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Study Says Medieval New World Map Is Real
Associated Press ^ | Nov 25, 2003 | DIANE SCARPONI

Posted on 11/25/2003 6:25:37 PM PST by Pharmboy


This is a copy of the 'Vinland Map' as seen at
Yale University in New Haven, Conn., in this Feb. 13, 1996 file
photo. Experts dispute its authenticity. Two new studies
add fresh fuel to a decades-old debate about whether the parchment
map of the Vikings' travels to the New World, purportedly drawn by
a 15th century scribe, is authentic or a clever 20th century forgery.
Both studies were published independently in scholarly journals,
the researchers announced Monday, Nov. 24, 2003.
(AP Photo/Ho)

NEW HAVEN, Conn. - The latest scientific analysis of a disputed map of the medieval New World supports the theory that it was made 50 years before Christopher Columbus set sail.

The study examined the ink used to draw the Vinland Map, which belongs to Yale University. The map is valued at $20 million — if it is real and not a clever, modern-day forgery.

A study last summer said the ink on the parchment map was made in the 20th century.

But chemist Jacqueline Olin, a retired researcher with the Smithsonian Institution in Washington, said Tuesday her analysis shows the ink was made in medieval times.

"There is no evidence this is a forged titanium dioxide ink," said Olin, whose paper appears in the December issue of the journal Analytical Chemistry.

The authenticity of the map has been debated since the 1960s, when philanthropist Paul Mellon gave it to Yale. The university has not taken a position on its authenticity.

The map depicts the world, including the north Atlantic coast of North America. It includes text in medieval Latin and a legend that describes how "Leif Eiriksson," a Norseman, found the new land called Vinland around the year 1000.

Scholars have dated the map to around 1440. Some scholars have speculated that Columbus could have used the map to find the New World in 1492.

Last summer, Olin and other researchers announced that carbon-14 dating of the parchment showed it was made around 1434 — exactly the right time for the map to be genuine.

However, researchers from University College in London examined the ink on the map and announced last summer that it cannot be more than 500 years old.

Tests in the 1970s by Walter McCrone — who also had disputed the authenticity of the Shroud of Turin — found the ink contained anatase, a form of titanium dioxide that is common in inks made after 1920. Anatase is found in nature, but the crystals of anatase were too regular-shaped to have been natural, McCrone said.

Olin's study looked at various minerals found in the ink, including aluminum, copper and zinc. All these minerals, she said, would have been byproducts of the medieval ink manufacturing process.

Also, she said anatase also could have ended up in the ink because of the manufacturing process, and its crystal size and shape could have changed over time.

Research is continuing into the Latin writing on the map.


TOPICS: Canada; Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; US: Minnesota
KEYWORDS: archaeology; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; vikings; vineland
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Uf dah?
1 posted on 11/25/2003 6:25:38 PM PST by Pharmboy
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To: Pharmboy
Cool!
2 posted on 11/25/2003 6:40:44 PM PST by tiamat ("Just a Bronze-Age Gal, Trapped in a Techno World!")
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To: blam
Ping
3 posted on 11/25/2003 6:48:53 PM PST by LPM1888 (What are the facts? Again and again and again -- what are the facts? - Lazarus Long)
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To: Pharmboy
I can't bring up the picture. Maybe the web site is overloaded.
4 posted on 11/25/2003 6:50:09 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: tiamat
"Some scholars have speculated that Columbus could have used the map to find the New World in 1492. "

Some scholars are stupid. Its a giant blob with a smaller blob next to it. It wouldn't have done a thing for him.
5 posted on 11/25/2003 6:51:22 PM PST by ryanjb2
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To: Cicero
Go to the AP link above and view it there...it's coming up here for me with no problem. But, I've had the same thing happen to me on other threads...
6 posted on 11/25/2003 6:53:10 PM PST by Pharmboy (Dems lie 'cause they have to...)
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To: ryanjb2
Good point.
7 posted on 11/25/2003 6:53:40 PM PST by Pharmboy (Dems lie 'cause they have to...)
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To: ryanjb2
But it's still cool!

