An Open Letter to Reformed Creationists

MBC ^ | 10/14/10 | GZ I.F.

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

Dear Friends in Christ,

We thank the Lord for your faith in our magnificent Creator-God, the One who created all things out of nothing (Heb. 11:3), and who created this world and all that is in it in six literal 24-hour days (Exodus 20:11), to the praise of His glory. Many of you have supported sound creation research organizations such as the Institute for Creation Research (ICR) and Answers in Genesis (AIG), and some of you are leaders in these organizations.

We recognize that many of our Reformed brethren are staunch creationists, and for this we thank God and we stand with you. We join with you in your uncompromising affirmation that the Lord Jesus Christ, the Creator of all things (John 1:3; Col. 1:16), accomplished His finished work of creation in six literal days, not billions of years ago, not millions of years ago, but in the recent past, a mere thousands of years ago. We stand with you in opposing evolutionary dogma which has plagued our society for over 200 years, has poisoned the minds of young people, and has robbed God of the glory which is rightfully His as the world's great Designer and Creator of every living thing and every inanimate object.

[Just mythoughts]

There is no doubt that Moses wrote and understood that he was describing the creation of the world in regular 24 hour days. And there was evening and morning ... the first day ... And there was evening and morning ... the second day ... You cannot claim he meant something else without committing intellectual and grammatical suicide. If you read the words you cannot come to any other conclusion than Moses meant 24 hour days. It is an entirely different question as to whether he was correct.

The point is clarified as to what God was saying, by Peter, HE is the WORD and there is nobody in the flesh since, that can ever know exactly what Moses knew or did not know, as we are not mind readers.

[Just mythoughts]

Why is that a requirement? What theological problem does not knowing when he fell present a young earth creationist? He fell before his appearance in the garden ... does it have to be more complicated than that?

Because the devil rebelling is why we have this 'flesh' age. And God had Moses pen the rebellion took place in Genesis 1:2 before the 'days' of earth clean up and the creation of flesh bodies wherein the souls that already existed were placed.

Christ Himself told Nicodemus, (John 3) that only those that were born from ABOVE not AGAIN could 'see' the kingdom of God. The devil will never be offered that opportunity as he was before this flesh age sentenced to death. And the devil is called 'death' in Hebrews 2:14. And in verse 10 of John 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, "Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?" So it was NOT a new thing that Christ was teaching.

[dartuser]

No, we are not mind readers ... but your premise that we cannot understand what Moses meant when he penned "evening and morning" is just silly.

Its also frustrating that those (I assume you are ... ) who espouse a reformed theology just cannot stop from running to the New Testament to explain away the plain meaning of the Old.

[Just mythoughts]

That's not what Peter's statment means at all. Peter was explaining why Christ's return was taking longer than some expected and Peter was pointing out how time is relative to God. Under you analysis Peter would have believed that Christ was resurrected three thousand years after his crucifixion. Under your analysis when God told Jeramiah that the Jewish exile would last 70 years he really meant 25.5 million years.

Peter says the scoffers were willingly ignorant of IIPeter 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of,

that by the word of God the heavens were of OLD, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then WAS, being overflowed with water, perished:

7 BUT the heavens and the earth which are NOW, by the same WORD are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

Genesis 1:2 AND the earth was (wrong verb used here as it should be became without form, and void; and 'darkness' (another name for the devil) was upon the face of the deep.

AND the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Back to what God had Peter say the scoffers were willingly ignorant of IIPeter 3:8 BUT, beloved, be NOT ignorant of this one thing,

that one DAY is with the LORD as a thousand years, and a thousand years as ONE day.

verse 9 The LORD is not slack concerning His promise, (what promise?) as some men count slackness;

but is longsuffering to us-ward, NOT willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Here goes Peter again using that 'day' in verse 10 BUT the 'day' of the LORD will come as a thief in the night;

Now if everybody is expecting Jesus to return why would Peter say that His return would be like a thief in the night....

Because most everybody will believe the first supernatural entity upon this earth is Jesus, when it will be none other than the devil playing, 'come to me' I will save you, 'i am' Jesus and it is Written the majority of the inhabitants upon this earth still in flesh bodies will be holy seduced into by his deception.

We know how long Judah spent in Babylon as it is WRITTEN. We also are told what 'new' religion Judah brought back to Jerusalem with them as well, that too is WRITTEN.

[dartuser]

I’m not even going to try ...

[mlo]

"Just don’t roll your eyes and assume biblical creationists are ignorant luddites."

He says as he links to an article relying on the biblical flood story.

