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LDS Vision of the dead claimed as ‘revelation’ on Halloween, 1918 [The OTHER World Series: Vanity]
Colofornian | Oct. 31, 2011 | Colofornian

Posted on 10/31/2011 4:27:06 PM PDT by Colofornian

Halloween, 1918. The then “prophet” of the Mormon church, Joseph F. Smith, submits a “vision” of the dead he has “to the counselors in the First Presidency, the Council of the Twelve, and the Patriarch, and by them unanimously accepted…”(Gospel Doctrine, 2:277, published by The First Presidency of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1971)

Joseph F. Smith, the nephew of Mormon founder Joseph Smith, had claimed that he saw “the hosts of the dead, both small and great...an innumerable company of the spirits of the just” (Lds Doctrine & Covenants, 138:11-12) -- and these spirits were just waiting for Mormon missionaries to come their way to be redeemed.

Joseph F. Smith claimed that the Mormon “Jesus” had prepared "the faithful spirits of the prophets who had testified of him in the flesh; That they might carry the message of redemption unto all the dead, unto whom he could not go personally, because of their rebellion and transgression, that they through the ministration of his servants might also hear his words.” (D&C 138:37-38)

Joseph F. Smith was almost 80 and had recently gone through a few deaths in his family. He himself was on the last legs of his life as he wouldn’t see December of that year.

“Six weeks before President Smith died, he received an important revelation about the redemption of the dead. He…learned that faithful Saints have the opportunity to continue teaching the gospel in the world of spirits. This revelation was added to the Pearl of Great Price in 1976 and in 1979 it was transferred to the Doctrine and Covenants as section 138.” (Mormon publication: Our Heritage: A Brief History of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, p. 107)

“The dead are not perfect without us, neither are we without them [see D&C 128:18],” claimed Joseph F. Smith, a quote published in a church-published book in 1998 (Teachings of Presidents: Joseph Smith, p. 410)

Visions of the dead popping up to this Mormon “prophet” in 1918 was nothing new.

The Mormon church officially reiterated in 2007 the Mormon claim that the ghost of Joseph Smith appeared to Brigham Young three years after his death. Whether it was Smith’s ghost, or a demon masquerading as such, wasn’t debated in the official Mormon church publication:

“In February 1847, nearly three years after the Prophet Joseph Smith was martyred, he appeared to President Brigham Young…” (Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Joseph Smith, p. 98, 2007)

One of the highest-ranking Mormon leaders in the 19th century, Lds First President/“apostle” Heber C. Kimball claimed that "Joseph Smith continued visiting myself and others up to a certain time, and then it stopped." (Deseret Weekly News, 53:112, Temples of the Most High, 1896, p. 345)

Young and Kimball apparently weren’t alone. The ‘demon/ghost’ Smith apparition appeared to the same Lds “prophet” who began to halt polygamy, Wilford Woodruff. Woodruff claimed one October day that…

After the death of Joseph Smith I saw and conversed with him many times in my dreams in the night season…when I awoke many of the things he had told me were taken from me, I could not comprehend them. I have had many interviews with Brother Joseph until the last 15 or 20 years of my life; I have not seen him for that length of time. But during my travels in the southern country last winter I had many interviews with President Young, and with Heber C. Kimball, and Geo. A. Smith, and Jedediah M. Grant, and many others who are dead. They attended our conference, they attended our meetings. And on one occasion, I saw Brother Brigham and Brother Heber ride in carriage ahead of the carriage in which I rode when I was on my way to attend conference; and they were dressed in the most priestly robes. When we arrived at our destination I asked Prest. Young if he would preach to us. He said, "No, I have finished my testimony in the flesh I shall not talk to this people any more. But (said he) I have come to see you; I have come to watch over you, and to see what the people are doing. (Journal of Discourses, pp. 317-318 by Wilford Woodruff, Oct 10, 1880)

These occultic visitations stopped -- only to reoccur in the 1890s: Mormons claim that when they opened their temple in the Spring of 1893, "Some Latter-day Saints saw...past Presidents of the Church and other deceased Church leaders." (Our Heritage: A Brief History of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 1996, p. 102)

At times, Lds leaders recognized these spirit-entities for who they are...other times, no. For example, Heber C. Kimball described the spirits who descended upon him while serving as a missionary in Preston, England:

