Skip to comments.Feeling overwhelmed [Mormonism - Open]
Posted on 02/17/2011 12:17:20 AM PST by Colofornian
The Ensign (official LDS monthly magazine) has a regular column entitled Questions and Answers. Each month a different question is posed with answers supplied by LDS members. The February issue poses this question: I often feel overwhelmed because I dont feel I measure up to all thats expected of me in living the gospel. How can I learn to rejoice in the gospel when I feel like I may never by able to become or do all the Lord requires of me? This question is followed by the answers of eight different individuals. (To see the whole article, go to www.lds.org/ensign)
What struck me was how all the answers acknowledged the struggle but put the burden back on the person. The advice was to take it one step at a time; to keep priorities straight; obey the commandments; remember that the Lord is encouraging us, etc. Not once was the Lords forgiveness mentioned. I wonder how these answers give true lasting relief.
Heres my answer.
I can understand why you feel you arent measuring up. You feel that way because you, or nobody else for that matter, cant! Sin has so devastated us that no matter how focused we are or how much effort we exert, we will fail. Even the apostle Paul had to confess: For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. (Romans 7:19) Nothing is more sobering and overwhelming than taking a honest inventory of ourselves and seeing how often we dont measure up to Gods commandments.
That is why God, in the Scriptures, tells us the wonderful news that Jesus has already done everything required and he did all this, not just as our example, but mainly, as our substitute. by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous (Romans 5:19)
Seeing that is the secret to joy. Seeing that God counts me as already perfect because Jesus was perfect for me instills a joy that is truly indescribable. The key to joy is not focusing on your efforts, but on Christs efforts and the fact that he has already done all that is required for you. That gives me joy each and every day. I pray that you can have that same joy.
Mark Cares's response: What struck me was how all the answers acknowledged the struggle but put the burden back on the person. The advice was to take it one step at a time; to keep priorities straight; obey the commandments; remember that the Lord is encouraging us, etc. Not once was the Lords forgiveness mentioned. I wonder how these answers give true lasting relief...Even the apostle Paul had to confess: For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do. (Romans 7:19) Nothing is more sobering and overwhelming than taking a honest inventory of ourselves and seeing how often we dont measure up to Gods commandments.
We don't measure up. You can take the Mormon pull-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps approach; or you can rely upon God's grace; His forgiveness; His strength perfected in your weakness.
The latter is truly Good News! The other? (No wonder the apostle Paul asked: 1O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? (Gal. 3:1-3)
Ya know, I too don’t feel I measure up to all that God wants me to be.
But, I’ve come to accept that God expects me to do my best, earnestly and that is his plan.
We were put here to build our spiritual character.
How about if one start from God’s point of view “There is none worthy, no, not one” and you can progress from there?
It’s not a race, there are no points and your conscience will compel a new course or just keep scratching at the top of your brain.
God’s point is we can never be perfect. We are man and will break from perfect righteousness.
Give yourself a break. You ain’t ever going to be worthy but you will always be forgiven.
You are God the Father’s child and he welcomes you... always.
Well, this is where I believe Gal. 2:20 kicks in: I have been crucified with Christ...no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me."
I think this life is a matter of decreasing who we are (as John the Baptist said, "I must decrease; He must increase") -- and the best way is to simply yield...surrender. Concede our weaknesses; our frailties; our "we can't go on" times. And simply ask God to live and continue on in and through us.
Isn't that what the Holy Spirit indwelling us is meant to yield? (His fruit? Not ours)
We were put here to build our spiritual character.
Yes. Character as that of Christ's. Christlikeness. Godliness. And in this way, God thinks a lot longer term than we do.
Mormonism confuses the transferable characteristics of Christ (like His virtues and Moral nature) with that which is not: Like becoming divine; or competing with God for the worship of others.
If there's a bottom line that Mormons should stop and contemplate, it's this: If a temple Mormon is currently exercising his options to become a god, does he know he is intending to steal glory from God? Does he know that every time he would receive worship and prayer from the beings on his planet, that is worship & prayer meant for God alone?
Idolatry is serious business.
“And he said, Woe unto you also, ye lawyers! for ye lade men with burdens grievous to be borne, and ye yourselves touch not the burdens with one of your fingers.” [Luke 11:46, KJV.]
“For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. [Matthew 11:30, KJV.]
It’s very sad to read that a person is trying to set their heart right with the Lord, but misguided by a system they have been taught is the only way. When with the Lord, it is only right that s/he be able to rejoice. If not, something is badly off.
I just wish the one posing the question on the site would have go on to explain further, “...never by able to become or do all the Lord requires of me?”
