Cafeteria Catholics: Arnold and Maria Schwarznegger

Speroforum ^ | June 6, 2011 | Mary Ann Kreitzer

[Maine Mariner]

I recently returned from a three week visit to Ireland, mostly in the western part near Galway but several days in Dublin. I found everyone to be very friendly and hold a genuine friendship to Americans.

I certainly cannot understand how any Irish person could blame the US for the IRA. Was not the IRA formed by Michael
Collins in about 1918?

[Maine Mariner]

I recently returned from a three week visit to Ireland, mostly in the western part near Galway but several days in Dublin. I found everyone to be very friendly and hold a genuine friendship to Americans.

I certainly cannot understand how any Irish person could blame the US for the IRA. Was not the IRA formed by Michael
Collins in about 1918?

[Zionist Conspirator]

The reasons there are so many cafeteria Catholics in the American Church is that Catholicism is, at least in the Protestant United States, a minority ethnic religion. Catholic identity is not so much religious beliefs as us vs. them, and "us" are Irish (or Italians or Poles or Hispanics), urban, Democrats, and Catholics. Everyone born into a traditionally Catholic ethnic group feels entitled to be considered a "good Catholic" regardless of anything he does or believes. For these people being told they could theoretically be kicked out of the Catholic Church is like being told they could be kicked out of the Irish ethnicity.

The problem of "ethnic only" Jews has often been commented upon by Torah Jews and by religious conservatives. Perhaps the Church should issue some sort of statement to the effect that there is no such thing as an "ethnic only" Catholic. Of course, that won't happen, and if it did, no one would pay attention anyway.

[Palladin]

Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (the liberal Lutherans).

The conservative Luthies are the Missouri Synod.

[freedumb2003]

>>Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (the liberal Lutherans).<<

Ah. Thanks!

Why does the idea of liberal Lutherans make me slightly anxious...?

[RnMomof7]

At least she was honest

Luk 11:39 And the Lord said unto him, Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward part is full of ravening and wickedness.

[MarkBsnr]

I watched Arnold at Reagans funeral the other day. He crossed himself backwards.

The Eastern and Western Churches formerly did right to left; over the last millennium, the practice in the West has gradually changed. Pope Innocent III ca. 1200 gave the instruction for right to left. Was not able to find a good explanation for the change.

[MarkBsnr]

That was lousy wording.

I meant to say that the Orthodox still to this day do right to left. Perhap Ahhhnuld was influenced by the Orthodox in his life. In Europe, the wedding band is normally worn on the right hand, as well.

[RobbyS]

Well, in part. The Church sought to unify the many immigrants by accomodating their national cultures under a hierarchy that was predominantly Irish. They were opposed by the Germans, but the Germans were limited by the fact that the Germans were not AN ethnic group but several ethnic groups speaking—more or less- the same language. Speaking English, the Irish could appeal to the second generation of all nationalities who wanted a more Americanized version of thei own faith. However, as the Irish themselves became assimilated, they —like the Kennedies—to model themselves after the Protestant Establishment. Breaking into the magic circle for them was an experience not unlike that of the Jews. And like the Jews, the Irish became less religious, and so began to lose their identity. The Proestant Establishment has since the 1960s secularized, and it seems to becoming the new normal for the top 20% of the population.

[BenKenobi]

“But if you don’t respect your obligations to Christ and His Church, why would you respect your obligations to another person?”

Thought of the day.

I would say the five pillars of Catholicism are these. If someone asked me to explain to a protestant quickly what Catholicism teaches, this is how I would do it.

1. The Church is not a democracy. We do not vote on doctrine. Doctrine is divine, handed down by God. Doctrine is expressed, in equal measure, through Sacred Scripture and the Traditions handed down from the Apostles.

2. The Church believes that God created Man in his image and that life must be preserved from conception to natural death. Men derive their God given rights from God and are tasked with dominion over all the earth. Men are proscribed by duly established government insofar as said government does not deprive them of their natural rights.

3. The church declares 7 sacraments, all of which are universal throughout the church and permanent. They are Baptism, Confirmation, Communion, Confession, Holy Orders, Marriage and Extreme Unction. Marriage is between one man and one woman for life.

4. The Magisterium is formed from the college of bishops who themselves were ordained by their predecessors all the way back to St. Peter. The head of the magisterium is the Pope who has the authority to speak on matters of faith and morals infalliably through the blessings of Christ.

5. We believe in the unity of the Church through Jesus Christ the Son of God, who is the Son of the Holy Trinity, Father, Son, Holy Spirit. He was born of the Virgin, suffered, and died on the cross crucified by Pilate. He descended into hell, rose again and is seated with God the Almighty Father and promises his return. All who believe in him shall be saved.

[RobbyS]

My guess is that Arnold doesn’t cross himself regularly, and when called upon to do it in public, might easily be confused. OR, maybe that is the way they do it in Austria.

[MarkBsnr]

My guess is that Arnold doesn’t cross himself regularly, and when called upon to do it in public, might easily be confused. OR, maybe that is the way they do it in Austria.

Both are plausible: one is more plausible than the other...