Posted on 05/27/2013 7:43:17 AM PDT by DaveMSmith
The Vatican has just announced that, despite what Pope Francis said in his homily earlier this week, atheists are still going to hell.
What a relief. For a brief moment there it was possible to imagine a brave new world of compassion, generosity and acceptance, not qualities we have come to associate with the Holy See.
Said Pope Francis this week: 'The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!'
That seemed like a pretty clear admission that people of other faiths and none have intrinsic worth to God and will be saved alongside the faithful. But this turned out to be wishful thinking.
Although they are otherwise good, moral people they are still doomed to burn in a lake of fire for having the temerity to have been born outside of Catholicism or having chosen to remain so.
The Rev. Thomas Rosica, a Vatican spokesman, spelled it out for the world on Thursday. People who know about the Catholic church 'cannot be saved' if they 'refuse to enter her or remain in her,' he said.
So that's one tall order of eternal hellfire for the rest of us, then.
It makes for an interesting spectacle to see the infallible pope being corrected by his handlers, doesn't it? For a moment it was possible to recall the welcoming and indulgent style of the short lived Pope John Paul I in the unexpectedly all-embracing words of Pope Francis. But you'll recall how quickly John Paul I was replaced by the much more doctrinaire John Paul II.
(Excerpt) Read more at irishcentral.com ...
Yes I have noticed that as well. I would say Penn Jillette might be an exception. He is an interesting and formidable atheist. He is no intellectual slouch and is well read on the Bible and likes to pull out certain passages as evidence that it is all BS (term he likes). For an atheist he sure has spent a lot of time studying it
What is different about him is he says he has no respect for any Christian that does not evangelize. He says that if someone really believes this stuff why wouldn’t they try to save others? so he doesn’t get angry when people try to save him. He thinks it is thoughtful. Interesting.
I didn’t know Rob Bell became Pope.
Now, more than ever, we need to call to mind the words of Archbishop Charles Chaput:
We make a very serious mistake if we rely on media like the New York Times, Newsweek, CNN, or MSNBC for reliable news about religion. These news media simply don’t provide trustworthy information about religious faith—and sometimes they can’t provide it, either because of limited resources or because of their own editorial prejudices. These are secular operations focused on making a profit. They have very little sympathy for the Catholic faith, and quite a lot of aggressive skepticism toward any religious community that claims to preach and teach God’s truth. Things of the Church reported in the secular media, particularly about the Holy Father, need to be viewed with the most jaundiced eye.
The Holy Father's words:
"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can. He must. Not can: must! Because he has this commandment within him. Instead, this ‘closing off’ that imagines that those outside, everyone, cannot do good is a wall that leads to war and also to what some people throughout history have conceived of: killing in the name of God. That we can kill in the name of God. And that, simply, is blasphemy. To say that you can kill in the name of God is blasphemy.”
“Instead,” the Pope continued, “the Lord has created us in His image and likeness, and has given us this commandment in the depths of our heart: do good and do not do evil”:
"The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone! And this Blood makes us children of God of the first class! We are created children in the likeness of God and the Blood of Christ has redeemed us all! And we all have a duty to do good. And this commandment for everyone to do good, I think, is a beautiful path towards peace. If we, each doing our own part, if we do good to others, if we meet there, doing good, and we go slowly, gently, little by little, we will make that culture of encounter: we need that so much. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”
But, of course, does Irish Central mention this little ditty from Pope Pius IX, written all the way back in 1863:
There are, of course, those who are struggling with invincible ignorance about our most holy religion. Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace. Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments.
Of course not.
But, still, there are those who believe NOTHING written by the MSM when it regards politics or culture but yet become instantly gullible when they read something regarding religion...particularly Catholicism.
It would be funny if it wasn't so pitiful.
Because the Pope understands the difference between “redemption” and “salvation” and that they are two completely different aspects in the process of receiving the “promise”, eternal life. Sadly many like to put the two in one little box and in doing so, they look through the glass darkly.
Where do I find that in His Scriptures?
Although they are otherwise good, moral people they are still doomed to burn in a lake of fire for having the temerity to have been born outside of Catholicism or having chosen to remain so.
How do you quantify ‘moral’ outside of All Mighty God?
So the sequence of events is looking like this.
Pope Francis says something. —> The media promptly misinterprets it. —> Vatican corrects the media.
—>Media misinterprets the Vatican.
Same old dog and pony show by the drive by!
Well, I have noticed the same thing in many unintellectual atheists, but even the many intellectual atheists I have met can eventually be reasoned into really being agnostic.
By its scientific and evidential credentials alone, atheism is a very flimsy belief that can’t stand up to much intense scrutiny. It requires one to violate one of the essential principles of mass conservation, “out of nothing, comes nothing”.
Of course, when you bring an atheist into the agnostic stage, he is ripe for spiritual enlightenment through Jesus Christ.
1. He died for all. All. All.
2. Many don’t care about (1), don’t believe it, don’t want Him, don’t think they need Him.
3. Nobody is conceived caring about (1). He changes unbelievers into believers through the bare pronouncement of (1) and all the facts (Scripture) around it.
4. Comparatively few have heard (1) without any added, man-made error, such as: you have to do extra stuff on top of Christ’s perfect work; He didn’t really die for all; you have to make a decision as though a dead person can wake himself up. Christians care about this (4) and thus try to get the word out, sometimes at their own peril and certainly in the face of mocking.
5. Since His Word (Scripture) is present in all of the Christian churches that teach the above man-made errors, there are Christians in all of those groups. God’s Word and Holy Spirit overcome the errors in spite of, not due to, their added, man-made doctrines. This does not excuse or erase the bad man made teaching; it’s still there and causes massive harm (refer to the arguments already on this page).
6. He does indeed choose us to be saved and go to heaven. He does not predetermine that anyone go to the other place. That is not His will. See (1). He died for All. He spilled His Holy innocent precious blood for all on the cross. He (Jesus) is God and Man. He will come again.
This is Irish journalism at its best. The writer is being willfully obtuse in pretending not to know that papal infallibility is limited to very rare and specific pronouncements, not every sermon or talk the Pope ever gives. And this writer, who would have heard many times growing up that Jesus died to save sinners, is pretending that he never learned that those same sinners have to repent and believe to be saved.
Good luck with that. ;)
I was reading an Ann Barnhardt article about this very subject this morning. I know some people don’t like her.
Yep, those pesky laws of physics. There is no creation without a Creator.
You beat me to it...
Cormac Murphy-O’Connor Responsible for Tony Blair’s Catholic Instruction
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3024201/posts?page=31#31
Cormac Murphy-O’Connor - Immigrants, Athiests, Ecumenism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cormac_Murphy-O%27Connor
Janus was a two faced god.
Atheists who accept Christ will be redeemed like any other sinner.
Thanks for the intro. From a purely scientific view, I would love in all sincerity to hear your ideas on the creation of the universe. I’m not trying to play ‘gotcha’ here. I really want to know. I have yet to hear a plausible response that does not involve a creator.
Exactly. The typical rebuke (usually used by unintellectual atheists), is the question of where did God come from? Who created God?
I then have to explain that the laws that govern our universe, would not govern a being who transcended our universe. Though the theory of infinity can only ever be a theory within our laws, it would not apply outside of the universe, therefor God can certainly have existed infinitely into the past, and will exist infinitely into the future.
Atheists who accept Christ will be redeemed like any other sinner.
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