Posted on 07/11/2013 7:52:18 AM PDT by Alex Murphy
Critics love to point to Biblical contradictions, whether they exist in the King James version of the Bible or the Jehovah Witnesses', New World Translation. "When you study the Bible, and its apparent inconsistencies, you may find one scripture to contradict another, but the third or fourth scripture will explain that contradiction," Carroll says. The New World Translation is similar to King James, but with different flavors of meaning, and with simpler language. "I rate it as a superior literal translation, taken from Hebrew and Greek translations," Carroll says. "We don't take liberties with translations. Some Bibles are amplified."
/calmly stated/ Not strictly true for two reasons. First, as I (non Jehovah Witness) see it, they believe in the divine mission of Christ and therefore have to be called "Christian", even if they have beliefs that differ from the mainstream or my own belief set. Second, not all Christians follow the Creed adopted by the Catholic Church in the 4th century.
Alex, you can ping cyc to discuss whether this is true about his Jehovah’s Witnesses
Sorry Pecos, but a Christian is one who believes that Jesus Christ is Lord, God and Savior. Jehovah’s W’s don’t believe that
We had some JW’s stop by once. I had my guns out on the kitchen table cleaning them. They never stopped by again. Not sure why.
The JWs have given the “time of the end” warning and when it doesn’t happen, they simply change the date. They claim that it will happen as soon as 144,000 get to heaven, so when the end doesn’t come they say that apparently some of those that they thought were anointed ones didn’t make it. Before 1975, many quit their jobs, didn’t finish school, didn’t have children, sold their homes, etc., because they were told that Armageddon was coming.
They would rather die and let their children die than have a blood transfusion.
They say they only welcome the willing, but if one of their children decide that they don’t want to be a JW, they disfellowship them, and no family members can have anything to do with that person.
“Crisis of Conscience” by a former VP of the org. is a good read.
It is a cult.
Isn't this what Jesus told his disciples to do after leaving towns that wouldn't hear the word? Didn't he also say it would be worse for those towns than Sodom and Gomorrah when judgement day arrives?
How did the simple message, spoken by what appeared to be a plain and simple man, His Word, His Body, His Church, be transformed into all of these different branches, denominations, systems and rituals, all so complex and each proud enough of itself to call itself the only way, the right way?
How He must be wounded to be Crucified by us, again and again. How His divided Church is weakened before the determined efforts of Satan and how each soul thus lost tears His Heart again and again.
Pecos,
The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is a false prophet. It is a group that denies orthodox, historical Christian doctrine:
They emphatically deny the Divinity of Christ (Second Person of the Trinity), His bodily resurrection, salvation by grace through faith in Christ, and the Personhood/Godhood of the Holy Spirit being the most egregious errors among many.
Pecos, I know you have been thoroughly indoctrinated by the Watchtower to not listen to anyone outside your group. They’ve told you that the New World Translation is a scholarly, accurate translation of Greek and Hebrew. But, that is NOT true. Don’t take my word for it - a little research into this translation will expose its pernicious fallacies.
I know it probably pointless to discuss these things with you, Pecos, as you WILL NOT listen (at least at this point). I know the Watchtower trains you well to know what you believe and why. The problem is it is all twisted history and doctrine. It’s like trying to unravel a knotted up ball of yarn.
Anyone reading this please understand. The Jehovah’s Witnesses are NOT an orthodox Christian group. This does not mean they are not nice people or an excuse to be mean or rude to them, but their doctrines go against nearly every major historical Christian doctrine. Research them and you will see what I mean.
A good book on the subject is “Kingdom of the Cults” by Walter Martin (now deceased) and there is a wonderful website of many of his speeches and the subject:
http://www.waltermartin.com/whatsnew.html
There are other fine books and Christian apologetic websites on Jehovah’s Witnesses out there as well.
Again, I’m not attacking Pecos as a person. He may well be a very nice guy. I’m sure he is absolutely genuine and sincere in his belief, but sincerity is no guarantee of truth.
Beware of the doctrinal statements this man is making. Your soul depends on it.
They honor no day above another, they do not believe in transfusions, there are a few other differences. They are dedicated believers, and they follow the Bible's instructions to the best they are able. They did not talk a lot about sins. The are excellent citizens. I do not remember if they go to war. I suspect they are conscientious observers. They are sincere.
Have you ever heard about the underground city that the JoHos built for themselves in preparation for the 1972 iteration of the apocalypse?
It’s located outside of Georgetown Ontario, and is underneath their Canadian headquarters.
Sorry Alex, I should have addressed this to both you and Pecos.
The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is a false prophet. It is a group that denies orthodox, historical Christian doctrine:
They emphatically deny the Divinity of Christ (Second Person of the Trinity), His bodily resurrection, salvation by grace through faith in Christ, and the Personhood/Godhood of the Holy Spirit being the most egregious errors among many.
