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FURIOUS BUSH DEMANDS TO SEE ALL PRISONER ABUSE PHOTOS, VIDEOS
Drudge ^ | 5/9/04 | Matt Drudge

Posted on 05/09/2004 6:44:14 PM PDT by demkicker

A furious President Bush has demanded to see all photos and videos showing abuse of Iraq detainees, a senior White House source said late Sunday.

"The president was blindsided by the first TV images, he will not be blindsided again," the source, who demanded anonymity, explained to the DRUDGE REPORT.

The president has instructed Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld to present him with him all known images that could further deepen the crises.

Monday editions of the NEW YORKER feature photos of a dog attacking a naked Iraqi detainee at Abu Ghraib prison.

President Bush was aware of the photo, the top source claims.

The White House is preparing for more fallout, and leaks from lawmakers.

The Pentagon is considering the possibility of showing the unseen material to members of Congress.

"It's clear the moment the evidence is sent to the Congress, we will see a new feeding frenzy in the media."


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 8x10glossy; bush43; hillaryknew; iraqipow
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Geeze, I'm thinking that Bush maybe going overboard. He needs to get on offense and make it plain to the media that any further leaking of photos of the Iraqi prison abuse will only serve to hurt our military men and women. He needs to emphasize that the culprits of the abuse are going to be tried. Any further pictures or videos will only poison our efforts and Bush needs to articulate that to the American people.
1 posted on 05/09/2004 6:44:15 PM PDT by demkicker
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To: demkicker
Totally agree. After saying that this sort of thing won't be tolerated and the guilty will be punished, he should have also said that this should be kept in perspective, that remember, we're dealing with scumbag terrorists, and that left-wing idiots are using this against him.

Newsmax totally ripped the administration over this hand-wringing in a kick-ass article. A must read.

2 posted on 05/09/2004 6:51:26 PM PDT by ServesURight
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To: demkicker
I rented a film made by the BBC titled "Bravo Two Zero", about the first Gulf War, in which a British ranger team is captured by Saddam's men and tortured. One of the torturers says to a British soldier, "This is NOT Geneva." This is based on a true story, the war memoirs of Andy McNabb.
3 posted on 05/09/2004 6:54:24 PM PDT by Ciexyz
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To: demkicker
I see your point. However, it may be the only way at this time to keep out ahead of the story, (with more trouble to come for sure), to avoid having his ass kicked by John Kerry in November.

At any rate, as CiC, it is his perogative....and I trust him more than I would Bill Clinton in getting to the bottom of it with the intent of restoring a clean image to all in uniform.

4 posted on 05/09/2004 6:55:15 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (As an overseas Yank, in all my years, I've NEVER seen such disdain toward Americans & the USA.)
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To: demkicker
When Rummy's testimony the other day revealed that Hillary knew about the photos well before Rummy, it only makes good sense that Bush wants a full data dump. It is clear that, for the DemocRATs, this is no longer a military issue but a political one. Bush has just issued the "shields up" command, hopefully not too late.
5 posted on 05/09/2004 6:55:59 PM PDT by XEHRpa
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To: XEHRpa
indeed, but are all the photos even available to the Pentagon? Media outlets are surely is sole possesion of some of them - perhaps facilitated in getting them through Democrats as you note.

the story regarding the leak of this information will get zero media attention.
6 posted on 05/09/2004 6:58:28 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: demkicker
Geeze, I'm thinking that Bush maybe going overboard. He needs to get on offense and make it plain to the media that any further leaking of photos of the Iraqi prison abuse will only serve to hurt our military men and women.
****
Either that or they better the F find out what homo-erotica libs are behind the photos. Is it just me that senses that it looks like a demonic-rat behind this crap? It looks like this whole last week is something some Harvard professor dreamed up.
7 posted on 05/09/2004 6:59:19 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: demkicker
Good grief - who writes this stuff? The President is already quite aware of the photos/videos chronicling the misdeeds by individuals that exist out there.
8 posted on 05/09/2004 7:03:03 PM PDT by Senator Pardek
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To: demkicker
A furious President Bush has demanded to see all photos and videos showing abuse of Iraq detainees...