Tia

8 posted on 11/25/2003 6:54:45 PM PST by tiamat ("Just a Bronze-Age Gal, Trapped in a Techno World!")
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To: tiamat
Then again, it would have AT LEAST let him know there was land there...
9 posted on 11/25/2003 6:56:27 PM PST by Pharmboy (Dems lie 'cause they have to...)
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To: Pharmboy
In other articles, there's debate because the Vikings couldn't have mapped the world in such detail. I don't know why not. They were known for their travels and it's been proven through various digs they were in the New World before Columbus. Heck, Chris was met on the beach so he obviously wasn't the first.
10 posted on 11/25/2003 6:56:53 PM PST by mtbopfuyn
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To: ryanjb2
"Some scholars have speculated that Columbus could have used the map to find the New World in 1492. "

Some scholars are stupid. Its a giant blob with a smaller blob next to it. It wouldn't have done a thing for him.

If Columbus did use the map, he should get his money back. Despite three trips to the New World, Columbus only made it to islands in the Carribean and Gulf of Mexico. He never touched on North or South America.

11 posted on 11/25/2003 6:58:34 PM PST by JoeSchem
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To: Pharmboy
" Some scholars have speculated that Columbus could have used the map to find the New World in 1492."

Find the "New World"? I thought Columbus was lost.
12 posted on 11/25/2003 7:02:23 PM PST by elli1
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To: JoeSchem
There goes Columbus Day.

Then again...how about just adding another celebration day ?!! I'm ALL for that !
13 posted on 11/25/2003 7:05:30 PM PST by PoorMuttly (DO, or DO NOT. There is no TRY - Yoda)
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To: Pharmboy
The university has not taken a position on its authenticity.

Several years ago I attended a dinner at Yale where I sat next to an official from the Yale Library. I asked him about the Vinland map. He said that he had participated in tests on the map using a proton beam and based on those tests the map appeared to be genuine.

14 posted on 11/25/2003 7:09:01 PM PST by wideminded
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To: Pharmboy; LPM1888
Vindication For Vinland Map: New Study Supports Authenticity
15 posted on 11/25/2003 7:15:35 PM PST by blam
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To: JoeSchem
"Despite three trips to the New World, Columbus only made it to islands in the Carribean and Gulf of Mexico. He never touched on North or South America."

The Shipwreck At Playa Damas Location: Panama

"Some evidence, not yet confirmed by archaeological analysis, suggests that the shipwreck at Playa Damas is that of La Vizcaina, a ship abandoned in 1503 by Christopher Columbus on his fourth and final voyage."

16 posted on 11/25/2003 7:21:37 PM PST by blam
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To: msdrby
ping
17 posted on 11/25/2003 7:23:55 PM PST by Prof Engineer (My Labrador can lick your honor student anytime, and they'll both enjoy it.)
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To: Pharmboy
I see no reason why it couldn't be authentic.
We now know the Vikings established settlements in Canada centuries before Columbus.
I have heard there is some evidence that Portuguese fisherman were fishing off Newfoundland during the late Middle Ages.
Given Columbus' maritime experience, he must have heard some versions of these stories, and perhaps even seen maps of North America.
18 posted on 11/25/2003 7:29:04 PM PST by WackyKat
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To: PoorMuttly
,,, another map to fall of the edge of.
19 posted on 11/25/2003 7:32:47 PM PST by shaggy eel
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To: blam
Whoops...I searched "medieval."
20 posted on 11/25/2003 7:33:04 PM PST by Pharmboy (Dems lie 'cause they have to...)
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To: blam
On his third voyage Columbus explored part of the coast of South America; on August 5, 1498, he became the first European known to have set foot on the continent of South America.

On his fourth voyage (1502-1504) he explored part of the coast of Central America, from Honduras to Panama before being shipwrecked on Jamaica and being stranded there for a year (the governor in Hispaniola knew that he was there but took his time sending a ship to rescue him).

