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Are There Discrepancies in the Resurrection Accounts? If so, Can They be Resolved?
Archdiocese of Washington ^ | 4/8/12 | Msgr. Charles Pope

Posted on 04/09/2012 8:42:59 AM PDT by marshmallow

When we read the various accounts of the Resurrection in the four Gospels, Acts and Pauline Epistles we can easily be puzzled by some apparent discrepancies in the details.

The Pope in his recent book, Jesus of Nazareth (Vol II) says, We have to acknowledge that this testimony [of Scripture] considered from an historical point of view, is presented to us in a particularly complex form and gives rise to many questions. (P. 242)

The Pope goes on to explain what he considers to be the reason for this complexity and apparent divergence in some of the details.

What actually happened? Clearly for the witnesses who encountered the risen Lord, it was not easy to say. They were confronted with what, for them, was an entirely new reality, far beyond the limits of their own experience. Much as the reality of the event overwhelmed them and impelled them to bear witness, it was still utterly unlike anything they had previously known. (p. 242).

The Pope then reminds us that Jesus’ resurrection was experienced by them as something far beyond the resuscitation of a corpse. Rather, Jesus had taken up a wholly new and transformed humanity that was beyond anything they could fully describe or had ever experienced.

With all this in mind we are better able to appreciate the ecstatic qualities of the resurrection accounts and appreciate why all their details do not perfectly line up. The accounts have a rather crisp, “lets get to the point” quality; especially the accounts of the first day of the appearances. Frankly, one would be surprised if every detail in the account of an astonishing event were exactly the same. One might even suspect a story that was too controlled and wonder as to a kind of brainwashing or conspiracy having taken place.

(Excerpt) Read more at blog.adw.org ...


TOPICS: Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: msgrcharlespope; resurrection
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To: Fantasywriter
Perhaps his master began withholding food from the slave when he saw the man was getting sick. He saw no reason to squander resources.

And yet he waited for several hours before abandoning him? Possible, but strange.

51 posted on 04/10/2012 9:00:48 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: INVAR
I go by strict interpretation of the scriptures themselves and often look at the original words used to understand their meaning.

"If any man come to Me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple." - Luke 14:26

52 posted on 04/10/2012 9:09:05 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: Biggirl; Fantasywriter; INVAR
http://www.catholic-convert.com/2012/04/04/how-long-was-jesus-in-the-tomb/

Good one!

'it is clear from the Gospels that Jesus was crucified on Friday, the day of Preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath” (Mark 15:42) and raised on Sunday, the “first day of the week” (Mark 16:2). If the temporal designation of Matthew 12:40 is taken literally, a conflict does exist between the time indicated in this verse and the time indicated in the accounts of the passion story.'

53 posted on 04/10/2012 9:11:00 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

There could be any number of explanations that would account for the slave not having eaten or drunk for three days and three nights; I mentioned only one, but it may or may not be the correct one. The point is, the Bible says the slave hadn’t eaten or drunk for three days and three nights, so we know it is true. The exact reason isn’t at issue; we simply don’t need to know every detail of the reason or reasons. The fact that the Bible says it is true is sufficient.


54 posted on 04/10/2012 9:14:46 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter
So do you hate your father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters?
55 posted on 04/10/2012 9:21:52 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies
You are relentless in your insistence on changing the subject. There are countless excellent treatments/commentaries on the vs you keep quoting. If the meaning or application of the vs is an issue for you, perhaps extended, in-depth reading on the subject coupled w prayer will help. Otherwise, seek the counsel of your pastor. The vs obviously bothers you, and rather than continuously interjecting it into a discussion of the meaning of “three nights” [as if the concept of “three nights” is so deep, esoteric and confusing that mere mortals are incapable of comprehending the plain words] you need to resolve it. Blessings to you in this matter.