Utah, particularly Utah women, lead the nation in use and abuse of mood-altering prescriptions.
Perfection, aside from being impossible, is a difficult load to bear, especially when you have to put on a mask and act like everything’s fine in public.
If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums you will notice a pattern. There's an anti-Mormon group of people here that spends a great deal of their time attacking the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They post regurgitated propaganda on an almost daily basis.
They have a misguided obsession. You can witness many different tactics employed that you might find quite interesting. The straw man argument is a big favorite and is frequently preceded by cherry-picking quotes or other material. After the "quotation" the attacker will misrepresent what has been said or what was meant and then attack their own interpretation.Later they will have the audacity to claim they were "only" quoting our own material.
They will of course insist ad nauseum that they are merely using our sources and are therefore innocent of any deceptive practice. LDS persons have no issue whatsoever having our scriptures or leaders quoted as long as it is presented fairly and accurately. This is rarely (if ever) done.
Another favorite is posting scripture or statements which on their own really present no dilemma. They make something out of nothing while never bringing up a single objection that hasn't been addressed a hundred times before.
You might note a couple of other tactics used to try to antagonize is the use of disrespectful or insulting terms or language and/or pictures. That's a Christlike thing to do right? Yeah I don't think so either. It does speak volumes about them though.
Some of them claim being some sort of special witness to you as being supposedly former Mormons. So someone who is an ex-member of any organization would never have an axe to grind or have reason to try to justify their actions by any means? Perhaps not but perhaps so. The LDS Church gains members from other denominations as well as others faiths all the time. This doesn't make them an expert on anything and you certainly won't hear them attacking their forner Church.
Frequently they cruise the headlines of the day seeking any story that might be twisted into making the Church look bad. Anything will do, just watch the progression of posts following it and see what I mean.
After reading their posts, I invite you to seek the truth about whatever "issue" they seem to be "revealing" or "exposing". I promise that if you do so with honest intent, the "ahah" moments you will have will be many and frequent. You will start to recognize the tactics employed to cleverly twist and attack and will likely chuckle the more you see. In actuality, there's nothing new here. It's all been addressed many times before.
The latest twist in the anti-Mormon propaganda machine is to actually go to the links provided, but then they cherry pick what they want, then quote and straw man attack that. Clever. It almost appears that they are helping you, the seeker of truth out by doing some footwork for you. Not so much. Don't be insulted, look for yourself. It's not the haystack they want you to think.
Here's a few links to get your started from a different viewpoint. I have found that the vast majority of the "issues" brought up can be found and addressed at http://www.fairlds.org/ but here's more:
Now you will likely notice the "you never address or answer our points" posts pop up as usual. All after providing the answers just as you have here.
Sometimes it is claimed that these sites present a needle in a haystack. Far from it. But if you give up before you try you won't know will you? They often state that these sites provide no answer. They just don't want you looking. It is as simple as that.
Will you wear blinders too? Seek truth. Find out for yourself. Want to chat with someone on any topic? A few of these sites provide just that. So do your homework sincere seeker of truth. Listen and read from both "sides". Make up your own mind.
I witness to you of these truths and wish you the best, in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Amen.
An OFFICIAL lds magazine with questions and answers from lds and yet you still post links from unofficial lds sites. Strange.
Click on the kitty
ALL: Yes, svcw has caught the strange irony. Here a thread's been posted where it says, "To see the whole article, go to www.lds.org/ensign)."
Yet Mormon 'gon Def comes on & quickly says (in effect): "Pay no attention to those official Lds men behind the Ensign screen; instead you need to focus on the unofficial screens I've placed in front of you -- you know, the fire & smoke down the huge cavernous hallway; listen only to the thundering voice of the Mormon apologists!"
Been there, done that, paid the money, saw the movie and wore the underwear. It is a horrible burden for Utah women who must be seen as perfect, even though perfection is far beyond our reach.
Oh what are you objecting to this time, for the love of Mike? Nothing but sympathy and kind words have been offered for the poor people struggling with this.
What would your advice be PD? Be like you? Never falter, never fail?
I found this interesting in the link:
Deseret News, Feb. 27, 1856, 402
President Brigham Young explained this doctrine: If I do not know the will of my Father, and what he requires of me in a certain transaction, if I ask him to give me wisdom concerning any requirement in life or in regard to my own course, or that of my friends, my family, my children, or those that I preside over, and get no answer from him, and then do the very best that my judgment will teach me, he is bound to own and honor that transaction, and he will do so to all intents and purposes.
BY is saying here that if he asks the lds god and the lds god does not respond and he does his (BY) best that the lds god is bound to his (BY) actions. That man can dictate to the lds god, the lds god’s actions, not very godly if you ask me.
