Posted on 11/21/2010 8:09:16 AM PST by Cardhu
Pope Benedicts XVI's change of heart on condoms marks a significant break with the damage done by one of his predecessors' most romantic, wicked and wrong-headed policies. The idea of an absolute ban on condoms makes no sense even within the framework of Catholic teaching. Since the purpose of the ban on artificial birth control is to make conception possible, it makes no sense at all in situations in which conception is utterly impossible. That is why Benedict chose a male prostitute as his example of someone who might use a condom to fight disease.
The really interesting question is whether his remarks are supposed to apply even in cases where conception would be possible: may a female prostitute demand that her customers use condoms (assuming for the moment that either party takes much notice of the pope's opinions)? May a wife whose husband is infected? May a husband who has married an HIV positive woman?
It is with questions such as these that the balance lies between regarding the Catholic ban on artificial contraception as merely the romantic wrong-headedness of celibate men, or something actively misogynistic and anti-human. The matter would be simpler, of course, if the Catholic church banned all birth control. But it doesn't. It is only opposed to the effective forms.
But once it has admitted that it is sometimes all right to have sex for reasons other than procreation – and this is conceded, indeed claimed, by everyone who defends "Natural family planning", then the case for condoms as harm reduction becomes unanswerable. Indeed, until today, the question was the easiest way to make any English catholic bishop squirm. They know that their own flock uses artificial birth control. They did not enjoy pretending to believe that poor Africans should risk dying horribly...
(Excerpt) Read more at guardian.co.uk ...
For what he did say, check here:
http://piadesolenni.com/pope-oks-condoms/
He says if somebody were, say, a male prostitute, deciding to use a condom to avoid disease transmission might be seen as a step in the right direction. "BUT" (language comprehension note: "but" indicates the introduction of a contrasting or contradictory concept)....
"BUT it is not really the way to deal with the evil of HIV infection."
From the Times (UK) Online:
"The head of a Harvard-based AIDs prevention centre says the Pope is “correct” to claim that condom distribution risks aggravating the transmission of HIV.
"Last week Benedict XVI incurred the wrath of AIDs campaigners and criticism from the Governments of France and Germany for saying, en route to Africa, that AIDS could not “be overcome by the distribution of condoms.” In comments condemned as “scary” and “alienating” by members of the International Planned Parenthood Federation, Benedict XVI lauded monogamy as a way to combat the spread of AIDs. He said that condom distribution risked exaggerating the spread of the virus.
"Edward C. Green, director of the AIDS Prevention Center at the Harvard Center for Population and Development Studies said this week: “The best evidence we have supports the Pope’s comments.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article5987155.ece
The Pope said nothing wrong. His mistake is assuming normal language comprehenion and/or good-faith reporting standards in the EneMedia.
(You are possibly not all that interested in a patient exposition of the truth. But there are other FReepers lurking and reading, who may find it dubious to take the Guardian ---Britain's most left-wing mass-circulation newspaper, readership 80% Labour Party voters--- and anti-Catholic propagandists as reliable sources of Catholic doctrine.)
A very good question. I encourage you to spend time in prayer and meditation on this question. It reminds me of Pilate's timeless question of Jesus ... "What is Truth"?
You appear to belittle the role of 'the condom war' as a central matter of Truth. IMHO, the horrific mess which exists in this very selfish, hedonistic and wordly culture (abortion, adultery, divorce) are the direct result, as prophetically predicted by Pope Paul VI in Humanae Vitea, of losing this "Great Condom War" in the "free-sex", "free-responsibility", "no religion too", days of the 60's.
The fact that the Catholic Church continues to engage in this war is not new nor to be ridiculed as something that God is not interested in. In fact, it is central to the very core of our human nature, our creation as "in the image of God" and our interpersonal relationships which are intended that we love each other as fellow brothers and sisters in God.
Great wisdom on this "integrated vision of the human person - body, soul, and spirit" can be found in the teachings of the Theology Of The Body
Ergo, your position is that NO ONE should care what the Pope says about sexuality?!! Seriously?! That's the extent of your intellectual argument?
