Gay Episcopal Bishop to Preach at San Francisco Catholic Parish

Catholic Culture ^ | 11/22/11

[marshmallow]

A notoriously 'gay-friendly' parish in San Francisco has invited an openly homosexual Episcopalian cleric to lead an Advent Vespers service.

Most Holy Redeemer parish asked Bishop Otis Charles, a retired Episcopalian prelate, to lead the November 30 service. After serving as the Bishop of Utah from 1971 to 1993, he publicly announced that he is homosexual. Divorced from the mother of his 5 children, he solemnized a same-sex union in 2004.

[count-your-change]

And Luther probably liked Mrs. Luther too though she might’ve been ugly as a toad for all I know.

[presently no screen name]

Are your books etched in real gold?

Whatever the Vatican/RCC does is opposite of what God's Word says. Their priceless possessions will all be destroyed.

Mark 8:36 "What good is it for a man to gain the whole world, yet forfeit his soul?"

Mark 8:38 "If anyone is ashamed of me and MY WORDS in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when he comes in his Father's glory with the holy angels."

They prefer their worldly riches and their man-made teachings/doctrines. Satan's empire.

[rzman21]

Nowhere in scripture is wearing vestments forbidden for Christian clergy.

Where is the verse that forbids Christians from doing those things that aren’t found in scripture?

Catholic/Orthodox worship is founded on the imagery from the Book of Revelation and the sacrifice of the lamb.

Your POV is founded on Ockham’s Razor, not scripture.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam’s_razor

Your quest is for a Christianity that never existed.

And I’m not going to try to prove it to you because you are asking me to prove a negative.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modus_tollens

[rzman21]

You follow yourself, not Christ.

[metmom]

In your dreams.

[rzman21]

Your ego is your God.

[Natural Law]

"The mass did not become an official doctrine until pronounced by the Lateran Council of 1215 under the direction of Pope Innocent III,"

Your posing is an obviously unattributed direct quote from the jesus-is-savior.com website complete with the dangling comma at the end. Compare it to the following I excerpted from that site.

"the mass did not become an official doctrine until pronounced by the Lateran Council of 1215 under the direction of Pope Innocent III,"

Your entire posting effort over the last couple of days is completely thematic with the content of the page it came from. It really is despicable.

[Rashputin]

“Look at their words. God is a magic talisman, to be invoked in public. But everything is about them. My salvation, me my mine. “

That’s so true. Like rzman21, I was Lutheran and only a couple of years ago recognized the fact that I couldn’t deny the work of Christ throughout history the way Protestant and Protestant derived groups have to. A good many of the Protestant derived groups are actually teaching that “Thy Will” and “My Intellect” are the same things just like Luther substituted personal self-confidence for faith. Luther threw out the definition of Faith as the Scriptures and Church has always taught it and along with the redefinition threw out anything that was an outward sign of faith like sacraments or works. Luther discarded everything to do with faith as either useless or a sin and instead, he claimed that it was personal self-confidence that redeemed men, not Faith as described in Scriptures. Those anti-Catholics and others who declare that they can infallibly interpret Scripture to suit their own prejudices and predispositions could only do such things things if they were one with Christ and the Father, not redeemed individuals living by Faith. They enthrone their own intellect as a part of the Trinity and relegate the Holy Spirit to the role of a reference or footnote.

They have to deny the power of the Holy Spirit in order to personally claim that all the others throughout all of history back to Christ were wrong and not led by the Holy Spirit. Who could dismiss as, “opinions of men”, everything written by all the great figures in Church history except someone who denies the power of the Holy Spirit and the promise of Christ to protect His Church? Who could know the hearts of those who defended and even died for the Scriptures other than someone who believes they are superior to the Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit does not sew the sorts of divisions that have grown out of the heresy Luther preached. If the heresies originating with Luther aren’t enough, many of those who slander the Church Christ founded eschew Luther as well and instead claim that the first time the whole truth was revealed to anyone was when someone in the US during the mid-1800s began making false prophecies. How people can even think that Christ as described in the Scriptures would sacrifice Himself for us and then abandon the vast majority of mankind until the sixteenth century or even until the mid-nineteenth century is beyond me. Christ left His Church specifically to teach us and to ordain shepherds for the sheep, sheep who are prone to wondering around aimlessly and falling into error and heresy when they have no shepherd to watch over them. And Christ did not ordain everyone who can open a Bible to be a shepherd, either. The sheep may like pretending they’re the shepherds, but by your fruits you will know them. The sheep outside of His Church are running in every direction ordaining queers, accepting child sacrifice, laughing at the command to be fruitful and multiply, and based on their own understanding, eschewing good works and sinning boldly exactly the way Luther, not Christ, commanded.

Regards

[count-your-change]

“Nowhere in scripture is wearing vestments forbidden for Christian clergy.”

And neither is selling pornography but by understanding the spirit of the Jesus’ commandments we can act with the principles and not have to have a law.

And that is what Jesus’ condemnation of Pharisees is at Matt. 23:1-12. A principle that was followed in the primitive Christian church.

As the the Catholic Encyclopedia comments on the development of priestly vestments:

“Four main periods may be distinguished in the development of the Christian priestly dress. The first embraces the era before Constantine. In that period the priestly dress did not yet differ from the secular costume in form and ornament. The dress of daily life was worn at the offices of the Church...”

Note well...that last sentence,

“The dress of daily life was worn at the offices of the Church.”

No buskins, burkas, albas or susplices, just everyday style of dress. All these are novelties, corruptions developed over time without foundation, corruptions that violated the tradition of the apostles and saints in the the early church.

Ockham’s razor? Do you even know who Ockham was? I'm not likely to follow a Franciscan monk.