I often feel overwhelmed because I dont feel I measure up to all thats expected of me in living the gospel. How can I learn to rejoice in the gospel when I feel like I may never by able to become or do all the Lord requires of me?
By coming out of that dreary trap of the devil called mormonism and believing in and being free and joyful in the LORD Jesus Christ of the Christian Bible, who is God...
To the Jews who had believed Him, Jesus said, “If you hold to My teaching, you are really My disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
The scribes and Pharisees said to Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?”
Jesus replied, “I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.
I know you are Abraham’s descendants. Yet you are ready to kill Me, because you have no room for my Word. I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you do what you have heard from your father.”
“Abraham is our father,” they answered.
“If you were Abraham’s children,” said Jesus, “then you would do the things Abraham did. As it is, you are determined to kill Me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. Abraham did not do such things. You are doing the things your own father does.”
“We are not illegitimate children,” they protested. “The only Father we have is God himself.”
Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and now am here. I have not come on my own; but He sent Me. Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say.
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
Yet because I tell the truth, you do not believe me! Can any of you prove me guilty of sin? If I am telling the truth, why don’t you believe me? He who belongs to God hears what God says.
The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.” John 8:31-47
Exactly! Mormon's believe that a covenant is a two way street, and if they do what the mormon god demands, then the mo-god is obligated to give them exactly what they think he promised. That was once of the first chinks in the armor of Mormonism for me - that bad things happen to good people.
Say what? So if their “god” doesn’t answer a prayer, they are free to do whatever they like and their god is REQUIRED to honor it?
How do Mormons explain non-Mormons who have lived “blessed” lives? Large fortunes, many children, large houses, new cars, etc, all the earthly treasures that Mormonism wears like a badge of godliness?
I remember a while back a certain poster, she-who-must-not-be-pinged, insisted that that’s how she knew Mormonism was true, by the prosperity that has been given her family.
Satan's temptations? << shrug>>
By that reasoning, the Saudi King must be a Mormon Prophet with all his money, children and harem of women.
I like how Mormons say because Joseph Smith said so. That's suppose to end all arguments.
Posting from actual lds links, posting actual lds words -exposing mormonISM for what it actually is - place marker
I feel like I may never by able to become or do all the Lord requires of me
Good you are suppose to feel like that...
God is able...you are not...
Now unto Him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us, Unto Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen. Ephesians 3:20, 21
And whatsoever ye shall ask in My name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask any thing in My name, I will do it. John 14:13, 14
Lets look at that statement...
1. all that (the lord) requires of me...
Who, what which is “the lord” according to mormons ???
When a mormon mentions “the lord” what does that mormon mean ???
Are the “requirements” written down somewhere ???
When we read the Christian bible and what the LORD Jesus Christ has to say, we find that there are no individual requirements set just for a particular person...
the requirements are the same for all believers...
So if the lowest person on the totem pole must do something so must the one at the top...
However in mormonism the highest guy, Tommy Monson does not do what he requires of the peons...
For instance, Ask Tommy Monson demands that the lowly members of mormonism clean the toilets of the mormon buildings..
Ask Tommy Monson calls this unpaid employment a “calling” from the mormon god...
Thus something that is one of those “all the lord requires”
Since this secular activity is consdered “holy” in mormon circles why doesnt more-holier-than-any-other Ask Tommy insist on doing all the toilets himself so that he will be holier even more so ???
His amount of “holiness” could cause all those toilets to be sparkly-clean-eat-off in 2 seconds flat...
another point would be the greed err need for the mormon god to use the tithes and offerings of the lowly members to buy land, businesses, build malls that only Ask Tommy and a selected few could afford to shop in..
Why isnt Ask Tommy and the Romneys and the Marriotts and the other multi billionaire mormon CEOs not forking over all their money till it hurts as they require the lowly mormons to do ???
Plus theres the new resorts which the lowly mormons will also not be able to afford to stay at...
Why would Ask Tommy go to a place his followers could not go ???
The LORD Jesus Christ never went anywhere good that we cannot go to...
Hes coming back to take us to that wonderful resort called Heaven...
Hes already bought and paid for our tickets and rooms and food and activities and vacation clothes with His blood upon the Cross..
Whens the last time Ask Tommy ever took some poor widow women or other poor people to Hawaii ???
Whens the last time Ask Tommy ever let his wallet bleed outside his little cabal circle of fellow henchmen who would pay him back ???
No little mormon, its not God who makes these “requirements” of you...
Its Ask Tommy and his cohorts who demand from you your money and time for their glory and advancement and to line their pockets...