[Just mythoughts]

No, we are not mind readers ... but your premise that we cannot understand what Moses meant when he penned "evening and morning" is just silly. Its also frustrating that those (I assume you are ... ) who espouse a reformed theology just cannot stop from running to the New Testament to explain away the plain meaning of the Old.

IT does not matter what you or anyone else thinks Moses meant. The WORD is said to be GOD. John 1:1 IN the beginning.... (that is Genesis 1:1 being quoted) was the WORD, and the WORD was with God, and the WORD was God. And nowhere in the whole of the WORD are we told how long ago that Genesis 1:1 or 2 took place. This earth is filled with the evidence that something very catastrophic took place and nobody knows how long ago that took place. Except that it was far longer than a mere 6 thousand years ago. The closest we can possibly date is the formation of flesh bodies wherein the soul was placed.

You really think that God turned over to Moses the authority to write what Moses wanted to say... Moses was not even born in the flesh when most of what he wrote recording the creation record.

[circlecity]

"Now if everybody is expecting Jesus to return why would Peter say that His return would be like a thief in the night...."

Becasue Peter takes up this whole topic in respone to those who say "Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the begining of creation" (2 Perer 3:4). Thus, Peter is answering those who question why Christ hasn't returned and implemented the kingdom. Everything seems to be going just as it has since creation began. Peter answers by saying people should be patient and that time is different for God because to God, "one day is as a thousand years AND a thousand years as one day. "The Lord is not slow to fulfil his promise as some count slowness, but is patient towards you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance." (2 Peter 3:8-9). Peter tells them not to lose heart and give up hope because it WILL happen and when it does it will be when they leaset expect, as a thief in the night. This is the same meaning the "thief in the night" analogy has when it is used in 1 Thes 5:2.

[Theo]

Question for you: How much water is contained in the mantle of the earth compared with how much water is in all the oceans on the earth’s surface?

Maybe, just maybe, you’re the uninformed one.

[Theo]

Whew. That site is extremely difficult to read and comprehend. Are you able to summarize its relevance to this discussion?

[dartuser]

IT does not matter what you or anyone else thinks Moses meant.

Authorial intent is at the heart of sound hermeneutical principles.

And nowhere in the whole of the WORD are we told how long ago that Genesis 1:1 or 2 took place.

An argument based on silence is not an argument. There is enough evidence from the text to get in the ball park. And, you have suddenly changed the topic from "how long was a day" in Genesis to "how long ago was it."

This earth is filled with the evidence that something very catastrophic took place ...

Its called the flood ... and that happened AFTER Gen 1:1 and 1:2 ... so how would you know what evidence is from some supposed catastrophe in Gen 1:1-2 and what evidence is from the flood?

nobody knows how long ago that took place. Except that it was far longer than a mere 6 thousand years ago

... your logic is is a little short of compelling here.

The closest we can possibly date is the formation of flesh bodies wherein the soul was placed.

lol ... I'm gonna regret asking this ... but what precisely is your evidence for when "formation of flesh bodies" happened?

Someone help me out here ... I'm not sure what theological persuasion believes that all the souls were created, were placed on hold until their bodies were formed, and placed in a body sometime in the future from when it was created.

I'm lost on this one ...

[paladin1_dcs]

bflr

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

dear Julia... do not make light of Almighty God and His Word.. That not my opinion but The Lord Jesus’

But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.
For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned. Matthew 12:36,37

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

Amen!!!! To God be the Glory!

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

If that your position..so be it.. your wrong....lol... but that is you position..

move on... To have a saving relationship to Christ as the Bible teaches is all important... I.F.

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

Thanks for your reply and feed back!

I.F.

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

The bottom line is either you believe God’s word or you do not... That is our choice... and in the end it will make or break us.

God spoke it perfectly into existence... Can not God do that?? (1 Cor 1:18-31). It is too simple for the complex unbelieving mind... Hey for what it’s worth I was raised an evolutionist and went to Catholic Church until I was 24. The Catholic Church endorses the evolution’s theory... that there speaks volumes…

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

Well... that is a good way of explaining it and a pretty logical human theory.. but I choose to believe Almighty God. If we choose to see things from an objective biblical perspective then it is not hard to just believe God and that He spoke into perfectly into existence… all of creation is 6 literal days. God could have spoken it all into existence in one second if He willed… but He chose 6 literal day... Believe it or not...

[The Ignorant Fisherman]

fyi...no abb-laa... bflr

[circlecity]

I’m not sure why you posted that to me. I was defending the 6 literal day position.