This is great PR. We wouldn't want to think Bush is laughing at the photos of Iraqi prisoners on leashes like most the rest of us are.

9 posted on 05/09/2004 7:04:02 PM PDT by Jorge
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To: Senator Pardek
how do you know? we have no idea what is out there, in totality. events could have been staged and filmed, anyone can wear a US army uniform and be filmed from the neck down raping an iraqi teenager.
10 posted on 05/09/2004 7:05:22 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: demkicker
The Bush campaign should go on a very agressive PR offensive and release all the torture videos and photos of Saddam Hussein regime. The people need to see what is "real torture and abuse". Also if they have something damaging about Kerry self admitted war atrocities, they must give it to a friendly media outlet and let all hell break loose.
11 posted on 05/09/2004 7:07:49 PM PDT by jveritas
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To: oceanview
The president has instructed Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld to present him with him all known images that could further deepen the crises.

Ya really think Rumsfeld hasn't done this already?

"I'm sorry Mr. President - we've been real busy at the Pentagon lately - I promise to have this stuff on your desk by the end of the week."

12 posted on 05/09/2004 7:08:16 PM PDT by Senator Pardek
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To: Senator Pardek
my point is, there may be photos that exist that are outside the Pentagon's control.
13 posted on 05/09/2004 7:09:53 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: demkicker
Geeze, I'm thinking that Bush maybe going overboard. He needs to get on offense and make it plain to the media that any further leaking of photos of the Iraqi prison abuse will only serve to hurt our military men and women.

The genie's out of the bottle These photos are at least in Seymour Hersh's hands, and will likely become public.

The only upside to any of this whole sordid mess is that John Kerry is kept off the front pages.

14 posted on 05/09/2004 7:10:23 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: Senator Pardek
My guess: Rumsfeld has already handed in his resignation. Bush is holding it - waiting to make the decision to accpet, or not.
15 posted on 05/09/2004 7:10:44 PM PDT by BenLurkin
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To: demkicker; All
Let's identify who is going "overboard": It's not the President; it's the media, Democrats, anti-war zealots, and self-absorbed Senators who want to use this issue to damage the President (and the military) during an election year!

I suggest you call the following senators and inform them that they must SUPPORT our troops/war effort NOT use their positions on the ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE to destroy both!

John Warner (R-Virginia)
Chair, Armed Services Committee
202.224.2023

Carl Levin (D-Michigan)
Ranking Member, Armed Services Committee
202.224.6221

REPUBLICANS

John McCain (Arizona)
202.224.2235

James Inhofe (Oklahoma)
202.224.4721

Pat Roberts (Kansas)
202.224.4774

Wayne Allard (Colorado)
202.224.5941

Jeff Sessions (Alabama)
202.224.4124

Susan Collins (Maine)
202.224.2523

John Ensign (Nevada)
202.224.6244

James Talent (Missouri)
202.224.6154

Saxby Chambliss (Georgia)
202.224.3521

Lindsey Graham (S. Carolina)
202.224.5972

Elizabeth Dole (N. Carolina)
202.224.6342

John Cornyn (Texas)
202.224.2934

DEMOCRATS

Ed Kennedy (Massachusetts)
202.224.4543

Robert Byrd (West Virginia)
202.224.3954

Joseph Lieberman (Connecticut)
202.224.4041

Jack Reed (Rhode Island)
202.224.4642

Daniel Akaka (Hawaii)
202.224.6361

Bill Nelson (Florida)
202.224.5274

E. Benjamin Nelson (Nebraska)
202.224.6551

Mark Dayton (Minnesota)
202.224.3244

Evan Bayh (Indiana)
202.224.5623

Hillary Clinton (New York)
202.224.4451

Mark Pryor (Arkansas)
202.224.2353
16 posted on 05/09/2004 7:11:15 PM PDT by DrDeb
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To: oceanview
how do you know? we have no idea what is out there, in totality. events could have been staged and filmed, anyone can wear a US army uniform and be filmed from the neck down raping an iraqi teenager.

