Skip to comments.Fascination with Francis Stirs Protestant Hearts
Posted on 01/23/2014 12:12:50 PM PST by marshmallow
What has intrigued me most about Pope Francis is not the way in which Catholics -- well, most of them, anyway -- have embraced him but the way in which countless Protestants have moved into his fan club.
More is at play here than simple celebrity in our overwrought pop culture. At least, I hope so.
The Protestant fascination with him hasn't broken down the many theological, liturgical and structural barriers that still exist between Protestantism and Catholicism, but it has softened them a bit and it has caused some Protestants to want to figure out what makes Francis tick, what Jesuit theology is all about and what ground we Protestants might share in common with Catholics.
My own congregation is a good example of this phenomenon. Our pastor, Paul Rock, recently began a sermon series he's calling "Jesus, the Pope and a Protestant Walk Into a Bar." His sermons, which started Sunday, can be found here .
(Excerpt) Read more at ncronline.org ...
When he talks about capitalism and economics in general, he sounds a lot like BHO to me.
He is going to do lunch with satan obamao soon.
I’m sure they will find a lot in common.
As a nondenominational Protestant and former Catholic, I like Francis’ regular-guy approachability, but some of his issue stances (not all) seem more in line with the liberals we rail about here on a regular basis.
As a practicing Catholic, the Pope’s policy views to me seem very typical of the Church leadership: Conservative on social issues, very liberal on domestic policy, immigration, the death penalty, big goverrnment, high taxes, and income redistribution.
I believe the breakdown of the wall began when the College of Cardinals elected a non Italian pope from Poland.
Given it's a PCUSA congregation, I'd say they're a great example of it!
Rock ribbed Baptist don’t pay much attention one way or the other.
I can’t wait for the report.
have embraced him but the way in which countless Protestants have moved into his fan club.”
Um, not so much.
And that’s coming from a Protestant admirer of the two predecessors......
Would Jesus have been as cordial with a mass murderer? At least he didn’t offer the devil a chair.
I'm beginning to think that some of our FRoman Catholic friends have a secret attraction to the PCUSA and the ELCA :)
Inevitably these churches are members of the World Council of Churches. The PC(USA) and the usual suspects are all members.
They eventually get a tingle, after they first check to make sure it’s not a stream. Poor things don’t know whether to stand proudly or squat in shame, such is the situation Francis has them in.
I tend to think that liberal, less strict-type Protestants (and I don’t necessarily mean liberal in a political sense) are more likely to embrace him. However, I do not think that Evangelical, Fundamentalist, Bible-only type Protestants do. I think this bears out right here on this site.
And I think you are right. Just as conservative Catholics do not seem too keen on embracing him, neither do conservative non-Catholics.
We have those?
have embraced him but the way in which countless Protestants have moved into his fan club.
The Protestant fascination with him ...caused some Protestants to want to figure out what makes Francis tick, what Jesuit theology is all about and what ground we Protestants might share in common with Catholics.
What protestants, I wonder?
Why don't you take a poll here and find out. Here's my vote: I have zero fascination for this Marxist Pope, and the Papacy period. "Stirs Protestant hearts?" Give me a break!
I’ve never done one! Are you one of the three I mentioned?
I think so, I’m to the right of Ian Paisley.
You are always a Catholic because that mark of Baptism is always on your soul —— forever.
You can come back at any time — just sit down with a priest and get your questions answered.
Disputatio pro declaratione virtutis indulgentiarum
If no one can escape being a Catholic once they are baptized as infants, then full fledged, adult Catholics walking out of the voting booth, and who are actual Catholics in fact and in self description of faith, are really and truly Catholics, even though most of them vote for pro-abortion, pro-gay, pro-immigration democrats.
The Catholic Church is not against the death. Says it should be used in certain cases. That’s also my stance. I was all for the death penalty for years. If the guy got death, fry him was my stance. Well when I realized that if you have money to buy the best lawyers you can be as guilty as hell as not get the death sentence. Sometimes be found not guilty when all the evidence proves you are quilty. It is rare that a man with money is put to death. Death row is crowded with those that didn’t have the money to buy their way out of it. When I finally came to the realization that the America judicial system is as crooked as any banana republic I changed my tune on the death penalty.