21 posted on 11/25/2003 7:41:43 PM PST by Verginius Rufus
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To: WackyKat
"We now know the Vikings established settlements in Canada centuries before Columbus."

Someone got here waaay before Columbus or the Vikings

European DNA Found In 7-8,000 Year Old Skeleton In Florida (Windover)

22 posted on 11/25/2003 7:51:50 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
Yeah but they came over on a land bridge. Not nearly as impressive.
23 posted on 11/25/2003 7:55:59 PM PST by Gumption
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To: Gumption
"Yeah but they came over on a land bridge. Not nearly as impressive."

Nah, they took the Atlantic route from Iberia by boat.

24 posted on 11/25/2003 7:58:14 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
That sounds a little impossible to me. Unless of course they had alien help.
25 posted on 11/25/2003 8:10:48 PM PST by Gumption
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To: Gumption; blam
I agree with blam that it is possible they came directly from Europe.
After all, the Polynesians traveled huge distances across the Pacific in large canoes.
I believe there was a lot more trade and travel in the Neolithic world than is generally acknowledged.
26 posted on 11/25/2003 8:15:13 PM PST by WackyKat
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To: Pharmboy
Which way is North?
27 posted on 11/25/2003 8:20:53 PM PST by chudogg (http://chudogg.blogspot.com)
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To: mtbopfuyn
I have a friend from an island in the Baltic Sea, called Gotland. It's a Swedish island. One city in particular, Visby, was home to many great sailors and traders, merchants and explorers.

At different times this island belonged to different nations, the Danes and Norwegions among them, I believe. At any rate, one thing is certain: the Gotlanders were THE vikings. Master sailors and traders.

I had the pleasure of traveling there to visit my friend in 2000. One of the highlights was visiting the history museum in Visby, a 1000 year old city on Gotland. Here I saw maps, a thousand years old, detailing sailing and trading routes across the world. I saw with my own eyes, ancient Arabian coins dug up from the back yards of people in Visby. There were many ancient artifacts from cultures around the world; proof of the levels of exploration and trade achieved by the vikings.

I would not doubt the validity of such a map as this one bit after having seen some proof with my own eyes just a few years ago in the city of Visby.
28 posted on 11/25/2003 8:27:52 PM PST by bc2 (http://www.thinkforyourself.us)
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To: Gumption; WackyKat
"That sounds a little impossible to me. Unless of course they had alien help."

Read the article below, good maps too!

Who Were The First Americans

29 posted on 11/25/2003 8:48:50 PM PST by blam
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To: Pharmboy
McCrone takes another one on the nose... posthumously.
30 posted on 11/25/2003 9:06:21 PM PST by Swordmaker
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To: blam
Have you ever read "Mysteries of the Sacred Universe" by Richard Thompson? I bet you would like it - I think that's where I saw a copy of a map from (IIRC) medieval times, which apparently was copied from earlier maps, showing the LAND MASS under Antarctica. IOW, the land minus the ice.
31 posted on 11/25/2003 9:52:31 PM PST by little jeremiah
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To: shaggy eel
...I'm kind-of getting used to that...
32 posted on 11/25/2003 10:01:11 PM PST by PoorMuttly (DO, or DO NOT. There is no TRY - Yoda)
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To: little jeremiah
Thanks, I've not read that....but, I have read about the map of the land mass under the antarctic. A big mystery.
33 posted on 11/25/2003 10:01:33 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
The book in question has more scientific type language and concepts than my poor brain is capable of grasping - but still I have read the book a couple of times, gleaning a bit more with each reading. The evidence presented points to an ancient world-wide culture or civilization, very ancient in origin. In fact, now that I have reminded myself, I think I'll read it again!
The premise of the author is that ancient cultures' "mystical" descriptions of the world or universe aren't necessarily opposed to scientific understanding, and may another way of describing the same truths, and may actually open understanding.
34 posted on 11/25/2003 10:21:25 PM PST by little jeremiah
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To: little jeremiah
"- but still I have read the book a couple of times, gleaning a bit more with each reading. "

I know about that. I'm presently re-reading Voyages Of The Pyramid Builders by Dr Robert Schoch. The book is about refugees from Sundaland (the area around Indonesia that went underwater at the end of the Ice Age) who fled to areas all over the world at the end of the Ice Age and took their custom of pyramid building with them, Egypt, South America, India and etc.