“We gazed upon them about an hour and a half (by Willard’s watch). We were not looking towards the window, but towards the wall. Space appeared before us, and we saw the devils coming in legions, with their leaders, who came within a few feet of us. They came towards us like armies rushing to battle They appeared to be men of full stature, possessing every form and feature of men in the flesh, who were angry and desperate; and I (Kimball) shall never forget the vindictive malignity depicted on their countenances as they looked me in the eye; and any attempt to paint the scene which then presented itself, or portray their malice and enmity, would be vain. I perspired exceedingly, my clothes becoming as wet as if I had been taken out of the river. I felt excessive pain, and was in the greatest distress for sometime. (Orson F. Whitney, The Life of Heber C. Kimball, Bookcraft, Utah. 1945, pp. 130-131).

Spirit-entity manifestations to Mormons continue into the current era, as one reference to “evil spirits” haunting the Lds Brazilian Mission confirms:

"A few years ago while touring the missions of South America, I heard President William Grant Gangerter of the Brazilian Mission make some interesting comments. He reported that there had been a wave of incidents in which evil spirits were afflicting the missionaries and the Saints. At every conference the missionaries were relating experiences they were having with evil spirits. The intensity of their influence was frightening." (Come Unto Christ, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, for 1984, 1988 published 1983, 1986 p. 109)


TOPICS: General Discusssion; History; Other Christian; Other non-Christian; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: inman; lds; mormon; thedead; vision
Part of The OTHER World Series -- content you won't find the 52,000 Mormon missionaries discussing out on the highways and biways.

From the article: Joseph F. Smith, the nephew of Mormon founder Joseph Smith, had claimed that he saw “the hosts of the dead, both small and great...

What's worse is the Mormon church claims this is as much "scripture" as anything in the Bible.

The Bible references people minus the true Christ as being spiritually dead (see Ephesians 2:1-4).

For Mormons, “The dead are not perfect without us, neither are we without them [see D&C 128:18],” claimed Joseph F. Smith, a quote published in a church-published book in 1998 (Teachings of Presidents: Joseph Smith, p. 410)

Ah. The spiritually dead are interlocked with the physically dead, eh?

The article documents how Lds "prophets" Brigham Young and Wilford Woodruff, as well as one of the second-in-charge First Presidents of Young, Heber C. Kimball, all claimed the ghost of Joseph Smith appeared anywhere from "once" (Brigham Young) to multiple conversations (Kimball and Woodruff).

From the article: Spirit-entity manifestations to Mormons continue into the current era, as one reference to “evil spirits” haunting the Lds Brazilian Mission confirms: "A few years ago while touring the missions of South America, I heard President William Grant Gangerter of the Brazilian Mission make some interesting comments. He reported that there had been a wave of incidents in which evil spirits were afflicting the missionaries and the Saints. At every conference the missionaries were relating experiences they were having with evil spirits. The intensity of their influence was frightening." (Come Unto Christ, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, for 1984, 1988 published 1983, 1986 p. 109)

Since Lds regard the "temple" as something that is man-made -- vs. the people God makes and re-creates in His Son, the temple of the Holy Spirit -- that missing Holy Ghost leaves Mormon missionaries at the mercy of evil spirits.

1 posted on 10/31/2011 4:27:08 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: All
Mormonism teaches of a very thin veil between the dead and the living:

Joseph Smith:

"The spirits...are blessed in their departure to the world of spirits. Enveloped in flaming fire, they are not far from us, and know and understand our thoughts, feelings, and motions, and are often pained therewith." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 326)

* Lds “apostle” Parley Pratt said: "...we frequently hold communication with our departed father, mother, brother, sister, son or daughter; or with the former husband or wife of our bosom..."

* Lds “prophet” Joseph F. Smith, nephew of Joseph Smith…in a book published by the highest ranking Lds hierarchy, The First Presidency:

* “Sometimes the Lord expands our vision from this point of view and this side of the veil, that we feel and seem to realize that we can look beyond the thin veil which separates us from that other sphere…the spirit world, surely those who have passed beyond can see more clearly through the veil back here to us…I believe we move and have our being in the presence of heavenly…beings. We are not separated from them…” (Gospel Doctrine, 2:215, 1971)

* “I claim that we live in their presence; they see us; they are solicitous for our welfare…” (GD, 2:216, 1971) (Original source: CR, Apr. 1916, pp. 2-4)

* “In like manner our fathers and mothers, brothers, sisters, and friends who have passed away from this earth…may have a mission given them to visit their relatives and friends upon the earth again, bringing…warning or reproof and instruction to those whom they had learned to love in the flesh. And so it is with Sister [Elizabeth H.] Cannon. She can return and visit her friends…” (GD, 2:224, Original source: Discourse @ the funeral of Elizabeth H. Cannon, JD 22:351-352]

2 posted on 10/31/2011 4:29:20 PM PDT by Colofornian (When Lds cite 175 yo quotes, that's "spiritual" talk; when YOU cite 'em, LDS go 'calendar' on YOU)
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To: Colofornian

was the LDS Vision of the dead also an LSD Vision of the dead ???


