General Zinni, what a Ninny

townhall.com ^ | December 31, 2003 | Joel Mowbray

[Gunslingr3]

His immediately leaping on the neo-con excuse simply exacerbates it.

But wait a second. For whatever reason (I don't know how that label evolved) the people who advocate the policy of aggressive military action with the goal of instituting Pax Americana are called neocons. If you disgree with that policy, and name it's implementers and adherents, you shouldn't be called a racist just because some of them are Jewish. I see this as neocons playing the 'race' card to chill dissent, and that bothers me as much as if anyone else was doing it.

[gatorbait]

Well ,the problem,Guns , is this. Zinni, and some others ,HAVE dealt that card and it seems to suit them fine to do so. Now,it is also instructive when Zinni is called on his cassadraisms, he gets flustered and gets a hostile and starts shouting "race card".

I think Zinni is hacked off becasue HE was a failure in the long term, his advice was rightly ignored at the highest levels , and that 4 star ego cannot stand that.

[xzins]

Zinni was negligent in the deaths of the USS Cole sailors. He and his yemeni embassy sidekick, Barbara Bodein(Bodeit?..sp).

[Sonny M]

the problem here is Zinni's developing Wesley Clark disease.

I think your closer then you think. I expect his name to pop up big time after the dems have there nominee. The lefty's are starting to drool over the possibility of having a Dean/Zinni ticket (now that Clark has killed any chance it could be him as VP, someone has got to teach that boy politics).

Zinni as a Dean running mate, could do some damage. (though he was a republican, did vote for Bush, yada yada yada, now regrets it, etc).

[aculeus]

Zinni had bad combat experience in 'nam.

Unfortunately it seems to have rendered him unuseful in today's far more serious world.

[Steve Eisenberg]

But wait a second. For whatever reason (I don't know how that label evolved) the people who advocate the policy of aggressive military action with the goal of instituting Pax Americana are called neocons. If you disgree with that policy, and name it's implementers and adherents, you shouldn't be called a racist just because some of them are Jewish. I see this as neocons playing the 'race' card to chill dissent, and that bothers me as much as if anyone else was doing it.

I'm old enough to have heard the phrases "chill dissent" and "pax Americana" though five decades. And they have just about always been phrases of the left. Gunslingr3 sounds like he is a foreign policy leftist. That's not an insult, and I'll also mention that Gunslingr3 may also be a good conservative on domestic policy. However, I would just point out that favoring a strong and assertive America has been solid conservativism in the US since before Goldwater, and certainly since then.

[gatorbait]

Zinni as a Dean running mate, could do some damage. (though he was a republican, did vote for Bush, yada yada yada, now regrets it, etc).

My God, that is a brilliant assessment and I think quite accurate. Let's hope the opposition research guys are watching this closely.

[CWOJackson]

"Zinni had bad combat experience in 'nam."

Not as bad as the sailors on the USS Cole.

[Akira]

If the % of Jewish vote for Republicans doesn't show a substantial improvement in 2004, I'll be surprised. However, I've been surprised before.

As recent elections show, it can't get much worse.

[Gunslingr3]

Gunslingr3 sounds like he is a foreign policy leftist.

Read George Washington's Farewell Address. Read John Quincy Adams' 'Monsters to Destroy' speech. They encapsulate my foreign policy views. If that's 'leftist', well, whatever...

[Sonny M]

I hope the GOP is already ahead of the game and doing research on Zinni. Its been pretty clear that if Dean wins, he's not going to be able to have anyone he ran in the primary with as his running mate, he's an outsider, and Zinni fits the mold perfect also as an outsider, kind of Clark but without the baggage and better credentials, plus he calls himself a moderate.

Even if its Gephardt that wins, Zinni is still a good possibility. Rove and the boys had better be on top of this.

[gatorbait]

Rove and the boys had better be on top of this.

My guess is that they already are looking at Zinni with renewed vigor

[Corinthian Warrior]

Zinni suffers from a disorder similar to that of William S Lind, from the Free Congress Foundation. Isolationism combined with a know-it-all attitude about war and human nature, with a sense of resentment for not being given a top job in the Bush cabinet.

[af_vet_1981]

It’s a shame that someone who so honorably served his nation for three decades would tarnish his legacy with such idiotic remarks. If he didn’t mean to use “neocon” as a code word for “Jew,” he should say so. But if he meant to, then he should just shut up.

Maybe his service was not as honorably as the author would hope.

[af_vet_1981]

honorably honorable

[desertcry]

Indeed, the NY Jews did a lot to put hillary in the US Senate. Now they will reap the whirlwind, as will as zinni for getting too close to the evil ones.

[desertcry]

I think, you got something there.

[Qatar-6]

The trashing of Gen Zinni on this post is intolerable

Gen Zinni is one of the finest general officers I have known or served under.

I would follow him in combat any day

I would also trust him to make the operational decisions in any war.

Strategic decisions are the relam of the NSC and ultimately, the president.

Had Zinni been CINCCENT he would have probably advised against the campaign (Al-La Yamamoto at Pearl Harbor) and then taken his orders and prosecuted it brilliantly

As it was we were micromanaged by OSD to the point of distraction

We've come as far as we have IN SPITE of Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and all the OSD crowd. Not because of them.

I disagree with Zinni on his position about the strategic timing of the war

But I know his position is well considered and thoughtful. He's 40/60 against, I'm 60/40 for

Having reached Baghdad right behind the 3ID and spent a good deal of time in liberated Iraq, I can say that we did a good thing and most Iraqis appreciate it.

But we made a lot of mistakes in both the prosecution of the war and especially in the postwar stand up of OCPA and the reliance on contractors

All of which was OSD (Rumsfeld - Wolfowitz) driven.

If the military had been left in charge we'd be a lot farther along now

Worst micromanagement from OSD since McNamara

I was so happy when Bush got elected. Finally, I'd thought we'll get some adults in the pentagon instead of these dillitante amateurs

Instead I find all we did was trade cowardly dillitante amateurs for bellicose dillitante amateurs

I'll vote for Bush again, we've absolutely no choice, but I'll feel a whole lot better if he ditches his OSD crew

The people on this thread who say insulting things about Gen Zinni malign a good man.

All the best

Qatar-6

[gatorbait]

I would also trust him to make the operational decisions in any war. Strategic decisions are the relam of the NSC and ultimately, the president

We're in agreement here.Where I find Zinni deficient is the timing and the public bleating. Frankly,THAT choice leads me to conclude he is suffering from advanced Croweitis. Now,I'm glad to hear your confidence in the general.I agree, he'd do his job well enough. I disagree with Zinni on his position about the strategic timing of the war

This is the crux of my"trashing" of Zinni,and I'd say a good bit of those of us who served before, while and after he did.His timing and motivation are highly suspect. Thanks for the job you did.Were you around in the McNamera days? I was.

[meenie]

I can't really see the connection between General Zinni and anti-semitism. The article specifically says that he did not use the word "Jew" in his remarks. He opposed some of the neocons by using the word "neocon". I don't think that Rumsfeld or Cheney are "Jews" but they are the top leadership of the hawks or neocons.

How can anyone complaining of their actions be accused of anti-semitism? Another question, after getting past the anti-semitism, does a "Jew" that does not believe zionism has been a success in establishing Israel and the resulting problems, is he anti-semitic? Phrases just get tossed around like trash in a dumpster with no thought given to the meaning. The neocons running under the banner of anti-semitism does not honor either side of the issues involved.