God gets nothing from your slavery to the demonic institution called mormonism...
2. I may never be able to become or do
we were never meant to struggle along, alone, and try to do it all ourselves...
Thats why the LORD Jesus Christ sent us the Holy Ghost ...
To be a helper, a comforter, a teacher, a guide...
And I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. John 14:16:18
But the Comforter, who is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. John 14:26
Howbeit when He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth: for He shall not speak of Himself; but whatsoever He shall hear, that shall He speak: and He will shew you things to come. John 16:13
and thats just another glaring difference betwen mormonism and Christianity
Mormonism is not Christianity...
An Open Letter to Mormons who are
sincere about their faith...(and are embarrassed! by the posts of self-styled
"defender-mormons" who can't or won't defend)If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums
you will notice a pattern. Theres a group of
Christians who spend a great deal of time posting
from Official Mormon Sources - both the Book of
Mormon as well as Mormon Prophets and Church
materials - real quotes from real mormon materials.You will also notice that many of these Christians
are former Mormons who left Mormonism and come to
know the Biblical Jesus Christ and His Gospel of Grace.They have a passion to reach Mormons to share what
they learned about Salvation by grace and apart
from the never ending treadmill of human works...Of course, they are attacked regularly by a very,
small group of Mormons who have zeal, but no real
knowledge beyond what the Mormon Church has told
them. You've seen this with your own eyes on this
thread and others, so I'm not telling you anythingyou don't already know.Why can't these so-called "defenders" provide any:Objective Facts
Or Logical supportAnything OBJECTIVE that any reasonable person would
see and agree that it lends support the claims of
Mormonism.Why can't they do this?If Mormonism is true, why is it based only onsubjective feelings and why doesn't it have thesame kind of objective support the Bible does?Has God changed?Is He no longer able to weave His story into history,into the fabric of human DNA, into the findings ofarcheology, and into geography? Do you believe He hasbecome powerless?I bet you do not believe that.So why would God provide every kind of objective support
for the Bible's rich history and none for the Book of
Mormon? Why?These "defenders" post links over and over again that
address things yet never provide an answer that is
buttressed by the ring of truth, echoed by history,
archeology, genetics, geography, etc.If they could support the claims of Mormonism with facts,
you know they would. But it never happens here. You maybe new to these threads, but I've read almost every onefor the past 6 years. I can tell you that it is alwaysthe same as this thread. No facts, no evidence, no logicalargument.People deserve more than subjective feelings and useless
links to non-answers.You deserve more than feelings and hollow links.After reading both sides on this thread and others,
you may very well be wondering about what you were
taught when you joined the LDS church. You also may
be wondering how to resolve the lack of facts, evidence
and logical suport for Mormonism's claims.You are not alone in wondering this.Many have approached those of us who are Christians
asking where to find out more and some, even, to ask
how to come to know the Biblical Christ and some even how
to gracefully leave Mormonism and start a new life with
Christ.Many here have already set out to finally and joyfully know
the true God and Savior. They understand the terrible choice
of being totally sincere about your faith, but increasingly
concerned that it isn't everything you once believed and hopedfor.
After coming to know the truth, they are on a path that givesthem the rest God promised to His children and the certaintyof His ultimate plan for them. Nothing brings them greater joythan helping a friend who has the same questions.There are places online that you can visit to learn more aboutMormonism.If something is true, it can withstand any question, no matterhow tough. If it is false, it is better to know while your lifeis in front of you. You can read these resources without fear.http://www.irr.org/mit/default.html
http://www.mormoncurtain.com/Links may raise more questions and concerns and sometimes it
helps to have someone who has already wrestled through these
issues.I invite you to private FReep-mail any of the Christians
on this thread to ask questions about the concerns you have.We always do our best to directly answer your questions with
facts, evidence and logical support.Take a step.Roll the dice.What do you have to lose at this point? And you have much togain.There is peace and rest waiting for you.All the Best,
Dear Ask Tommy
I often feel overwhelmed because I dont feel I measure up to all thats expected of me in living the gospel. How can I learn to rejoice in the gospel when I feel like I may never by able to become or do all the Lord requires of me?
Are you paying your tithe ?
Are you obeying the Law of Consecration ?
Are you obeying the Fasting Sundays doctrine ?
Are you supporting your bishop with your offerings ?
Are you true to your callings ?
Have you fulfilled your calling to a two year mission ?
Do you sustain the prophet Joseph Smith as king err mormon god err mormon lord err prophet ?
Do you know that the book of mormon is true ?
If you are obeying all the requirements then you will be happy.