3 posted on 10/31/2011 4:44:37 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Colofornian

Wow Kimball. Creepy.


4 posted on 10/31/2011 4:58:00 PM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: FReepers; everyone; All

SPOOKY DUDE SOROS wants the LIGHTS OUT at FREE REPUBLIC!

Tell SOROS to 'move on & shove it!

DONATE HERE TONIGHT



5 posted on 10/31/2011 5:07:10 PM PDT by onyx (PLEASE SUPPORT FREE REPUBLIC BY DONATING NOW! Sarah's New Ping List - tell me if you want on it.)
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To: Colofornian

Elsewhere in the Internet I just read that someone who escaped from enslavemment in Mormonism said they might wear their scary “temple clothes” tonight to answer the door...

someone else suggested answering each knock with “what is wanted?”


6 posted on 10/31/2011 5:09:17 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Tennessee Nana
Dark Mormonic Verses placemarker
7 posted on 10/31/2011 6:14:42 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (You know, 99.99999965% of the lawyers give all of them a bad name)
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To: Colofornian

Another of the never ending Colofornian distortions from the extreme anti-mormon destruction at all cost machine

Christ would have us clelbrate our christianity by becoming Christlike.

Colofornian’s brand of christianity seeks any distortion to discredit the faith in Jesus Christ of a full 12 million people .... because we don’t believe in the Nicene Creed and because we believe that God has again opened the heavens in communication with modern day prophets.

Instead of focusing on this hearsay trash generated by religious hatred ... maybe you should investigate the very real historical compromises which left Christianity forever changed from its biblical base during the Council of Nicea .... but alas,

... that would require Colofornian to remove the Beam from her own eye before she tried to remove the sliver from mine .... which, I suspect is a little too Christlike for her to attempt.


8 posted on 10/31/2011 6:30:41 PM PDT by teppe (... for my God ... for my Family ... for my Country)
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To: teppe; Colofornian

What kind of cheese do you want with that whine teppe?

Colofornian has cited MORMON sources on the subject.

Christ would have you repent of your paganism and attempts to earn your salvation by your own means.


9 posted on 10/31/2011 6:38:22 PM PDT by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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To: teppe; Colofornian

No, it’s because JS, the adulterer, pedophile and thief claimed that Christ lied when He said His church would not leave us. Then claimed that he laid eyes upon God and Christ (contrary to God’s own words), yet refused to describe them as anything but “personages”.

Then went on to promote paganism, false gods, false prophets and other heretical beliefs all the while slandering all of Christianity as apostate.

False temple rituals rooted in Masonic temple rites or ripoffs of such. Baptizing the dead in contravention to established Biblical doctrine.

There’s many more, that’s just the appetizer teppe.

But as usual, you, like so many of your other so-called “Christlike mormons, come bearing nothing but ad hominems and slander towards the person posting information mormons don’t want to see the light of day.

Try debating the information posted for once, you might find in your research that what is posted is true. What then? Would you still cling to false trappings of mormonism in the face of the facts? Is the fear of finding out the lie so great that one would rather ignore the truth in order to maintain one’s ego?

Is the lure of eternal celestial marriage to a harem of wives (islam) so great that many men lose all perspective? Is the lure of becoming a god what keeps them in?

I think that if you followed your own advice and investigate mormonism, that you’d drop the SLC talking points and see how you’ve been lied to by the very people who you’ve entrusted your eternal salvation to.


10 posted on 10/31/2011 7:56:40 PM PDT by SZonian (July 27, 2010. Life begins anew.)
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To: Colofornian
“The dead are not perfect without us, neither are we without them [see D&C 128:18],” claimed Joseph F. Smith, a quote published in a church-published book in 1998 (Teachings of Presidents: Joseph Smith, p. 410)

WHAT?