And as Scripture makes clear there were no priests in the church of the apostle's day. That too is novelty, a corruption of the offices of service of overseers, elders and serving ministers.

So neither the office of priest nor any wearing of priestly vestments could be handed down from the apostles by command or tradition.

“Your quest is for a Christianity that never existed.”

Passing strange then I find it in Scripture, eh?

[presently no screen name]

Faith and reason come from the same place

For Catholics but NOT for Christians. Catholics marinate in the sea of deception and that's what comes forth - faith and reason come from the same place - right out of their philosophers' handbook.

Brainwashing - the tool of Catholicism.

[2nd amendment mama]

Maybe you should do some research on the Pope's lifestyle before claiming that he lives in poverty. Here's just a small description of the kitchen in his apartment. Click here for full article

Loredana is the queen of the kitchen, which was renovated in 2005 with onyx countertops and gray shelves. She prepares meals on a big marble table for Benedict, who turns 84 on Saturday, and any invited guests. Pasta dishes are her specialty: including pasta with salmon and zucchini, or rigatoni with prosciutto. She keeps in touch with the Vatican supermarket and chooses which vegetables to get from the garden of Castel Gandolfo, a papal retreat in the hills south of Rome.

Onyx countertops and marble tables don't sound like he's living in poverty. I have formica countertops - can't afford onyx, granite or marble. Just which one of us is living in opulence?

This photo definitely shows the squalor that the Pope is living in..... /sarcasm

[Religion Moderator]

RnMomof7, what is the source of the excerpt and the other quotes? Always include source information so the moderators can enforce copyright restrictions.

Natural Law, that excerpt "hit" over a thousand times in a Google search. Don't presume that because it exists on a banned site it was therefore copied from that site.

The banning of a site does not make everything the site quotes also banned material. For instance, the banned sites quote the Bible but the Bible isn't banned on the Religion Forum simply because they quoted it.

[metmom]

My God, the God of the Bible, is more than capable of saving me and keeping me without the *help* from any bunch of men who want to control me.

Why is it that it seems that Catholics are incapable of believing that God can deal with us on an individual level to convict us, save us, cleanse us, seal us, teach us, lead us by His Holy Spirit which He promised to us to do those very things?

What’s the issue about having to submit to the authority of any men or group of men who claim to be speaking for God?

It’s as foolhardy to follow one man with his own interpretation of Scripture as a whole bunch of men with their own interpretation of Scripture.

Might doesn’t make right. And longevity doesn’t make right.

[Future Snake Eater]

[2nd amendment mama]

The sheep outside of His Church are running in every direction ordaining queers, accepting child sacrifice, laughing at the command to be fruitful and multiply, and based on their own understanding, eschewing good works and sinning boldly exactly the way Luther, not Christ, commanded.

Just like the pedophile priests INSIDE "HIS CHURCH" have done! Only instead of reporting these criminals to appropriate authorities, the "Church" just keeps moving them around and paying off their victims.

[Natural Law]

"Don't presume that because it exists on a banned site it was therefore copied from that site."

With the rampant plagiarism in recent anti-catholics posts and the thematic parallel between the content of them and the banned sites I am not prepared to give her or anyone else the benefit of the doubt that they do not themselves display with respect to the Catholic Church.

If it is perfectly OK for some to assume and post the worst about the Church it is equally OK for Church members to assume and post the worst about those that offer up that garbage. When they are repeatedly caught red handed it is even more fitting.

[Quix]

. . . It really is despicable.

Ahhhhhhhhhhh, CLEARLY, the Vatican Ashteroth-Mary-Goddess cult DAFFYNITIONARY is in use again!

Actually, a better example of "despicable" is telling lies about Dr Eckleberg and then ASSAULTING HER AGAIN

INSTEAD

of apologizing for telling lies about her!

Incredible.

And THEN they think we should respect their bankrupt UNBiblical theology and cult.

.

And a better example of despicable than even that is their rebellion against this very clear Scripture:

Exodus 20:4-6 4 "You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, 6but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.

[CynicalBear]

>> Why is it that it seems that Catholics are incapable of believing that God can deal with us on an individual level to convict us, save us, cleanse us, seal us, teach us, lead us by His Holy Spirit which He promised to us to do those very things?

It’s an elaborate ruse that the RCC has built over the millennia. Subtle changes in word usage to change the meaning of scripture which they used to grasp control and maintain a network of influence. Once they began with the slightly corrupted words of Jesus and the Apostles the need for power and control was easily manipulated by Satan. Power corrupts and complete power corrupts completely. History has shown that the masses long for leadership and once personal responsibility is given over to those who use the lies of Satan scripture tells us “And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.”

Those who refuse to heed Paul’s exhortation to “search the scriptures daily to see if these things are true” will fall for the teachings of those false leaders. Once they have been convinced that scripture is not sufficient most any teaching of those false teachers will be taken as truth.

[presently no screen name]

Yes, God is a personal God. They don’t know HIM and are jealous we do - that’s why we get those dumber than dumb responses.

[metmom]

Matthew 6:14-15 14 For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, 15 but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Luke 11 1Now Jesus was praying in a certain place, and when he finished, one of his disciples said to him, "Lord, teach us to pray, as John taught his disciples." 2And he said to them, "When you pray, say: "Father, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come. 3 Give us each day our daily bread, 4and forgive us our sins, for we ourselves forgive everyone who is indebted to us.

Matthew 18:21-22 21Then Peter came up and said to him, "Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?" 22Jesus said to him, "I do not say to you seven times, but seventy times seven.

Nobody who claims to be a Christian has the permission or privilege, or luxury, to not forgive, including priests.