“I greatly admired President Kennedy and have adopted his tax cutting principles” ~ Ronald Reagan
That quote doesn’t show up, but Reagan sure as heck better have said it, it is is a great way to mock JFK while exploiting his fake, post death image.
Exploiting the dead JFK for political ends is a smart strategy.
In private, Reagan wrote that JFK was a lefty “Marxist”.
Either way, your post is a very strange response to post 29, which said,
“”If no one can escape being a Catholic once they are baptized as infants, then full fledged, adult Catholics walking out of the voting booth, and who are actual Catholics in fact and in self description of faith, are really and truly Catholics, even though most of them vote for pro-abortion, pro-gay, pro-immigration democrats.””
On second thought I get it, promoting the democrat party, their greatest hero, it fits with the fact that most Catholics are pro-abortion, pro-gay, pro-immigration voting democrats.
Ronald Reagan was a great fan of Jack Kennedy and said it many times. Probably the reason he stayed in the democrat party for so long.
No, Reagan despised JFK, now after JFK was deified after his death, then Reagan and all GOP politicians use him in a positive way to promote their ideas, and to not commit political suicide.
I hope we aren’t going to see a lot of untruths being promoted again against Reagan and promoting the democrat party and their greatest hero, the man who’s election killed America.
I realize that most Catholics vote for abortion and immigration, but really, please not here at FR.
Your quote in post 31 isn't accurate enough to find, but your claim right there is completely and utterly false, it seems deliberately false to me, since you have been corrected on that sickeningly anti-Reagan/pro-democrat claim before, it reads like something straight from DU.
We have the actual hand written letter from Reagan to the vice president of the United States requesting permission to help stop JFK, and saying that he was going to register republican, but the vice-president said that remaining registered as democrat would be more effective as Reagan fought to save America from JFK.
Much has changed since A.D. 1517 and A.D. 1530 (the adoption of the Augsburg Confession) but not everything.
The signing of the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification (JDDJ) in Augburg on Reformation Day of 1999 was the beginning of the end of the Reformation; but the Vatican’s announcment of the Millenial Jubilee Indulgences just a few weeks later proved that the JDDJ breakthrough was akin to D-Day...still a lot of hard work ahead.
Reagan despised JFK?
“Many men are great, but few capture the imagination and the spirit of the times. The ones who do are unforgettable. Four administrations have passed since John Kennedy’s death, five presidents have occupied the Oval Office, and I feel sure that each of them thought of John Kennedy now and then, and his thousand days in the White House” ~ Ronald Reagan 1985
That was a Peggy Noonan (Obama voter) written speech, for President Reagan to give at a fund-raiser for the John F. Kennedy Presidential Library, in 1985.
In private, in a hand written letter, Reagan revealed what he thought about JFK, and thank you for giving me the opportunity to expose this to more freepers.
Reagan in a personal, hand written letter to the vice President, describing JFK after JFK's nomination speech.
"I heard a frightening call to arms. Unfortunately he is a powerful speaker with an appeal to the emotions. He leaves little doubt that his idea of the challenging new world is one in which the Federal Govt. will grow bigger & do more and of course spend more. I know there must be some short sighted people in the Republican Party who will advise that the Republicans should try to out liberal him. In my opinion this would be fatal."
"One last thought, shouldnt some one tag Mr. Kennedys bold new imaginative program with its proper age? Under the tousled boyish hair cut it is still old Karl Marxfirst launched a century ago."
Please cite the link THAT PROVES Peggy Noonan voted for Obama.
“In the 2012 presidential campaign, in the days prior to the November election, she expressed optimism for a Mitt Romney victory over Barack Obama because she said she saw happy faces and optimism among Republicans”.
It is sure bizarre to have to deal with the democrat element here.
You might want to look at some of the old threads we anti-democrat conservatives were reading at freerepublic during the 2008 election.
It appears that Noonan voted with the Catholics in 2008.
In Catholic teaching. I was baptized as an adult... willfully... into a relationship with Christ.
