Glenn Beck to Address Baptist Grads, but His Mormonism Sparks Debate

Politics Daily ^ | May 14, 2010 | David Gibson

[Colofornian]

Glenn Beck is a darling of Fox News viewers and a must-see for legions of religious conservatives. So given his profile and right-of-center views, it was no surprise when it was announced that Beck would be a featured speaker at this Sunday's commencement at Baptist-run Liberty University in Lynchburg, Va., the brainchild of the late Rev. Jerry Falwell, founder of the Moral Majority.

Falwell's son, Jerry Jr., is the current president of Liberty. In a statement explaining the invitation, he called Beck "one of the few courageous voices in the national media standing up for the principles upon which this nation was founded."

Yet if conservative Christians share Beck's political and social views, many of them also remain extremely suspicious of Beck's Mormon faith. Beck became a Mormon as an adult and credits his faith with turning his life around. But evangelicals generally consider Mormonism a "cult" and not Christian.

As a result, Beck's appearance at Liberty has generated an unusual amount of public infighting among evangelicals -- and creating the kind of controversy that is often associated with Catholic colleges, such as Notre Dame experienced last year when President Obama was invited to be the commencement speaker.

Ryan Begue, a Florida pastor who is in this year's graduating class from Liberty's theological seminary, said he was "shocked and disappointed" at Falwell's invitation to Beck.

"It seems that the leadership's decision in this matter gives the impression that it is more committed to conservatism than the Gospel," Begue wrote in the Florida Baptist Witness. "I have no beef with Glenn Beck as a person, but I certainly do with his religious beliefs. Why does Liberty not invite a Christian?"

Liberty University's Facebook page also lit up with the debate, while prominent Christian conservatives also weighed in.

"Alliances such as these are not glorifying to God, in that what association has God with false religions?" wrote John Ferguson, founder of the Voice of Truth blog. "The tangential dangers when the evangelical community unites with the secular world for the sake of social or political agendas are numerous because it leads to a dilution of truths from the Word of God, opens the door to give credence to non-believers within evangelical circles and ultimately leads to the eternal destruction of lost people."

A 2007 Pew Forum survey showed 25 percent of Americans would be less likely to vote for a Mormon candidate for president, with only Muslims and atheists earning higher negatives. But among white evangelicals who attend church weekly -- the GOP base and the dominant demographic of Liberty University -- the number rises to above 40 percent. In 2008, Focus on the Family, a leading lobby of the Christian right, pulled an interview with Beck over concerns that they would appear to be sanctioning his Mormon faith.

And during his 2008 bid, Romney faced a serious pushback from evangelicals who even opposed the idea of John McCain selecting him as his running mate on the Republican ticket, one of the factors that led McCain to finally choose Sarah Palin.

(Mormons insist they are Christians because they believe in Jesus Christ and consider the Bible Holy Scripture. But most traditional Christian churches do not accept the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints -- the formal name for Mormons -- as Christian because of the religion's beliefs on the nature of God, salvation, the Trinity and their scriptures, such as the Book of Mormon, and other texts discovered by founding prophet Joseph Smith in upstate New York in the 1800s.)

Falwell seemed to anticipate the risks of the Beck invitation when he noted in his statement that Liberty University has always held two end-of-year ceremonies -- a baccalaureate ceremony to confer degrees that "always includes a gospel message brought by someone who is in complete theological alignment with the university" and a separate commencement ceremony that "has always featured leaders from all walks of life and all faiths who share the university's social values and traditional family values."

"Commencement speakers," he noted, "have included representatives from the following faiths: Roman Catholicism, Judaism, mainline Protestant denominations such as the Episcopal Church, and even some speakers with no religious affiliation at all."

Falwell's effort did not forestall the controversy, however.

"We are not to put politics first and the Lord second," wrote Steve McConkey, another prominent Christian conservative, who is upset at the Beck invitation. "If this country is to have another revival, we need to get back to the basics, just like an athlete who has to go back to the basics to learn proper skills. We join Glenn Beck in many of his viewpoints, however, we do not endorse his Mormon beliefs."

There has arguably been some softening, at least among the Southern Baptist leadership, in their view of Mormonism, perhaps influenced by the "ecumenism of the trenches" -- that in a culture war, all social conservatives must stick together. That is part of the reason that evangelicals and Roman Catholics now collaborate on fights against abortion and gay marriage despite their historical cultural divide and their ongoing doctrinal differences.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints used to be listed under "cults and sects" by the Southern Baptist Convention, but today is categorized among "newly developed religions" by the SBC's North American Mission Board. Similarly, some Southern Baptist leaders, such as Richard Land, have referred to Mormonism as the "fourth Abrahamic religion" after Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.