SURELY you mean 1898.

11 posted on 10/31/2011 8:41:41 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: teppe
...you should investigate the very real historical compromises...

Here is MORMONism's own creed:
 
 

Articles of Faith

The Articles of Faith outline 13 basic points of belief of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Prophet Joseph Smith first wrote them in a letter to John Wentworth, a newspaper editor,
in response to Mr. Wentworth's request to know what members of the Church believed.
They were subsequently published in Church periodicals.
They are now regarded as scripture and included in the Pearl of Great Price.

 
THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541
 
 

  1. We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
  2. We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam's transgression.
  3. We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
  4. We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
  5. We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
  6. We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
  7. We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
  8. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
  9. We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
  10. We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
  11. We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
  12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
  13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith


 

12 posted on 10/31/2011 8:44:10 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: teppe
and so forth.
???
13 posted on 10/31/2011 8:44:56 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie
WHAT? SURELY you mean 1898.

No. 1998...The Mormon church did a Teachings of Presidents series...I believe 1994-2007 or so. They took excerpts of their teachings from each of their general authority years.

14 posted on 10/31/2011 9:10:09 PM PDT by Colofornian (When Lds cite 175 yo quotes, that's "spiritual" talk; when YOU cite 'em, LDS go 'calendar' on YOU)
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To: teppe
because we don’t believe in the Nicene Creed

Give us a break, Tep. Smith tried his hand at completely torching worldwide Christianity by labeling us 100% AWOL and 100% embracement of supposedly "abominable" creeds, including the Nicene Creed.

Why don't we ever see a profession on your part that Smith called 100% of our creeds putrid -- the literal meaning of "abomination?"

You & other Lds ALWAYS seem to want to frame this as mere "disagreement." Smith never left it at simple "disagreement." He pretended to speak for the Mormon god when he sought to destroy all Christian creeds.

You are a disciple of Smith. Time to take responsibility for the way you have supported such a scorched-earth approach to taking on Christianity 180 years ago.

15 posted on 10/31/2011 9:31:04 PM PDT by Colofornian (When Lds cite 175 yo quotes, that's "spiritual" talk; when YOU cite 'em, LDS go 'calendar' on YOU)
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To: Colofornian

So...

this is NOT an ‘old’ teaching that has fallen by the wayside; though never officially excommunicated like POLYGAMY.


16 posted on 11/01/2011 5:08:52 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
Time to take responsibility for the way you have supported such a scorched-earth approach to taking on Christianity 180 years ago.

I've never seen any CONDEMNATION of past Quotes, 'scripture', teachings, writings, or sermons by present day MORMONs.

What a place to find oneself!

SUREly can't claim that such things were perfectly fine, and, can't distance themselves from the sordid past that is MORMONism.


No WONDER Prozac® is served during Mormon Communion!

17 posted on 11/01/2011 5:13:04 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Peepstone profit placemarker


18 posted on 11/01/2011 8:58:45 AM PDT by greyfoxx39 (If other churches were dead dunking mormons to save them mormons would be furious.)
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To: teppe
Colofornian to remove the Beam from her own eye before she tried to remove the sliver from mine .... which, I suspect is a little too Christlike for her to attempt.

What's interesting to me is...you apparently have no idea what the context of that scripture is. It doesn't apply here. Not even close....

That said, I see people that don't know and/or study the bible, quote that scripture all the time to incorrectly "support" their case. So, you ain't alone. Which should give you no comfort unfortunately.

19 posted on 11/01/2011 10:51:19 AM PDT by Osage Orange (Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum)
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To: teppe
Do not make this thread "about" individual Freepers. That is also a form of "making it personal."

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

20 posted on 11/01/2011 11:48:59 AM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: greyfoxx39

bttt


21 posted on 11/01/2011 4:52:39 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Religion Moderator; teppe

yes we get it just because the LDS get their toes step on by spike shoes everydsy there is no need to make it personals

As *Bob Grant would say the world is sick and getting sicker!

NYC talk show host in the 1990’s

Well some Occupy Wall Street and some Occupy threads that bash LDS there really is no difference!


22 posted on 11/03/2011 4:13:41 PM PDT by restornu (Love One Another)
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To: restornu
Well some Occupy Wall Street and some Occupy threads that bash LDS there really is no difference!


23 posted on 11/03/2011 4:18:18 PM PDT by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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