All Christians know that no "system" can exclude the need for charity and voluntary philanthropy by individuals, families, churches, church-related institutions, non-profits, and other organizations who try to support the elderly and disabled, equip people for the work force, etc. etc.
The important words here were "por si mismo" -- "by itself." Without charity and without the Gospel.
Non-market forces, such as laws to curb the activities of fraudsters and banksters, monetary manipulation, money-laundering, illegal trade in drugs, prostitution, human trafficking, insider trading, ponzi schemes, etc. --- plus the impact of non-market exchanges via charitable giving and philanthropy --- will always be needed, because "trickle down" doesn't produce opportunity and inclusion all . by . itself .
Be careful that you don't accept a Marxist spin on this, which is the one ultimately promoted by the Soros groups
Which is fine by me, my brethren and sistren.
May I then suggest the Vatican hire a new interpretor?
Who were they using? The same guy who did the sign language at Mandela’s funeral?
I posted this on another thread some time ago. Deserves repeating:
Put a Marxist in charge of the Roman church, the Catholic FReepers cover for him at every step, they do it all the time on the RF. Whatever political conservatism they might have goes out the window it seems, it apparently doesnt mean diddly to a Catholic.
Taking a look at their history, it is understandable. Catholics were totalitarian tyrants from the day they sold their souls to the Roman emperor Constantine, continuing as Roman empire tyrants until the modern era put an end to it (thank God). Marxism is not such a bad thing to people of such a totalitarian bent. No wonder you have no problem with this Marxist Pope.
As you well know, many of those Baptisms are accepted by the Catholic Church, and those entering RCIA become candidates rather than catechumens. (I think I have that correct; please correct me if I am in error.)
I think it's worse than Mandela's one-man-band arm-waving interpreter. I think it's the "hive" --- the one Joe Sobran used to talk about. It's the the swarm of bien-pensant bees that waggle their little rear ends up or down or diagonally or in figure-8's, and within minutes the whole hive knows whether today's theme is "Republican War on Women" or "Science Says Global Warming Gonna Gitcha" or "We Wuv Pope Fwancis Cuz He's Pwogwessive Like Us."
And don't be calling it a "Conspiracy Theory," because they don't even have to "conspire". They just have to tune into the story line for 5 seconds, and the Narrative has been set: Pope Francis warm, Pope Benedict Cold. Pope Francis' black shows, Pope Benedict's Red Shoes. Pope Francis hates Capitalism, Pope Benedict is one of the Koch Brothers, or at least a Cold-as-Capitalist Cousin.
These are the people who simultaneously, around the world, decide which 15 words out of every 55,000 word papal document will be deemed newsworthy, and will be cropped and framed and put in the headline, the captions, and the lede.
Do you know what I mean?
The Catholic leadership (defined as the bishops and the cardinals) at least here in the US comes across generally speaking as very conservative on social issues such as abortion and marriage, yet quite liberal on domestic policy issues most notably immigration, the death penalty, redistribution of wealth, big government, higher taxes, more spending——all nicely couched as “social justice”-—I think Pope Francis falls into this characterization as well from all that I’ve seen and read about him.
"As Fox and many other Catholic and ex-Catholic dissidents see it, Vatican II marked the moment when the church had the chance to reinvent itself as a flexible moral and spiritual force in a rapidly changing world. Indeed, it briefly seemed to do just that and its important to understand that Bergoglio, like Joseph Ratzinger and Karol Wojtyla before him, was part of the right-wing counterrevolution within the church that aggressively rolled back those changes, crushed dissident thought and reasserted the absolute power of the pope and his hierarchy.
"Pope Francis is a longtime ally of Communion and Liberation, a fiercely conservative Catholic organization that insists on total fidelity and communion with the church leadership and is devoted, among other things, to battling European socialism and Latin American liberation theology. In Italian politics, CL has been closely tied to the party of Silvio Berlusconi, and its founder was an intimate friend of Cardinal Ratzinger before he became Benedict XVI."
I love to hear sweet, reassuring words like that.. :o)
This would all be great if true. I still believe the Pope has issues with free market capitalism, limited government, individual liberty, and private property as do many in the Catholic clergy from top to bottom. Would like to be proven wrong about my current assessment.