Any evidence that any of this was "staged"? Every single one of the participants in the photos released so far has been identified as a service member or an outsourced civilian.

Don't kid yourself; these are our guys, doing unbelieveably dumb things.

17 posted on 05/09/2004 7:12:39 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: sinkspur
Kerry doesn't need to be on the front pages - this issue is his campaign. there is nothing left to run on, the economic improvements are well under way (gas prices aside). Iraq is it, its the only issue left.
18 posted on 05/09/2004 7:12:41 PM PDT by oceanview
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Comment #19 Removed by Moderator

To: BenLurkin
My guess: Rumsfeld has already handed in his resignation. Bush is holding it - waiting to make the decision to accpet, or not.

I think you're right, and, unfortunately, I believe that, within a month, Bush will accept it.

20 posted on 05/09/2004 7:14:08 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: demkicker
There is also an article on Drudge called "Zogby says election Kerry's to lose" I cannot access it. Has anyone been able to see what its about?
21 posted on 05/09/2004 7:14:37 PM PDT by tirednvirginia ((But things are looking up!))
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To: sinkspur
I was referring to the next set of photos. when someone holds a dog near a prisoner, and that is referred to as "torture", its clear that that photo isn't being presented with any context. who know what the next sets will show. Hersh has already tipped his hand - the "rape" stuff is coming.
22 posted on 05/09/2004 7:15:23 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: oceanview
Fair enough.

I exasperatingly spent two days trying to convince folks on another forum that the alleged rape photos concerning GIs were from a cheesy porn flick - I got nowhere.

Whadaya think will happen when the real stuff comes out?!

23 posted on 05/09/2004 7:15:25 PM PDT by Senator Pardek
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To: demkicker
Maybe he just doesn't want anymore surprises to come along. I don't blame him.
24 posted on 05/09/2004 7:16:51 PM PDT by LoudRepublicangirl (loudrepublicangirl)
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To: sinkspur
then he's toast. if Bush is dumb enough to toss him, in the face of public opinion saying they want the opposite, for actions that he is not personally responsible for - then let me be the first to say he deserves to take his lumps in the election.
25 posted on 05/09/2004 7:17:19 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: oceanview
Are you serious? Holding a barking dog on a naked man, cowering in fear?

This couldn't be worse if it were Bull Connor turning his snarling German shepherds loose on blacks in Selma, Alabama, a la 1965.

There is simply no defense for this. None.

26 posted on 05/09/2004 7:18:15 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: Senator Pardek
the rumors I heard were that iraqi guards were the rapists, I guess (who knows?) filmed by an american soldier.
27 posted on 05/09/2004 7:19:38 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: demkicker; redrock; dighton; Poohbah; hchutch; NittanyLion
This tracks with what I've been hearing, and with what I've seen of the President.

People in the American Military violated their orders (which are ultimately HIS), their UCMJ, the LOAC, and Geneva Conventions. Incompetent commanders enabled it, and did nothing to prevent or stop it. Those same commanders are now attempting to shift blame and excuse their own lapses.

This total disgrace and lack of all Honor must have had the President pounding his desk. It certainly got him mad at SecDef, who he respects. That's no small thing.

I would imagine him seated behind his desk, with the Joint Chiefs at attention in front of him, saying,"Gentlemen, I want somebody's ASS for this, and I want it YESTERDAY!".

It's heartening to know that, unlike his despicable predecessor, he will NOT try to cover this up, nor protect those who betrayed him. I don't think the "general" or some of the officers responsible will be able to get off this one by blaming the Enlisteds.

28 posted on 05/09/2004 7:20:37 PM PDT by Long Cut ("Fightin's commenced, Ike, now get to fightin' or get outta the way!"...Wyatt Earp, in Tombstone)
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To: oceanview
if Bush is dumb enough to toss him, in the face of public opinion saying they want the opposite, for actions that he is not personally responsible for - then let me be the first to say he deserves to take his lumps in the election.