I view this question posed to Pope Benedict XVI (reminds me of the Pharisees trying to 'trip up' Jesus with silly hypothetical situations) as kind of like the following:
"If a thief is on his way to rob a bank, when he parks the getaway car, should he put money in the parking meter".
If the Pope answers 'yes, he should put money in the meter', the lib press rushes out the headline ... "POPE BENEDICT XVI SUPPORTS BANK ROBBERY!"
I really believe that many, if not most, Catholics do not fully realize that Jesus Christ in the Blessed Sacrament is God become man.Now without understanding the power from the Blessed Sacrament by Catholics, nothing else down the line would make any sense to them either, and they become poor disciples of Christ. But, good/great Catholics DO (or DID) exist, Cardhu, and you'll find them in the Lives of the Saints, daily-Mass church pews, lines at Confession, in Adoration Chapels, etc. Here are just a few links to great Catholics:
In fact, it is central to the very core of our human nature, our creation as “in the image of God” and our interpersonal relationships which are intended that we love each other as fellow brothers and sisters in God.
Chastity and reserving sexual relationships solely for marriage is something that any real Christian should be standing for, if you profess Christianity, you should be every bit concerned with chastity as a truth to be defended.
As for the “condom war’ I would agree that this is rediculous. Personally, I believe that sex to someone who is not your spouse is wrong, regardless of whether contraceptives are used. Condom use is often associated with sex outside of marriage, too, and honestly, promiscuity is not infinitely safe, either.
What would God have us to do during this time of great spiritual deception and war? Take a stand on condoms?{{{{sigh}}} I don't think so..A poster gave you the link to Humanae Vitae, smvoice, and I would like to second that as being an extraordinary encyclical for you to read. It is spot on.
Homosexual sex has nothing to do with procreation. It is a meaningless activity biologically.
“The Church has never approached these questions in the black-and-white manner in which it is often portrayed.”
As Vladimir Ilyich Lenin said, “Accuse others of what you do.” It is the God-haters who are mono-dimensional.
“as I explained in my post #10.”
You haven’t explained anything, ever. All you ever do is babble lunatic nonsense that anyone possessed of good sense ignores.
Obviously read it to pass judgement so by you own admission you do not have good sense.
Don’t be too hard on yourself you are in good company.
Well of course, we all come here to defend MSM lies.
The Guardian is quite wrong about what Pope Benedict actually said.
If condoms were the panacea against AIDS why is it that north Africa which doesn’t have many condoms have an infection rate an order of magnitude less?
The English translation was "male prostitutes" but the Italian translation in Observatório Romano was "prostitutes."
Anyway, it is a good idea for the ladies to protect themselves even if El Papa disapproves.
North Africa is has a much greater exchange of population with Europe thus such aids are more readily available.
Travel in Southern Spain and see the hundreds of cars loaded to the axles carrying everything including water as the make for the Ferry across the Straits.
Sub Saharan Africa is peopled, by and large, by poorer, less educated and more isolated citizens which have been engaged in almost constant wars for fifty years, that could be a possible explanation.
That is what these threads are for to sound off and try and express your own take on the information you are given.
Here’s what the Pope said that LMSM left out:
“But it is not the proper way to deal with the horror of HIV infection.”
The Pope did NOT change his mind.
Next, will LMSM try to say he changed his mind on abortion? I would not put it past them.
Is the use of condoms still a ‘sin’ or just the “last resort”?
The use of contraceptive by married couples is prohibited by Catholic dogma.
People participating in hedonistic, sexual self-pleasure aren't really Catholics anyway, so none of the teachings of the Church apply to them.
Why can't people who don't believe in or practice Catholicism join some other church that celebrates their behavior?
Why can't they be honest about who they are an what they believe?
Why do they insist on "remaining" in the Church, and demand that the Church change?
Why not create a Church of the Holy Condom, if they are so wonderful?
I vote for this as the MORONIC post of the day.
If they do not listen to the Pope regarding chastity and choose to prostitute themselves WHY would you think they listen to the Pope regarding condom use?
GET A CLUE. No one has to "obey" the Pope... Carry the discussion one step further and one sees why this issue is even discussed -it is but a leftist attack on Church teaching that useful idiots for the left join in on...
YOU are about as intellectually "elite" as my *ss -you leftist tool...
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