But as the Glenn Beck commencement controversy shows, even fourth place isn't enough to overcome such long-held suspicions

[rickomatic]

I don’t think Glenn Beck IS teaching another Gospel. He is being deceived by one. He is a conservative political commentator, and that is why he is being invited to speak.
Are you saying he is accursed? Are you saying he is preaching another Gospel? He is not. I can’t remember anywhere in the word where we are told to throw away non believers. I’m pretty sure we’re supposed to bring them into repentence. Am I wrong?
Or am I just misinterperting your meaning in posting those verses. Posting singular verses out of context is not very helpful.

[Does so]

"...I don't listen to Beck because I can't stand the crying and break downs on the air...Interesting though that if one does not agree with you, then they are not a conservative...Really the Founders speaking from the grave? Are you suggesting Beck is channeling them...?"

1) Beck hits the "cough" button when he emotes on the radio.

2) He emotes when he mentions his family—as I would.

3) He quotes "Team Obama", and then contrasts them with statements from The Founders: that's better than anyone else on the radio.

4) If your objection to Glenn Beck is religion:

If Beck is "anti-Christian", how can 'Team Obama' be given a pass by Conservatives when it comes to anyone addressing the evils of Obamunism?

[Elsie]

(Mormons insist they are Christians because they believe in Jesus Christ and consider the Bible Holy Scripture. But most traditional Christian churches do not accept the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints -- the formal name for Mormons -- as Christian because of the religion's beliefs on the nature of God, salvation, the Trinity and their scriptures, such as the Book of Mormon, and other texts discovered by founding prophet Joseph Smith in upstate New York in the 1800s.)

The BoM: bait-and-switch ENTRY level 'scripture'.

Why don't they put the Book of ABRAHAM front and center, if they are an 'abrahamic' religion?

[Elsie]

Similarly, some Southern Baptist leaders, such as Richard Land, have referred to Mormonism as the "fourth Abrahamic religion" after Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.

SOME?

How many is SOME?

If PERVERSION of Abraham is all it takes to be considered 'abrahamic'; then GO for it!

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THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS

SECTION 132

 

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded July 12, 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant, as also plurality of wives. HC 5: 501–507. Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, it is evident from the historical records that the doctrines and principles involved in this revelation had been known by the Prophet since 1831.

 

, Exaltation is gained through the new and everlasting covenant; , The terms and conditions of that covenant are set forth; , Celestial marriage and a continuation of the family unit enable men to become gods; , The strait and narrow way that leads to eternal lives; , Law given relative to blasphemy against the Holy Ghost; , Promises of eternal increase and exaltation made to prophets and saints in all ages; , Joseph Smith is given the power to bind and seal on earth and in heaven; , The Lord seals upon him his exaltation; , Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; , Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.

 

 

  1 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many ^a and ^b—

  2 Behold, and lo, I am the Lord thy God, and will answer thee as touching this matter.

 

 

 

 

  34 God ^a Abraham, and Sarah gave ^b to Abraham to wife. And why did she do it? Because this was the law; and from Hagar sprang many people. This, therefore, was fulfilling, among other things, the promises.

[Elsie]

I would so love to be there!

I went to a 'christian' college (Wabash - Crawfordsville, IN ) last fall to hear one of BYU's teachers, Robert Millet, speak.

He never showed up.

[Elsie]

The people who fight on this forum instead of uniting in a solid front, including those who sanctimoniously say, “I’ll pray for your enlightenment,” are a perfect case in point.

I'm sorry; but if certain folks make a claim that they are CONSERVATIVE, but the EVIDENCE shows they are NOT; would you expect a CATFIGHT to occur on FR?

[Elsie]

 

Mormon teachings clearly teach about a "council of gods" -- about how temple Mormons can become a god...and one of its own prophets from our generation (Kimball) at one time said he supposed he was talking to 225,000 future gods.

---

 

 

 

Praise to the Man!

 

 

Praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!
Jesus annointed that Prophet and Seer.
Blessed to open the last dispensation,
Kings shall extol him, and nations revere.

Chorus
Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

 

 

Praise to his mem'ry, he died as a martyr;
Honored and blest be his ever great name!
Long shall his blood, which was shed by assasins,
Plead unto heav'n while the earth lauds his fame.