Meanwhile, you still haven't explained why you doubt the Word of God, when it plainly says the Egyptian slave hadn't eaten or drunk for three days. Why would you doubt God's word over such a simple straightforward and uncontroversial statement?

56 posted on 04/10/2012 9:29:03 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: INVAR
"Hell" as used in Acts 2:29 is the Greek word 'hades'. The term hades in Christian theology (and in New Testament Greek) is parallel to Hebrew sheol (שאול, grave,tomb or dirt-pit), and refers to the abode of the dead.

In Luke 16 (:19-31) Jesus talks about the rich man and Lazarus the beggar. When Lazarus dies he is immediately in heaven with Abraham. When the rich man dies he immediately discovers himself in hell (hades), a place of torments, as hell is always described.

Those who believe in God (the Lord Jesus Christ) will never die. Their flesh will die, but their spirits will not. And God is not a God of the dead, but the living.

(Mark 12) 26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? 27* He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
(John 11) 25* Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: 26* And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

As a believer I shall never spend one second in hell. I have this as a promise from Jesus Christ himself. Those who go to hell are the unbelieving.

The Greek word Hades in this usage (11 times to be exact) is "ᾅδης" (Hades). The Greek word to denote the underworld of Greek myth is: ᾍδου, Haidou. Christians wrongly assume that the term 'hades' in the New Testament is a reference to the Greek underworld. The location of 'Hades' (or underworld) to follow tradition, the Greek words are ᾍδου, Haidou, an elision to denote locality: "[the house/dominion] of Hades, the Greek God of the dead.

None of this is germane. It might be interesting phonologically--The contraction from two syllables [a.i] to a diphthong [ai] and then [a] (with subscript iota) is a natural linguistic process. [hades] and [haides] are the same word. When a Christians uses the word it doesn't (or shouldn't) denote the Greek underworld. (Just as Hell should not denote the old norse underworld). We let the Bible define what these words in fact mean. Hell is a place of torment where the unsaved go. Christians will never die--that is, their souls will never be in hell. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:8):

(2 Corinthians) 5* Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6* Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7* (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8* We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Christians will go to be with the Lord (awaiting the resurrection of the body). The dead go to hell (1st death) and will be resurrected to damnation and will be cast into the lake of fire, the second death:

(Revelation 20) 12* And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13* And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14* And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15* And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

57 posted on 04/10/2012 9:38:13 AM PDT by nonsporting
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

..and myself, whenever I come to Christ. He is true, just, and righteous. All those others and myself are very heinous. I still live Him though and seek to remain obedient to Him.


58 posted on 04/10/2012 9:51:24 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: Fantasywriter
You are relentless in your insistence on changing the subject.

Wrong - the subject is biblical interpretation, and your insistence on doing it with the "plain words." Do you apply your interpretive methods to the verse I quoted?

There are countless excellent treatments/commentaries on the vs you keep quoting.

Which one(s) do you subscribe to? What do they say?

as if the concept of “three nights” is so deep, esoteric and confusing that mere mortals are incapable of comprehending the plain words

The verse I quoted is no more deep, esoteric and confusing. Why won't you tell us what you think it means?

59 posted on 04/10/2012 9:54:58 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: Fantasywriter
'it is clear from the Gospels that Jesus was crucified on Friday, the day of Preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath” (Mark 15:42) and raised on Sunday, the “first day of the week” (Mark 16:2). If the temporal designation of Matthew 12:40 is taken literally, a conflict does exist between the time indicated in this verse and the time indicated in the accounts of the passion story.'
60 posted on 04/10/2012 9:57:06 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: nonsporting

one correction. Lazarus was in Abraham’s Bosom, also known as Paradise, a compartment of Hades for believers. No believer’s soul ascended to Heaven, the abode of God the Father, prior to the Cross as they had not been purified to stand in Heaven at that time. Once the perfect sacrifice had been made, the veil was rent in two and now it may be feasible through faith in Him.