Pecos, I know you have been thoroughly indoctrinated by the Watchtower to not listen to anyone outside your group. They’ve told you that the New World Translation is a scholarly, accurate translation of Greek and Hebrew. But, that is NOT true. Don’t take my word for it - a little research into this translation will expose its pernicious fallacies.
I know it probably pointless to discuss these things with you, Pecos, as you WILL NOT listen (at least at this point). I know the Watchtower trains you well to know what you believe and why. The problem is it is all twisted history and doctrine. It’s like trying to unravel a knotted up ball of yarn.
Anyone reading this please understand. The Jehovah’s Witnesses are NOT an orthodox Christian group. This does not mean they are not nice people or an excuse to be mean or rude to them, but their doctrines go against nearly every major historical Christian doctrine. Research them and you will see what I mean.
A good book on the subject is “Kingdom of the Cults” by Walter Martin (now deceased) and there is a wonderful website of many of his speeches on the subject:
http://www.waltermartin.com/whatsnew.html
There are other fine books and Christian apologetic websites on Jehovah’s Witnesses out there as well.
Again, I’m not attacking Pecos as a person. He may well be a very nice guy. I’m sure he is absolutely genuine and sincere in his belief, but sincerity is no guarantee of truth.
Beware of the doctrinal statements this man is making. Your soul depends on it.
P.S. The Watchtowr, Bible and Tract Society (i.e. Jehovah’s Witnesses) is anything BUT simple. A little research into them and their history will demonstrate that as well.
I know about the 1972 date, but I've never heard of this "underground city" - do you have any information you can post about it?
No, haven’t heard or forgot about it. I spent many years trying to forget that cult to which I was not willingly brought into.
I’ve not been able to find much of anything about it online. However, I live about a half hour drive from Georgetown, and I’ve been hearing all the locals talk about it for years, including a number, who claim to have been part of the construction/excavation crew in the late sixties-early seventies.
I’ve also seen the property from ground level on numerous occasions. Sixty five acres of immaculately mowed lawns and pancake-flat grounds smack in the middle of hilly country, and with hills on every side of the property. The only ground level buildings to be seen are what looks like a barn, and a secondary building not much bigger than a farmhouse. Not exactly all that impressive for buildings that supposedly house the Canadian headquarters of Watchtower.
By comparison, The Seventh Day Adventists have their Canadian headquarters in Oshawa Ontario, and they easily have four times the above-ground building and office space that Watchtower does.
Make of all of that what you will.
“Crisis of Conscience” is a great book written by a disfellowshiped VP that shows how they are a false prophet.
re: “One of the things Jehovah Witness’s do is they build their own churches. The members do the labor, no money is borrowed against the building... (or this was the case over 50 years ago) when I talked and studied a bit with one of the members.”
Yes, this is still the case.
re: “They honor no day above another”
You are correct. They do not celebrate any holidays nor even their own birthdays thinking it is idolatry.
re: “they do not believe in transfusions, there are a few other differences.”
Yes, there are actually QUITE a few differences. The biggest being that they do not believe in the One Triune God, they deny that Jesus is God the Son, equal to the Father and Spirit. They basically are polytheists because they believe that Jehovah is God and Father (the big God), and Jesus is god/divine, a little “god” or “deity”. Two separate gods.
re: “They are dedicated believers”
Absolutely true. But, remember, sincerity and dedication to a belief is not a guarantee that they are believing the truth. Just that they are dedicated.
re: “and they follow the Bible’s instructions to the best they are able.”
Well, they follow the instructions given from the Watchtower which TELLS them what to believe regarding the Bible. They are not allowed to study the Bible without the Watchtower helps. The Watchtower warns their members NOT to study God’s Word on their own.
re: “The are excellent citizens.”
The ones I have met are indeed nice people, however they do not hold no regard or allegiance to any government, including the founding principles of the United States. They hold no allegiance to our Constitution and refuse to recite the Pledge because they believe our flag is an idol.
re: “I do not remember if they go to war. I suspect they are conscientious observers.”
They are total pacifists.
re: “They are sincere.”
True, but again, sincerity is not an absolute sign of being correct/right. You can sincerely wrong as well as sincerely right. Find out what their doctrines are and contrast it with what the Bible actually teaches - not from their literature, but just on your own or with a trusted friend from outside their group. Check out what they say and see if it matches what the Scriptures teach.
re: ““Crisis of Conscience” is a great book written by a disfellowshiped VP that shows how they are a false prophet.”
Thanks, Rusty0604, I will check that one out.
When I was a child and asked how Jehovah was going to kill every person in the world that wasn’t a JW without killing a JW standing right next to him, I was told to have faith in Him because he can do anything.
These people, if they did build an underground shelter, s/h/b/ admonished for lack of faith. And they better have plenty of supplies, because it’s been 100 years since their first date for Armageddon was 1914. (which was changed after further enlightenment)
Take a look here.
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