Maybe you need to be a missionary to the Online mission field where there are many unfortunate souls who have never heard of the prophet Joseph and the restored mormon thingy
Now to show your ultimate thankfulness for this ex-templa revelation, cross my palm with silver err send in your mega bucks err show your support for our team by sharing our colors, green and green, dollars that is, with those unfortunates who are forced by the lord to suffer for you in the pentehouses err the penitance of temple square.
The thinking has already been done, just follow the "prophet"
Bumping the thread right along.
Yet day after day, the people I led astray keep posting on FreeRepublic and knocking on doors to mislead people. Please, I beg you, stop!!!
Oh, how I regret how Satan used me to lead millions astray! If only I had a second chance to change things! FLEE! Before it is too late! Flee the cult of mormonism! I testify to you, I lied. I now know the danger of the fraud I committed against humanity. Do not follow my path.
A great big AMEN! to that, Brother Smith!
Q.Discernment-wise, how do we know whether people are led by the Holy Spirit?
A. At the very least, we know that the MAIN testimony is not to an institution. Especially a cultic hierarchical one that replaces Jesus Christ as the Permanent Head Prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ on earth (Heb. 1:1-2).
The HQ of the true church on earth isn't beholden to being in Salt Lake City. The HQ is heaven.
The Holy Spirit testifies to the Person, Jesus Christ, not to an institution. (Note, too, Jesus said in John 5:39 that even the Bible testifies to Him!) If you want Biblical proof for the Holy Spirit's ongoing testimony of Jesus -- and not a church structure -- see...
...Romans 8:16; 9:1
...1 Peter 1:11
...Acts 5:32; 6:10
...1 John 5:6
By sharp contrast, if you ever were to attend a Mormon monthly testimony meeting, many testimonies focus on the Mormon church and on a mere man, Joseph Smith. These are substitutes for Jesus Christ...frankly, idolatry.
Coming up this April is the 50th anniversary of the one of the more prominent examples of Mormon idolatry re: a statement made by a Romney! You see Mitt Romney's father had a cousin named Marion G. Romney, who was one of the top three hierarchical guys in the Mormon church.
Each year, the Mormons have two general conferences where the words of their leaders are regarded as near Scripture-like revelations to their followers. Now what did Marion G. Romney have to say in lifting up the Mormon church as THE competitor to what the Bible says about Jesus Christ in John 14:6?
"This Church is the ensign on the mountain spoken of by the Old Testament prophets. IT is the way, the truth, and the life" (Conference Report, April, 1961, p. 119)
Wow! Utter idolatry! Only by God's grace was SLC not opened up and sent into the chasm right then and there. Jesus Christ ALONE qualifies as "I am the Way, the truth, and the life. NO man comes to the Father, but by me." (John 14:6)
Q. Does the Mormon church regularly substitute the Mormon church for Jesus Christ?
A. Well, let me provide you another example. Last March, Greyfoxx posted an article by Lds "apostle" Jeffrey Holland. Here's an excerpt from that article: Latter-day Saints believe that other aspects of Christ's gift are conditional upon obedience and diligence in keeping God's commandments. For example, while members of the human family are freely and universally given a reprieve from Adam's sin through no effort or action of their own, they are not freely and universally given a reprieve of their own sins unless they pledge faith in Christ, repent of those sins, are baptized in his name, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost and confirmation into Christ's church...
Q. Now what was Holland claiming there? Especially "Christ's church" -- does He mean the church at-large? Or just the Mormon church?
A. Just the Mormon church. Furthermore Did you all catch the rest of what this Mormon "apostle" was claiming??? Per Mormonism -- this means that if you join the "wrong" church, your "reprieve of" your "own sins" isn't going to come from your pardon-Governing god. (More "conditions").
This Mormon "apostle" claims: they are not freely and universally given a reprieve of their own sins unless they...receive...confirmation into Christ's church... (meaning the Mormon church!)
So the church then -- in this case the Mormon church -- becomes the "substitutionary replacement" as the sin-bearer of your personal sins vs. Jesus Christ. What blasphemy!
What is it about Lds general authorities that they think they can toss around Christ's blood as to who it will reprieve and who it won't? I mean that's what the whole Lds false historical doctrine of blood atonement was all about! Why don't grassroots Mormons ever hold their leaders accountable for obvious past (& present) false doctrines? (Even things they patently know are false!)
I call upon this false apostle (Holland) to repent, and for Mormon grassroots to find the backbone to realize God holds us accountable for replacing Christ and His blood with a church structure. The same "woe" Jesus gives in Luke 11 is appropriate to leaders of the Mormon church: "Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering." (Luke 11:52)
This is a serious warning Christ gave. Heed it as such.