[Loyalist]

Fr. Somerville used to be considered one of the Canadian Church's liberal liturgical heroes (though Somerville, to his credit, never saw himself that way).

His condemnations of the New Mass cannot be so easily dismissed by the KJPL gang; he was one of its contributors.

[Loyalist]

PING!

Please freepmail me if you would like to be added to or removed from my Traditionalist list.

[Domestic Church]

Is Fr.Somerville, as of October 2002, aligning himself with the SSPX or is he just aligning himself with the traditionalist movement?

[ultima ratio]

Great post. Father Somerville will now be persecuted for daring to speak up for the faith.

[american colleen]

Good article. You would have been further heartened to hear Archbishop Dolan who appeared tonight on "The World Over" on EWTN and spoke about this very subject. He sees the confusion over translation(s) coming to an end and a return to the true Latin translation. There is a new leadership of conservatives rising out of the USCCB, thank God.

I find this confusing: "SSPX declares itself fully Roman Catholic, recognizing Pope John Paul II while respectfully maintaining certain serious reservations."

Shouldn't it be that Pope John Paul recognizes the SSPX while maintaining certain serious reservations? It seems to me that the writer has his statement backwards and I'd guess that men like Fr. Richard McBrien recognizes himself as "fully Roman Catholic," so I'm not sure what that means. I'm also wondering what the SSPX means when they say "recognizes Pope John Paul 11" - what do they recognize him as?

[Maximilian]

I.C.E.L.’s changes amounted to true devastation

This is a powerful testimony. As Fr. Somerville himself points out, this information has long been available to anyone who takes the time to investigate a topic so essential to the salvation of your immortal soul.

Clearly, I.C.E.L. has written a new prayer.

Even if you are convinced of the validity of the Novus Ordo, when you attend Mass in the vernacular, you are participating in a travesty of even this new service. THE PRAYERS ARE NOT THE SAME.

I have come to know with respect and admiration many traditional Catholics. These, being persons who have decided to return to pre-Vatican II Catholic Mass and Liturgy, and being distinct from “conservative” Catholics (those trying to retouch and improve the Novus Ordo Mass and Sacraments of post-Vatican II), these Traditionals, I say, have taught me a grave lesson. These demonstrated cumulatively, in both scholarly and popular fashion, that the Second Vatican Council was early commandeered and manipulated and infected by modernist, liberalist, and protestantizing persons and ideas.

"Conservative" Catholics (aka "neo-Catholics") are part of the problem, not part of the solution. They are not defending the 2000-year tradition of the Church. Instead they are institutionalizing abuses and corruptions.

Such a litany of defects suggests that many modern Masses are sacrilegious, and some could well be invalid. They certainly are less Catholic, and less apt to sustain Catholic Faith.

For the good of your soul, ATTEND THE LATIN MASS. You are gambling with all eternity otherwise.

It is FOR THE FAITH that I am renouncing my association with I.C.E.L. and the changes in the Liturgy. It is FOR THE FAITH that one must recover Catholic liturgical tradition.

Let's please dispense with all the hackneyed accusations of "schismatic" and "heretic." It is clear that Fr. Somerville is devoted to the Catholic Faith. Let's address the substance of his arguments. Your destiny for all eternity is riding on it. As Fr. Somerville said:

You, who must know that only the true Faith can save you, that eternal salvation depends on holy and grace-filled sacraments as preserved under Christ by His faithful Church.

[sinkspur]

Pursue these grave questions with prayer and by serious reading, especially in the publications of the Society of St Pius X.

So, we should get the "truth" from a group of schismatics?

What a waste of time reading this tripe was!

[Catholicguy]

13 – Who are the authors of these published critiques of the Conciliar Church? Of the many names, let a few be noted as articulate, sober evaluators of the Council: Atila Sinka Guimaeres (In the Murky Waters of Vatican II),

<> Who signed the infamous "We resist you to the face" schism sheet and specialises in attacking the Pope in the execreable "The Remnant."<>

Romano Amerio (Iota Unum: A Study of the Changes in the Catholic Church in the 20th Century),<> Read it. Big deal. Personal opinions of a peritus whose agenda wasn't put into action<>

<> Michael Davies (various books and booklets, TAN Books),

<> English school teach whose books are suffused with errors<>

and Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre,

<>excommunicated<>

one the Council Fathers, who worked on the preparatory schemas for discussions, and has written many readable essays on Council and Mass (cf Angelus Press).