BTW, Schoch is the geologist/geophysist who has dated the Sphinx to 9-10,000 years old.

35 posted on 11/25/2003 10:36:00 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
Go take a look at what Noory (Coast-to-Coast AM) has up on the Monday guest regarding 'Atlantis'. Interesting links, blam.
36 posted on 11/25/2003 10:39:37 PM PST by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: Pharmboy
More
37 posted on 11/25/2003 10:41:59 PM PST by Consort
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To: Pharmboy
ping to #36
38 posted on 11/25/2003 10:42:25 PM PST by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: MHGinTN
"Go take a look at what Noory (Coast-to-Coast AM) has up on the Monday guest regarding 'Atlantis'"

LOL, I don't know anything about Noory, can you give me a link?

39 posted on 11/25/2003 10:43:36 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
coasttocoastam.com HERE
40 posted on 11/25/2003 10:49:25 PM PST by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: blam
"Monday's main guest, Dr. Gregory Little (website) of the Edgar Cayce organization A.R.E., discussed a startling find made off the coast of Andros Island. This massive underground structure, which Little photographed, could have been part of Atlantis...cont."
41 posted on 11/25/2003 11:02:51 PM PST by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: MHGinTN
"coasttocoastam.com HERE"

Thanks, I don't get into the Cayce stuff. Although I find the comment about the structures off the coast of Cuba being dismantled Soviet missiles structures interesting.

42 posted on 11/25/2003 11:04:25 PM PST by blam
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To: MHGinTN
I know about Andros Island...It's probably a natural formation.
43 posted on 11/25/2003 11:05:57 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
The underwater photos post on the linked site are interesting, regardless of the A.R.E. stuff ... related to the Bimminy Road
44 posted on 11/25/2003 11:06:04 PM PST by MHGinTN (If you can read this, you've had life support from someone. Promote life support for others.)
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To: little jeremiah
I think that's where I saw a copy of a map from (IIRC) medieval times, which apparently was copied from earlier maps, showing the LAND MASS under Antarctica. IOW, the land minus the ice

That was most likely the Map of Piri Riis.

45 posted on 11/26/2003 1:24:13 AM PST by Swordmaker
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To: JoeSchem
Some people could miss Houston with a Rand McNally's too.
46 posted on 11/26/2003 2:14:25 AM PST by Smokin' Joe (You gotta dig a lot deeper than the fables they sold you in High School.)
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To: ryanjb2
Some scholars are stupid. Its a giant blob with a smaller blob next to it. It wouldn't have done a thing for him.

There are writings by vikings that pretty much describe travelling down the east coast from Canada to Cape Cod. There are very early Portughese writings on Dighton Rock in MA. Some even believe there are evidences of Celtic settlements as far inland as Ohio.

Then there are the legends of the tall blonde indians who greeted the Pilgrims.

Cool, huh?

47 posted on 11/26/2003 2:26:18 AM PST by grania ("Won't get fooled again")
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To: Pharmboy
Oh sure, proof that they listened to their geography teachers, (unlike me) and they drew a kick a** map.
48 posted on 11/26/2003 2:33:17 AM PST by Cate
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To: Swordmaker
What's that?
49 posted on 11/26/2003 10:02:02 AM PST by little jeremiah
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To: little jeremiah; blam
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. The map of Piri Reis (corrected spelling) is an anomoly... an anachronism.

In 1929 a group of historians found half of the map in the Palace of Topkapu (Istanbul where it remains, facsimile available at the Library of Congress Washington DC) on a dusty shelf, still rolled up and drawn on a gazelle skin. The content of the map was amazing: it focused on the western coast of Africa, the eastern coast of South America (!) and the northern coast of Antarctica (!!!). The most flabbergasting point is that Antarctic had remained undiscovered until 1818, but its northern coastline, perfectly detailed, was shown on this map drawn in 1513.