You are correct in the doctrine that today after the first death, believers are face to face with the Lord. Some theologies assert this implies the locative position of our souls prior to the Resurrection is in Heaven. If our souls and spirit remain separated, I believe you are correct.


61 posted on 04/10/2012 9:58:36 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: Cvengr
All those others and myself are very heinous.

Do you hate them?

62 posted on 04/10/2012 9:59:19 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: All
Second Part of this discussion -- Chronologically......
63 posted on 04/10/2012 10:05:19 AM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

The subject is not whatever you say it is. Well, for you the subject is anything you like. For me, the subject is “three nights”. Three nights is not a tough concept to grasp. It means: “three nights”. It means the same thing in the Samuel passage you cited. Three nights = three nights.

Now a question for you. Why do you seem so hostile? Are you angry w me over something? I asked a sincere question and have been extremely appreciative of all the replies. I have found this discussion very helpful. Now, at the tale end of it, you seem to be on some kind of vendetta. You want to make it personal. Why?


64 posted on 04/10/2012 10:07:16 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter

Also, keep in mind that a new day *begins* at sundown. Friday afternoon into Friday night ... and we’re already touching 2 distinct “days,” according to Jewish culture circa 33 AD.


65 posted on 04/10/2012 10:10:10 AM PDT by Theo (May Rome decrease and Christ increase.)
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To: marshmallow

Leave it to the pope to cause his followers to doubt, goodness sakes, wake up people ...


66 posted on 04/10/2012 10:11:13 AM PDT by Scythian
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To: Theo

So noted; thank you.


67 posted on 04/10/2012 10:13:21 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter
Three nights is not a tough concept to grasp. It means: “three nights”. It means the same thing in the Samuel passage you cited. Three nights = three nights.

'it is clear from the Gospels that Jesus was crucified on Friday, the day of Preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath” (Mark 15:42) and raised on Sunday, the “first day of the week” (Mark 16:2). If the temporal designation of Matthew 12:40 is taken literally, a conflict does exist between the time indicated in this verse and the time indicated in the accounts of the passion story.'

Now a question for you. Why do you seem so hostile?

I can offer no insight into your perceptions, other than to note that this one does not correspond to reality.

68 posted on 04/10/2012 10:17:04 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: Scythian
'it is clear from the Gospels that Jesus was crucified on Friday, the day of Preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath” (Mark 15:42) and raised on Sunday, the “first day of the week” (Mark 16:2). If the temporal designation of Matthew 12:40 is taken literally, a conflict does exist between the time indicated in this verse and the time indicated in the accounts of the passion story.'
69 posted on 04/10/2012 10:18:09 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: INVAR
Good description. Here's another from http://www.battzion.org/Resurrection.html


70 posted on 04/10/2012 10:18:29 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies
And what is your point to make in repeatedly citing Luke 14:26??

Are you attempting to show Jesus' Word's 'ridiculous' in light of modern moral context? or is this a vain attempt to suggest Jesus' Words should never be taken literally?

Do you know exactly why Jesus was using those examples to illustrate?

'it is clear from the Gospels that Jesus was crucified on Friday, the day of Preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath”

Where in scripture does it say Jesus was crucified on Friday? Are you not capable of reading and understanding the Gospel accounts and the timeline clearly laid out?

AGAIN, read what I laid out in Post #19. Leviticus 23:5 states that at 'even' or sunset on Nissan 14 "Is the Lord's Passover'. Then verse 26 says that on the 15th of the month at evening (sunset) - is an High Sabbath: the First Day of Unleavened Bread - a holy convocation.

It was custom, and STILL IS for the Jews to refer to the day before EITHER the regular weekly Sabbath OR the day before a High Sabbath - to be a Day of Preparation - for all Sabbaths required no work to be done.

