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The Future of United Methodism
First Things ^ | 28 February A.D. 2022 | David Coulter

Posted on 03/01/2022 10:39:43 AM PST by lightman

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This may be one denominational fracture in which the "progressives" are forced out and the "traditionalists" retain the name and property.
1 posted on 03/01/2022 10:39:43 AM PST by lightman
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To: Albion Wilde
The UMC was formed as an experiment in “big tent” theological pluralism

Big tents are for circuses.

2 posted on 03/01/2022 10:40:40 AM PST by lightman (I am a binary Trinitarian. Deal with it!)
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To: aberaussie; Aeronaut; aliquando; AlternateViewpoint; AnalogReigns; Archie Bunker on steroids; ...
In August of 2009 the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) estabalished a "Full Communion Partnership" with The United Methodist Church

Therefore:



Lutheran (EL C S*A) Ping!

* as of August 19, AD 2009, a liberal protestant SECT, not part of the holy, catholic and apostolic CHURCH.

Be rooted in Christ!

The August 19 date refers solely to the adoption of the gaysbian agenda, NOT to the “Full Communion” agreement.

3 posted on 03/01/2022 10:42:17 AM PST by lightman (I am a binary Trinitarian. Deal with it!)
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To: lightman

Last time I did any reading on this subject, which seems like forever ago, a plurality of UMC churches would be going to the more conservative incarnation of the church.


4 posted on 03/01/2022 10:44:16 AM PST by Artemis Webb (Be kind to each other, unless the other guy is a dumbass.)
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To: 05 Mustang GT Rocks; Ad Orientam; alex; antonius; aposiopetic; arielguard; bad company; ...
The middle paragraphs highlight how the classic Wesleyan understanding of sanctification and holiness are very parallel to Orthodox theosis.
5 posted on 03/01/2022 10:44:50 AM PST by lightman (I am a binary Trinitarian. Deal with it!)
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To: lightman
the way forward for Methodism is to return to the early Wesleyan fusion of holiness and love and recover Wesleyan catholicity.

Which means getting rid of all the theological and political liberals, which comprise at least half the clergy and a plurality of the laity. The surgery is going to be very painful, but the longer they wait the more the cancer grows.

6 posted on 03/01/2022 10:45:27 AM PST by chajin ("There is no other name under heaven given among people by which we must be saved." Acts 4:12)
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To: lightman

Your comment has me a little confused but obviously we’d both agree that the ELCA is all kinds of messed up.


7 posted on 03/01/2022 10:45:58 AM PST by Artemis Webb (Be kind to each other, unless the other guy is a dumbass.)
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To: lightman

I used to attend Hope UMC in Sacramento and it fractured over gay marriage about thirty years ago. This stuff has been happening for a long time and is not a new thing. Not at all.

And what’s really at stake here is US$64 BILLION in property assets that are all held by the denomination and not by the local churches.

http://www.umglobal.org/2020/01/a-primer-on-umc-assets-who-owns-them.html


8 posted on 03/01/2022 10:46:06 AM PST by MercyFlush (DANGER: You are being conditioned to view your freedom as selfish)
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To: MercyFlush

Exactly: Who keeps the brand and the buildings?


9 posted on 03/01/2022 10:48:34 AM PST by lightman (I am a binary Trinitarian. Deal with it!)
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To: lightman

That’s interesting, as when I did my own split about 30 years ago it seemed that the liberals were running everything. Maybe it’s a matter of degree, back then many were good people who were just left of center, now maybe they’re full-blown nutjobs. Don’t much care anymore.


10 posted on 03/01/2022 10:50:40 AM PST by bigbob
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To: Artemis Webb

Same here - thought it was a done deal and may be in my state. The fags took the UMC name and ran.

I checked out 🤪


11 posted on 03/01/2022 10:53:47 AM PST by NWFree (Somebody has to say it)
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To: lightman

Methodists are nothing more than Catholics with the same amount of humanism, and less liturgical B.S.

Oh, and Catholics have way cooler costumes....

Let’em split....Progressives should never mix with Conservatives.....


12 posted on 03/01/2022 11:00:27 AM PST by Hardshell (Mollie Tibbetts)
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To: lightman

I’m a lay chaplain in my volunteer fire company. My counterpart in our neighboring mutual aid fire company is a retired UMC pastor. He is a typical social liberal, his theological hero is Karl Barth and he thinks I’m a religious kook because I take the words of the Bible seriously. He has a degree and I don’t.

I know that one pastor doesn’t mean the whole group is off track. This pastor has no kind words for the local Wesleyan church which is experiencing big growth and has a Biblical foundation. I see nothing but crash and burn in the UMC.


13 posted on 03/01/2022 11:00:40 AM PST by fatboy
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To: lightman
You would think that it would happen that way, but that is not true.

Because the "Progressives" (as they're called) control the hierarchy, Council of Bishops, and all of the agencies within the denomination, the progressives will KEEP the UMC, called the "Post-Separation United Methodist Church," psUMC. The "traditionalists" will leave and form a new, Wesleyan, traditional denomination which will be the "Global Methodist Church." There's a lot of details and history involved in the coming separation - but I, for one, CAN'T WAIT to be gone from the UMC and join the GMC at its "convening conference." (Date of that is TBD.)

14 posted on 03/01/2022 11:02:42 AM PST by Prov3456
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To: fatboy

See my comments below.


15 posted on 03/01/2022 11:04:46 AM PST by Prov3456
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To: Prov3456; All

OOPS: See my comments above (in post #14).


16 posted on 03/01/2022 11:06:33 AM PST by Prov3456
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To: Prov3456

My understanding is even though the GMC has more members, the psUMC will keep the property. Perhaps they will sell some of it back to the UMC. If that is true the quickest breakup is the best because the GMC is subsidizing the psUMC.


17 posted on 03/01/2022 11:12:43 AM PST by alternatives? (The only reason to have an army is to defend your borders.)
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To: lightman

Unfortunately, not. The Protocol for Separation has us, the traditionalists, leaving - despite the fact that every single General Conference vote on this issue for the last 30 years has been for traditional marriage and against LGBTQ values. At this point, as long as the properties and pensions get fairly split, I’ll take it.


18 posted on 03/01/2022 11:13:46 AM PST by jagusafr ( )
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To: lightman

I read a few articles at least a year ago and it sounded like the liberal/progressive branch would keep the brand. The property would go with whichever side the church decides to join. I’ll have to look for the article -it’s been awhile.

The gist of the article was that the liberal/progressives successfully maneuvered to keep the name brand instead of having to create a new brand. In a normal world, they’re the ones leaving the original brand and would have to leave and create a new brand.


19 posted on 03/01/2022 11:22:18 AM PST by iceskater (I'm in the control group. ;))
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To: iceskater

The new brand is the “Global Methodist Church”, which has been spearheaded by the Wesleyan Covenant Association. The WCA has been methodical (NPI), considered, prayerful and solicitous of input throughout the process and has come up with foundational documents that form a good starting place for “the next Methodism”, which is traditional Wesleyan doctrine.


20 posted on 03/01/2022 11:37:31 AM PST by jagusafr ( )
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