What this doesn't tell you is that the coastline of Antartica is the coastline of the continent WITHOUT the ice... which was only determined by radar and echo location soundings in 1949!

The Map of Piri Reis

Another map that is anacrhonistic is the Ornotius Finaeus Delphinus Map created in 1531 which shows the entire continent of Antarctica along with mountain ranges, rivers, bays... that have only recently been found to exist where Finaeus' map shows them.

A: The Map of Orontius Finaeus Delphinus

B; Finaeus Map redrawn on modern polar projections

C: Antartica on polar projection

Here is the text of a letter written to Professor Charles Hapgood analysing the Piri Reis Map:

" It is not very often that we have the opportunity to evaluate maps of ancient origin. The Piri Reis ( AD 1513 ) and the Oronteus Fineaus [sic] ( AD 1531 ) maps sent to us by you, presented a delightful challenge for it was not readily conceivable that they could be so accurate without being forged. With added enthusiasm we accepted this challenge and have expended many off duty hours evaluating your manuscript and the above maps. I am sure you will be pleased to know that we have concluded that both of these maps were compiled from accurate original source maps, irrespective of dates. The following is a brief summary of our findings:

A. The solution of the portolano projection used by Admiral Piri Reis, developed by your class in Anthropology must be very nearly correct; for when known geographical locations are checked in relationship to the grid computed by Mr. Richard W. Strachan ( MIT ), there, is remarkably close agreement. Piri Reis' use of the Portolano projection ( centred on Syene, Egypt ) is an excellent choice, for it is a developable surface that would permit the relative size and shape of the earth at that ( lattitude ) to be retained. It is our opinion that those who compiled the original map had an excellent knowledge of the continents covered by this map.

B. As stated by Colonel Harold Z. Ohlmeyer in his letter ( July 6, 1960 ) to you, the Princess Martha Coast of Queen Maud Land, Antarctica, appears to be truly represented on the southern sector of the Piri Reis Map. The agreement of the Piri Reis map with the seismic profile of this area made by the Norwegian-British -Swedish Expedition of 1949, suported by your solution of the grid, places beyond a reasonable doubt the conclusion that the original source maps must have been made before the present Antarctic ice cap covered Queen Maud Land coasts.

C. It is our opinion that the accuracy of the cartographic features shown in the Oronteus Fineaus [sic] Map ( AD 1530 ) suggests, beyond a doubt, that it also was compiled from accurate source maps of Antarctica, but in this case of the entire continent. Close examination has proved the original source maps must have been compiled at a time when the land mass and inland waterways of the continent were relatively free of ice. This conclusion is further supported by a comparison of the Oronteus Finneaus [sic] Map with the results obtained by International Geophysical Year teams in their measurements of the subglacial topography. The comparison also suggests that the original source maps ( compiled in remote antiquity ) were prepared when Antarctica was presumably free of ice. The Cordiform projection used by Oronteus Fineaus [sic] suggests the use of advanced mathematics. Further, the shape given to the Antarctic continent suggests the possibility, if not the probability, that the original source maps were compiled on a stereographic or gnomonic type of projection ( involving the use of spherical trigonometry ).

D. We are convinced that the findings made by you and your associates are valid, and that they raise extremely important questions affecting geology and ancient history, questions which certainly require further investigation.

We thank you for extending us the opportunity to have participated in the study of these maps. The following officers and airmen vollunteered their time to assist Captain Lorenzo W.Burroughs in this evaluation: Captain Richard E. Covault, CWO Howard D.Minor, MSgt Clifton M.Dover, MSgt DAvid C.Carter, TSgt James H.Hood, SSgt James L.Carroll, and AIC Don R.Vance."
Lorenzo W.Burroughs
Captain, USAF
Chief, Cartographic Section
8th Reconnaissance Technical Sqdn ( SAC ) Westover, Mass.

50 posted on 11/28/2003 12:19:23 AM PST by Swordmaker
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