John 19:31 makes it clear that the 'Sabbath' that was drawing on after Jesus died was NOT the regular 7th Day Sabbath, but "an high day" meaning a High Holy Day - a Holy Convocation exactly as Leviticus 23 commands. The Jews did not refer to the weekly Sabbath as 'an High Day', they made that reference only to the 7 annual Feasts of the Lord as commanded in Leviticus 23 which was the foundation of Mosaic Law

The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.- John 19:31

That verse makes clear that the Jews did not want the bodies to remain on the cross on the high Sabbath day (or First Day of Unleavened bread).

Jesus IS OUR PASSOVER (I Corinthians 5:7). He died ON PASSOVER the 14th of Nissan at 3 PM or the 9th hour - exactly as the Gospel accounts state. Hebrews under the blood of a lamb were spared death in Egypt and Christians are spared eternal death if we are under the Blood of the Lamb of God, which NEEDED to be spilled on Passover itself - which according to the scriptures in Leviticus was NOT an High Day - the 15th or the next day which began at sunset was.

If the temporal designation of Matthew 12:40 is taken literally, a conflict does exist between the time indicated in this verse and the time indicated in the accounts of the passion story.'

So you are saying that we should not take Jesus' words 'literally', because if we do - there is a conflict?

Sorry - the only conflict is the tradition of men that was grafted into the church to mandate a Friday crucifixion and a Sunday morning resurrection.

This is where Secularists and Atheists have a field day with Christians, illustrating them to believe in fairy tales that are not consistent with the book they claim to follow.

If we do not take Jesus' Words of three days AND three nights in the grave LITERALLY, then where is our faith that we should believe He is the Messiah?? Should we then not also take His promise of eternal Life if we Believe on Him as a metaphor and not a literal promise?

Such arguments have been made since the First century - and if three days and three nights are just figurative for a death, then as the secularists charge - the bible - especially the New Testament is a provable fraud.

It IS NOT A FRAUD, but it becomes one when traditions and agendas are read into the plain text of the Gospels and of scripture itself.

71 posted on 04/10/2012 10:21:04 AM PDT by INVAR ("Fart for liberty, fart for freedom and fart proudly!" - Benjamin Franklin)
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To: INVAR
And what is your point to make in repeatedly citing Luke 14:26??

Are you attempting to show Jesus' Word's 'ridiculous' in light of modern moral context?

Certainly not. I'm showing that Jesus sometimes made use of modes of expression other than the purely literal, in that case hyperbole.

or is this a vain attempt to suggest Jesus' Words should never be taken literally?

"Never"? That's a feeble straw man.

Do you know exactly why Jesus was using those examples to illustrate?

Does the answer to that have a bearing on whether He meant His words literally?

AGAIN, read what I laid out in Post #19.

"Again"? This is the first time you've directed my attention to that post. Hope you're better at counting nights. ;-D

What you wrote there sounds reasonable; I didn't know about "High Sabbaths" and will study the matter further. (For the record, I'm no more wedded to a Friday crucifixion than I am to a December 25th birth.)

72 posted on 04/10/2012 10:52:10 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

I read the quote you’ve posted several times. If it’s so clear that Jesus was only in the ‘heart of the earth’ two nights, why did He prophesy that He would be there three nights? If you respond by saying ‘ nights = 2 nights’ your credibility takes a hit. For instance, If Obama took a sudden three-days-three-nights vacation to HI [on the taxpayer dime], came back and said, ‘Hey, it was only for 2 nights’, would you accept that? Or would you say, ‘The liar can’t even admit he spent 3 days AND 3 nights in HI’.

As for me, it would be Option Two all the way.


73 posted on 04/10/2012 11:14:38 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

Stephen Ray I have a lot of respect in regards to how he presents commentary in regards to scripture, both online and when I can catch him on EWTN.


74 posted on 04/11/2012 3:22:42 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

Those three days that Jesus died, was entombed, and rose were then Friday, Saturday, and Sunday = 3 days.


75 posted on 04/11/2012 3:25:27 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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