrown in jail.
“I have no idea what the penalty would be,” the bishop replied.
Matthews professed agreement with the bishop’s moral views, but then claimed Bishop Tobin had “transgressed” into the area of lawmaking. He characterized the bishop’s reluctance to name specific penalties for a woman who procures abortion as an expression of “hesitancy” from the clergy.
“Words like ‘murder’ and ‘killing’ are used in the case of abortion but they do not seem to apply in terms of writing the law,” Matthews commented. “And I would urge you to consider the possibility of error here, because in getting into telling public officials how to set public policy, you’re stepping beyond moral teaching, and you’re basically assuming a moral authority which I don’t think is yours.
“As you admitted tonight four or five times, you don’t know how to write law, and writing law is very tricky in our secular society,” Matthews’ comments concluded.
“I will reflect on that if you reflect on the teachings of the Church,” Bishop Tobin responded.
Bill Donohue of the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights characterized Matthews as having “spun out of control.”
“Matthews proceeded with an extended and quite insulting lecture,” Donohue charged in a Tuesday press release. “He had absolutely no interest in a discussion on the question of the morality and legality of abortion—all he wanted to do was to make the bishop sit there and listen to his rant. Indeed, his tirade was simply over-the-top.”
Donohue claimed that no non-Catholic would treat a bishop in such a way.
“But too many liberal Catholics, especially Irish Catholics, think they are exempt from the same standards of civility that apply to others.”
Pro-life advocate Jill Stanek wrote on her blog that she thought the Matthews interview should have focused on the question “Are preborns human or not?”
“If they are, then we need laws to protect them, just as we do all other innocent human life. If we're not sure - if the answer is above one's pay grade - then we should err on the side of life,” she wrote.
The question of criminal penalties for women who seek abortions is a common talking point among supporters of permissive abortion laws. The issue was considered in an August, 2007 symposium titled “One Untrue Thing” on the conservative web site National Review Online.
In that symposium, Villanova University law professor Joseph Dellapenna said “none of the anti-abortion laws overturned by Roe v. Wade… treated the woman as a criminal.”
Rather, he explained, the laws treated the woman as a victim in part because of the dangers of abortion and in part because of the need for her testimony to convict the abortionist.
In the same symposium Clarke D. Forsythe of Americans United for Life pointed out that before Roe the abortionist, not the prosecutor, tried to argue that an abortion-seeking woman should be treated as an accomplice. This was done “for the obvious purpose of undermining the state’s criminal case against the abortionist,” he wrote.
According to an announcement from pundit Bill O’Reilly, Bishop Tobin will appear on Fox News’ O’Reilly Factor tonight. The show airs at 8:00 p.m. Eastern Time and reruns at 11:00 p.m.
In response, Bishop Tobin emphasized that all religious believers, including Catholic politicians, should put their faith before their career.
“Nothing can become more important than your relationship with God,” he told Matthews, who is Catholic.
God, Country and Family.
Yes, in that order.
They should give his guests spit shields to wear... just saying...
“Donohue claimed that no non-Catholic would treat a bishop in such a way.”
He’s right. I’m a non-Catholic and I wouldn’t treat anyone that way, no matter their station in life. It is just rude.
Democrats such as Matthews saw nothing wrong with Fr. Robert Frederick Drinan, S.J representing Massachussets in the House of Representatives for a decade did they? Drinan was chairman of the Subcommittee on Criminal justice and the first to introduce an impeachment resolution against Nixon (not for Watergate but for Cambodia). Drinan's pro-abortion stance is credited with turning Democrat leaders (including the Kennedys) into pro-aborts.
But then again, anyone going up against Bishop Tobin in a debate will lose.
Every Time. It's called Truth vs Liberal lies or Good vs Evil.
He was grinning the entire time saying that when JPII gave communion to politicians who were pro abortion, his own conduct showed that it was permissible for pro abortion politicians to receive communion.
I still can't get over the grin on his face. It was so smug and pompus and I might add a little demonic.
Why does anyone not on the fringe left even bother to go on Matthews’ show? He’s not going to give them a fair hearing, and his viewership is low anyway. He’s not worth the effort.
Matthews is a drooling, spitting, fat, leftwing Communist that the Chinese Leaders would jail in a nanosecond for being criminally insane and a danger to society...:-)
Lucky for him, half of Our Society are Compassionate Idiots who humor Fools like him....:-(
Standard headline:
‘Hardball’ host gives ‘insulting lecture’ during interview with {name and title of person who disagrees with him}.
Of course if anyone was true to their pro-abortion beliefs in actual practice, they would have already been aborted.
The advocate of a cause cannot be the exception to their own rules.
How does Matthews reconcile his love for abortion with his proclaimed fath (Catholicism)? Even an athiest would have been more respectful.
Newsbusters.org -- Tim Graham
That is exactly the bishop’s authority.
These Catholics who think they cand do as they like and go against the teachings of the Church are in the wrong Church.
If you cannot agree with catholic Doctrine you should drop out and become whatever it is that condones murder, and homosexuality, and licentious behavior. Maybe a Scientologist that believes in a space alien.
What's that got to do with the price of apples??? No one is looking to criminalize those who have had abortions. We simply want them to stop having them.
Those who have the responsibility of “making laws” should never make laws that harm anyone. I've thought for some time that the Kennedys might be more comfortable in the Episcopalian Church. Really, it suits them and would allow them to have all the same sacraments without the hassle of the Magisterium "minding" if they undermine the Church as hugely influential public members of the worldly society. No hard feelings, but it's really time to "move on".
Obviously Mr. Matthews thinks children are a punishment, as well. Funny, the Old Testament Saints said they were a gift from God. That’s it, Chris, the Bible must be in error, it couldn’t be you.
Crissy was mad that o-bow-man never came over and he was all ready for him with his knee pads and a new roll of paper napkins.
In the same bogusly belligerent manner that Pelosi, Kerry and other CINOs do. They justify against the Church using their own personal confused & immoral rules.
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