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SSPX leader denounces Vatican II, Novus Ordo liturgy [Catholic/SSPX Caucus]
Catholic Culture ^ | October 15, 2013

Posted on 10/16/2013 8:48:30 AM PDT by NYer

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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Berosus; bigheadfred; Bockscar; cardinal4; ColdOne; ...

Thanks NYer.


41 posted on 10/16/2013 6:21:29 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (It's no coincidence that some "conservatives" echo the hard left.)
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To: NYer

I can make it a “Catholic/SSPX Caucus” but the “Catholic Caucus” label excludes SSPX and Orthodox.


42 posted on 10/16/2013 7:05:00 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: NYer

By the way, the caucus designations on this Religion Forum have to do with maintaining peace on the threads, e.g. limiting discussion. It is not a theological statement.


43 posted on 10/16/2013 7:07:57 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

The SSPX is Catholic, just not very obedient and not very politic. But clearly validly ordained Catholic clergy. And yes, for many years an arguable ex-communication was in place, but that has been lifted.


44 posted on 10/16/2013 7:12:32 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: narses

Interesting but it doesn’t matter to the problem at hand. There are still Freepers who wish to call a Catholic Caucus that excludes SSPX (and Orthodox.)


45 posted on 10/16/2013 7:15:38 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

How? I mean the SSPX is an organization of priests, I don’t think even one of them posts here. How would excluding people who do not post here mean anything?


46 posted on 10/16/2013 7:17:23 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: narses

By excluding SSPX I mean that the “Catholic Caucus” designation excludes anyone who does not recognize the present Pope and Papal Infallibility.


47 posted on 10/16/2013 7:23:05 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

The SSPX explicitly recognizes both the Pope and all Dogmas of the Church, including the Vatican I declaration regards Papal Infallibility.

See http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2012/07/19/sspx-we-recognise-the-authority-of-the-pope/


48 posted on 10/16/2013 7:34:18 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: Religion Moderator; narses
Dear Religion Moderator,

I have to agree with narses and with anyone else who thinks that the SSPX is, at least for now, Catholic.

Their status is irregular, but their excommunications were lifted a few years back, and they recognize the pope as the Vicar of Christ.

Not sure what else would make them qualify.


sitetest

49 posted on 10/16/2013 7:59:05 PM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: narses
Again, it does not matter. The decision was made years ago after a long discussion on a thread where your co-religionists - particularly those who post caucus articles - argued the points at length.

Those who want to have the Catholic Caucus include sedevacantists must use the term "Catholic/SSPX Caucus." And if they wish to include Orthodox as well, they must stipulate "Catholic/SSPX/Orthodox Caucus" or "Catholic/Orthodox Caucus" as the case may be.

50 posted on 10/16/2013 8:02:56 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

“Those who want to have the Catholic Caucus include sedevacantists must use the term “Catholic/SSPX Caucus.”

Sedevacantists are not Catholic, the SSPX is NOT sedevacantist.


51 posted on 10/16/2013 8:05:18 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: sitetest

Please see RM’s comment at #50.


52 posted on 10/16/2013 8:08:32 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: sitetest; Salvation; NYer; RBStealth; RCB-Catholic; topher; NKP_Vet; markomalley; fatima
You are welcome to start a thread to discuss the issues anew, but be sure and include those Freepers who post Catholic Caucus articles, e.g. Salvation, NYer, RBStealth, RCB-Catholic, topher, NKP_Vet, markomalley, fatima.

Be sure to include in the discussion whether to continue to exclude Orthodox and those who were baptized Catholic but do not currently consider themselves to be Catholic - both groups were considered in the original discussion and excluded to avoid disruptions and disagreements.

53 posted on 10/16/2013 8:10:04 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator; sitetest; Salvation; NYer; RBStealth; RCB-Catholic; topher; NKP_Vet; ...

Be sure to include in the discussion whether to continue to exclude Orthodox and those who were baptized Catholic but do not currently consider themselves to be Catholic - both groups were considered in the original discussion and excluded to avoid disruptions and disagreements.

1 - The Orthodox are NOT Catholic,
2 - Those who no longer consider themselves to be Catholic are apostate and not Catholic,
3 - The SSPX is not apostate, not sedevacantist, not Orthodox and absolutely Catholic, validly ordained Catholic priests and Bishops.


54 posted on 10/16/2013 8:14:55 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: narses

It doesn’t matter to me how the caucus wants to label the cuts to include/exclude those who do/do not recognize the Pope and accept Papal Infallibility. It only needs to be consistent.


55 posted on 10/16/2013 8:16:15 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

There is zero question that the SSPX recognizes the Pope, ditto Papal Infallibility. They are Catholic.


56 posted on 10/16/2013 8:19:35 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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To: narses; sitetest
Let's see if sitetest - an oldtimer on Free Republic - cares to host another discussion among those who actually post Catholic Caucus articles to get a consensus whether they would like to change the definition of who is or is not a member.
57 posted on 10/16/2013 8:26:50 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: sitetest

I’m wondering if it matters whether my wife and I (non-denominational 5 minute ceremony) are
“Catholic-married” or not — chaste well over 20 years — neither of us is going anywhere or will ever stray. Latin Mass attendees but so far abstain from Holy Communion. Maybe that isn’t necessary.


58 posted on 10/16/2013 8:31:44 PM PDT by steve86 (Some things aren't really true but you wouldn't be half surprised if they were.)
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To: steve86

Have never seen a paragraph break like that when I didn’t put in html to cause it.


59 posted on 10/16/2013 8:33:13 PM PDT by steve86 (Some things aren't really true but you wouldn't be half surprised if they were.)
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To: Religion Moderator

The definition, if you have described it with accuracy, is clear and the SSPX is Catholic.


60 posted on 10/16/2013 8:41:51 PM PDT by narses (... unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.)
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