Posted on 03/14/2010 12:14:46 PM PDT by NYer
I have often wondered about this. Is it really possible to be a Catholic in good standing without making any prayers of intercession to Mary and the saints, and without professing these things as necessary to salvation (or at least to being a Catholic)? Could one unwilling to make these prayers or affirm these doctrines be confirmed in the Church? They are obviously very important to Catholics.
God chose Mary. I will stand by God’s decision’s any day over any human’s ignorance.
Yes.
God chose Mary . . . to birth and mother Jesus the child.
She did—evidently admirably.
Guess what . . . Jesus is no longer a child.
A lot of perceptions on such issues could stand to
Grow up.
As Christ HIMSELF indicated very pointedly . . .
NOW, the task for Believers
is to DO THE WILL OF THE FATHER and forget about Mary.
She is not your affair and you are not her’s.
Convincing accounts indicate she is quite busy enough teaching aborted babies in Heaven the ways of The Father—and not even as some special such teacher—merely another loving Heavenly teacher doing THE WILL OF THE FATHER.
Is there anything in Catholic doctrine that demands that a Catholic pray to Mary and the Saints?
But surely I would think all Christians have high regard for Mary and do honor her memory.
The Roman Catholic stronghold is massive.
Ha! Not according to most of my Catholic school teachers :-)
WRONG.
He was the author of the Fatima charade.
But dear brother in Christ, I must object: This is NOT how Catholics view Mary. She is NOT "morphed into the Godhead." She is NOT the spawn of Satan. She is the Holy Mother of Christ, a mortal human albeit supremely Blessed, who is with her Son in Heaven even now.
What I find most perplexing is, I cannot reconcile your view of Mary with the picture we have of her at the Marriage at Cana, John 2.
You recall the story I'm sure, dear brother in Christ. Mary comes to Jesus, and says (in so many words), "Son, the marriage feast has run out of wine. Go fix the problem." [Evidently Mary was completely aware of the Nature of her son.]
And Jesus "tries to get out of it," saying:
Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. — John, 2:4So what does Mary do? Basically, she simply ignores her son's "protest," turns to the servants, and says: "Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it."
And Jesus complies. The best wine of the marriage feast is about to be served to the wedding guests....
So, what is my takeaway from this story?
(1) The miracle of the wine at Cana was the first miracle that Christ performed on His earthly journey. [John 2:11]
(2) He performed this miracle at the behest of his mother.
(3) Of this first miracle, Dostoyevsky has Alyosha say [Brothers Karamazov]:
I love that passage; it's Cana of Galilee, the first miracle. ... Ah, that miracle! Ah, that sweet miracle! It was not men's grief, but their joy Christ visited, He worked His first miracle to help men's gladness....Does any of this add up to the picture of Mary as the harlot of Satan? Tool of the Great Deceiver? Jeepers, Quix.
Rather, Catholics regard the Blessed Mother as a special protector of human beings, because she is herself a human being, and a mother to boot.
Or at least, that is my understanding of the matter.
As you likely know, now.
God’s perspective is the only one that counts.
Bless you and your loved ones for your faithfulness TO HIM.
“...including a vast MAJORITY of the Roman Catholics et al”
It was supposedly a little over half. Which objectively isn’t a “vast majority”. Not that it isn’t disgusting, but it was not 90-95% like some groups, which would be a “vast majority”.
“I’m not real impressed with the ‘faithful’ Roman Catholics et al’s resistence to deception—at Fatima...”
Here’s a very popular prayer that the supposed Demon/UFO asked to be prayed at Fatima:
“O my Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell, lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of Thy mercy. Amen.”
Doesn’t sound too demony/UFOic to me.
Freegards
As expected...completely wrong. It’s the Savior’s Church. Neo-Christians who reject Christ’s Church are truly ..unbelievable.
Repectfully, that is not what I asked. For the record, I consider Mary to be Blessed, worthy of emulation and certainly to be in the presence of God with her Son and His saints. But is it possible to be a Catholic in good standing without addressing prayers through her or through any other saint?
I’m happy to be wrong about the SElection percentages.
Satan is an artist at mixing truth and half truths with seductive lies.
Fatima did a huge job of causing 100’s of millions of Roman Catholics et al around the world to elevate the false Marian personage to a God-like status in their eyes.
The Mary caricacture is all set to be a marvelously successful Pied Piper for 100’s of millions of Roman Catholics et al in these END TIMES at a critical juncture in the globalists’ satanic schemes.
Very slick, and so far, very successful.
. . . For those who are not thoughtful enough about Scriptural exhortations to the contrary.
Your line of the prayer can be seen as a classic misdirection. The focus SEEMS TO BE quite kosher. However, it accepts the AUTHORITY of one LESSER THAN GOD in a God-like role.
That’s extremely spiritually hazardous.
AMEN! Perfectly stated. Those 10 words could save a lot of Christians a lot of grief if they actually could hear the words and understand them.
All glory to God alone.
I used to believe this too but now I am convinced otherwise.
You walk into a building full of statues of Mary and various saints. What do you do about that? I would like to hear from just ONE Roman Catholic who can say they never in their lives knelt down and prayed before a statue. heck, we used to sing songs of praise and crown a statue of Mary with a crown of flowers on May Day.
Attending mass is a problem: various prayers that everyone recites in unison have words like "we pray to all the angels and saints". There are often references to "the ever-virgin Mary" and the "Mother of God". One prayer to Mary says, "Pray to us who have recourse to thee."
If you participate in praying a rosary, you must recite countless repetitions of what the Catholics call "The Hail Mary".
Catholics must beleive that Mary was conceived without sin (the Immaculate Conception) They teach that she did not give birth to Jesus in the usual way but that he passed out of her body as rays of sun through glass. If she had given birth, it might have anulled her virginity.
Believing that she was an eternal virgin? Whatever, there are arguments for and against her having more children but I believe she DID have other children which is against RC doctrine.
A Catholic must also believe that Mary was bodily assumed into heaven instead of dying. That's where all this intercession and stuff comes from. She's still alive, just like Jesus, in their minds.
So, if you don't believe these things, you cannot be a Catholic. I don't know how this can be reconciled.
I absolutely do not reject Christ’s Church. I am a member of the Bride of Christ, and He is returning for me some day.
I do reject the notion that the Roman Catholic Church is somehow the only legitimate expression of Christ’s Church.
INDEED.
Thanks for your kind words.
Blessed be The Lord God Almighty—Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
INDEED.
WOW.
I didn’t know about the no real birth thing.
That alone is UNBIBLICAL.
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