14 – Among traditional Catholics, the late Archbishop Lefebvre stands out because he founded the Society of St Pius X (SSPX), a strong society of priests (including six seminaries to date) for the celebration of the traditional Catholic liturgy. Many Catholics who are aware of this may share the opinion that he was excommunicated

<> The Pope who excommunicated him is presumably one of those Catholics<>

and that his followers are in schism. There are however solid authorities (including Cardinal Ratzinger, the top theologian in the Vatican) who hold that this is not so. declares itself fully Roman Catholic, recognizing Pope John Paul II while respectfully maintaining certain serious reservations.

<> Is this Thanksgiving or April Fool's Day?<>

[ninenot]

This is REALLY significant. Somerville is a "name," and one to be reckoned with. My vague recollection is that he was also quite involved in music.

Was this letter a reprint, or was it sent specifically to the SSPX?

[Slyfox]

I too long for the uplifting words of the Tridentine Mass but, the Novus Ordo, however flawed the prayers may be, is still valid because the words of the Consecration, "This is My Body, This is My Blood", were not changed.

The significance of Father Somerville's opinion is that it may help those to act in favor of better language who are in positions where they could do something.

One of the last times there was a discussion on this topic I stated that Protestants were involved in the formulation of the Novus Ordo and I was told I was full of hooey. Well, whoever you are how told me that here it is. Now put THAT in your crack pipe and smoke it.

[Desdemona]

Among traditional Catholics, the late Archbishop Lefebvre stands out because he founded the Society of St Pius X (SSPX), a strong society of priests (including six seminaries to date) for the celebration of the traditional Catholic liturgy. Many Catholics who are aware of this may share the opinion that he was excommunicated and that his followers are in schism.

Maybe he was excommunicated for insubordination? That's a firing offense in any profession. From all accounts that's what it sounds like. He might have been right, but say/do the wrong thing to the worng person, thus creating a conflict of egos and whammo you're gone.

[Desdemona]

Sommerville says some interesting things. And if he's renouncing his role...it's worth at least listenting. And to a very large extent with languange and music, he's absolutely correct.

...the Second Vatican Council was early commandeered and manipulated and infected by modernist, liberalist, and protestantizing persons and ideas.

This line says a lot. They did the same thing in the universities. And for some dumb reason, people are afraid to confront them. I have no idea why. It's amazing the number of incompetants who rise to power. In many fields, incuding mine.

Request please: a good, solid definition of "modernism". I haven't gotten one yet. Does it have something to do with thinking for oneself, enlightenment and socialism? What?

I had a talk with my grandmother about this yesterday, and she doesn't particularly like the language of the NO. She said going back to Latin would not bother her, but then she grew up with it. My mother, OTOH, will NEVER accept going back, and she's a daily Mass goer.

I had a whole line of comments for this since I read this last night and with all the distractions while I've been typing, I forgot half of them. I'll be back later.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Shouldn't Fr. Somerville have written his letter of resignation in Latin, since it is a far superior language in every way from English? In fact shouldn't Latin-rite advocates speak in Latin most of the time because of its superiority, resorting to vernacular only when dealing with their inferiors in the secular world?

He is rather mindlessly resorting to the cheap convenience of vernacular. After all, if you expect the laity to have to learn and understand a dead language in order to participate fully in liturgical life, the least the clergy can do is to use it in their daily business.

[Unam Sanctam]

Everyone knows how crappy ICEL has been, but it is being reformed. Why is this guy leaving just when there is hope of positive developments in accordance with "Liturgiam Authenticam"?

[Askel5]

O God, who make the minds of the faithful to be of one will, grant to your peoples (grace) to love that which you command and to desire that which you promise, so that, amidst worldly variety, our hearts may there be fixed where true joys are found.