Chorus
Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

 

Great is his glory and endless his priesthood.
Ever and ever the keys he will hold.
Faithful and true he will enter his kingdom,
Crowned in the midst of the prophets of old.

Chorus
Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

 

Sacrifice brings forth the blessings of heaven;
Earth must atone for the blood of that man.
Wake up the world for the conflict of justice.
Millions shall know 'Brother Joseph' again.

 

Chorus
Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

[Elsie]

If Jesus hates his faith that much, he will be turned into a pillar of salt.

Oh?

HIS statement HERE says otherwise:

Matthew 13:24-50 

Tares among Wheat

 ²⁴Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, "^(A)The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field.

 ²⁵"But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed ^[a]tares among the wheat, and went away.

 ²⁶"But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also.

 ²⁷"The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'

 ²⁸"And he said to them, 'An enemy has done this!' The slaves said to him, 'Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?'

 ²⁹"But he said, 'No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them.

 ³⁰'Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, "First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but ^(B)gather the wheat into my barn."'"

[Elsie]

 

I also doubt that Beck understands much about the theology of Mormonism, either.

 

Ya think?

---

---

 

Glenn Beck interview...

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKtAPT9KEfM

 

 

 

Timeline...    Subject...

0:55            wife-to-be

 

[Elsie]

He is Morman.

And Salt Lake City embraces him as such!

[Elsie]

It seems kind of silly to worry about Beck’s religion when he rarely speaks of it himself.

Could we infer then, that CONSERVATism is more impportant to Beck than MORMONism?

[Elsie]

I recall Tammy Baker did pretty well with the phony tears and she wasn’t a Mormon !

WOMEN can get away with it...

[Elsie]

 

Doesn't the word tell us that Satan will appear as an angel of light to deceive us?

 

 

2 Corinthians 11:12-15

 12.  But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
 13.  For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
 14.  And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
 15.  Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

 

 

 

 

 

[Elsie]

I believe that instead of argueing over whether or not Mr. Beck is the speaker at a Christian college, we should be thankful for his strident politically conservative voice, and pray continually that God will take the scales from his eyes in regards to his religious beliefs.

One day, on his show, I expect one of two things to happen:

Either he WILL have had the scales removed and he announces to the WORLD his conversion to Christianity, or...

He will use it as a bully pulpit and reach more people in an HOUR than the missionaires do all year extolling the TRUTHFULLNESS of Mormonism.

---

THEN, perhaps, peoples eyes will be opened!

[Elsie]

And as for alcohol being a sin. That is a manmade rule which is what is wrong with so much religion today.

Since when?

DRUNKENESS is the problem: not ALCOHOL!

---

http://www.broadcaster.org.uk/section2/transcript/drunkenness.htm

[Elsie]

 

Does Beck believe that a man, (Joey Smith) will decide whether he gets into the afterlife ??? Yes.

 

Eh... maybe he does - maybe he doesn't; but top ranked MORMON leaders sure have had some TEACHINGS about it!

 

---

 

"He (Joseph Smith) is the man through whom God has spoken... yet I would not like to call him a savior, though in a certain capacity he was a god to us, and is to the nations of the earth, and will continue to be."

 - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:321

 

 

"You call us fools; but the day will be, gentlemen and ladies, whether you belong to this Church or not, when you will prize brother Joseph Smith as the Prophet of the Living God, and look upon him as a god..."

- Herber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 5:88

 

 

"If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him [Joseph Smith]; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him [Joseph Smith]"

- (as quoted in 1988 Melchizedek Priesthood Study Guide, p. 142)

 

 

There is "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God"

- Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190

 

 

"I tell you, Joseph holds the keys, and none of us can get into the celestial kingdom without passing by him. We have not got rid of him, but he stands there as the sentinel, holding the keys of the kingdom of God; and there are many of them beside him. I tell you, if we get past those who have mingled with us, and know us best, and have a right to know us best, probably we can pass all other sentinels as far as it is necessary, or as far as we may desire. But I tell you, the pinch will be with those that have mingled with us, stood next to us, weighed our spirits, tried us, and proven us: there will be a pinch, in my view, to get past them. The others, perhaps, will say, If brother Joseph is satisfied with you, you may pass. If it is all right with him, it is all right with me. Then if Joseph shall say to a man, or if brother Brigham say to a man, I forgive you your sins, "Whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted unto them;" if you who have suffered and felt the weight of transgression—if you have generosity enough to forgive the sinner, I will forgive him: you cannot have more generosity than I have. I have given you power to forgive sins, and when the Lord gives a gift, he does not take it back again."

 - Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p.154-155

 

 

 

"It is because the Lord called Joseph Smith that salvation is again available to mortal men.... If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation,"

 - Bruce McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 396, 670

 

 

Does Beck believe that a man, (Joey Smith) will decide whether he gets into the afterlife ??? Yes.

 

Eh... maybe he does - maybe he doesn't; but top ranked MORMON leaders sure have had some TEACHINGS about it!

[Elsie]

Did the other guests speakers over the years get this sort of “outrage”? Episcopalians, Roman Catholics, and even non-aligned folks (which could mean a whole lot of things).

Tommy Johnson: I had to be up at that there crossroads last midnight, to sell my soul to the devil.

Ulysses Everett McGill: Well, ain't it a small world, spiritually speaking. Pete and Delmar just been baptized and saved. I guess I'm the only one that remains unaffiliated.

[Elsie]

 

BTW drinking alcohol is not a small thing in mormonism...

 

---

 

 

THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS

SECTION 89

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Kirtland, Ohio, February 27, 1833. HC 1: 327–329. As a consequence of the early brethren using tobacco in their meetings, the Prophet was led to ponder upon the matter; consequently he inquired of the Lord concerning it. This revelation, known as the Word of Wisdom, was the result. The first three verses were originally written as an inspired introduction and description by the Prophet.

 

1–9, Use of wine, strong drinks, tobacco, and hot drinks proscribed; 10–17, Herbs, fruits, flesh, and grain are ordained for the use of man and of animals; 18–21, Obedience to gospel law, including the Word of Wisdom, brings temporal and spiritual blessings.

 

  1 A ^aWord OF Wisdom, for the benefit of the council of high priests, assembled in Kirtland, and the church, and also the saints in Zion—

  2 To be sent greeting; not by commandment or constraint, but by revelation and the ^aword of wisdom, showing forth the order and ^bwill of God in the temporal salvation of all saints in the last days—

  3 Given for a principle with ^apromise, adapted to the capacity of the ^bweak and the weakest of all ^csaints, who are or can be called saints.

  4 Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of ^aevils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of ^bconspiring men in the last days, I have ^cwarned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation—

  5 That inasmuch as any man ^adrinketh ^bwine or strong drink among you, behold it is not good, neither meet in the sight of your Father, only in assembling yourselves together to offer up your sacraments before him.

  6 And, behold, this should be wine, yea, ^apure wine of the grape of the vine, of your own make.

  7 And, again, ^astrong drinks are not for the belly, but for the washing of your bodies.

  8 And again, tobacco is not for the ^abody, neither for the belly, and is not good for man, but is an herb for bruises and all sick cattle, to be used with judgment and skill.

  9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.

  10 And again, verily I say unto you, all wholesome ^aherbs God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man—

  11 Every herb in the season thereof, and every fruit in the season thereof; all these to be used with ^aprudence and ^bthanksgiving.

  12 Yea, ^aflesh also of ^bbeasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used ^csparingly;

  13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be ^aused, only in times of winter, or of cold, or ^bfamine.

  14 All ^agrain is ordained for the use of man and of beasts, to be the staff of life, not only for man but for the beasts of the field, and the fowls of heaven, and all wild animals that run or creep on the earth;

  15 And ^athese hath God made for the use of man only in times of famine and excess of hunger.

  16 All grain is good for the ^afood of man; as also the ^bfruit of the vine; that which yieldeth fruit, whether in the ground or above the ground—

  17 Nevertheless, wheat for man, and corn for the ox, and oats for the horse, and rye for the fowls and for swine, and for all beasts of the field, and barley for all useful animals, and for mild drinks, as also other grain.

  18 And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, ^ashall receive ^bhealth in their navel and marrow to their bones;

  19 And shall ^afind ^bwisdom and great ^ctreasures of ^dknowledge, even hidden treasures;

  20 And shall ^arun and not be ^bweary, and shall walk and not faint.

  21 And I, the Lord, give unto them a promise, that the ^adestroying angel shall ^bpass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen.

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The Official Scriptures of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints © 2006 Intellectual Reserve, Inc. All rights reserved. Rights and use information. Privacy policy.

[Elsie]

How do you *DO* that?

[Elsie]

and anyone who disagreed was punished...

And me?

Why I'd rather have that Jello® nailing to the wall than the OTHER thing I've just learned about!