We'll see what the public thinks after a new round of pictures. Maybe rapes and snarling dogs and even murder won't matter.

I'm guessing they will.

Here's a hint: there will be military people who saw something terribly wrong, pitted against other military people who apparently didn't.

29 posted on 05/09/2004 7:21:41 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: demkicker
Oh please. What rational person thinks that the American public would blame Republicans for a criminal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" gay porn ring among prison guards?!
30 posted on 05/09/2004 7:22:30 PM PDT by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: sinkspur
ever watch COPS? are you kidding me? what do you think American police officers do with those german shepards when they find a perp resisting arrest?

I had a co-worker who was knocked to the ground (deliberately) by a police horse in NYC doing crowd control. they use the horses in that manner all the time.
31 posted on 05/09/2004 7:22:36 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: sinkspur
As I understand it, the photo shows the dogs nearby. All we have of the 'attack' is Hersh's story which is based on supposition.

Apparently, the actual attack did NOT get photographed--only the before (dogs in proximity) and after (prisoner laying on floor with apparent bleeding 'wound').
32 posted on 05/09/2004 7:22:40 PM PDT by TomGuy (Clintonites have such good hind-sight because they had their heads up their hind-ends 8 years.)
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To: BenLurkin
NO WAY, President Bush said in public that Rumsfeld will remain in his cabinet. You can bet your sweet bippy that President Bush will not turn his back on Rummy. If Rumsfeld resigns, it will not be at GWB's request
33 posted on 05/09/2004 7:23:08 PM PDT by MJY1288 (Our Injured Soldiers at Walter Reed Have Yet to be Visited by John Kerry. What's he Afraid of?)
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To: demkicker
A furious President Bush has demanded to see all photos and videos showing abuse of Iraq detainees, a senior White House source said late Sunday.

Barney Frank has also demanded to see all the photos, albeit for a different reason.

34 posted on 05/09/2004 7:23:14 PM PDT by The_Media_never_lie
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To: sinkspur
"This couldn't be worse if it were Bull Connor turning his snarling German shepherds loose on blacks in Selma, Alabama, a la 1965. There is simply no defense for this. None."

I agree. The criminals who engaged in those acts must be punished...harshly.

...But Bull Conner was in Birmingham.

35 posted on 05/09/2004 7:24:25 PM PDT by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: tirednvirginia
Just got this from Newsmax.com

Mystic: Iraqi Prisoner Photos a 'Set-up'

We usually don't report on psychic phenomena - "out there" as it is.

Still, we get some unusual observations over the transom from time to time.

One mystic we have covered is Elizabeth Baron of elizabethbaron.com, who seemed to have great revelations during the Washington sniper story. Days before police captured Muhammad and Malvo, Baron was on a national radio program (it was recorded) and said the feds had it all wrong: there were two shooters, one younger, another older; that they were motivated by religion; and that they were driving a blue car. At the time, FBI profilers said there was only a single white male conducting the killings, and reports had him driving a white van.

As it turned out, the older Muhammad and the younger Malvo, both Muslims, were captured in a blue car days later.

Interestingly, Baron e-mailed us early this week and said the revelation she got from a saint told her that "the people in the videotape who are doing the Iraqi prisoners wrong --- that is a setup."

We found it interesting that this reference to a "videotape" came days before Donald Rumsfeld and the Pentagon first said that the abuse scandal includes videotape of these incidents.

"I cannot understand why the public has not picked up this information," Baron's revelation offered, adding that there are some powerful forces behind this story.

"The authority goes pretty high up but it is a setup to make the President of the United States and to make America look stupid and to be seen with two faces," she said.

Here are some more revelations that we can't endorse but certainly find interesting:

"It is very important for the President to get to the culprit. The man [or woman] who is behind all that wears a tan uniform and has two stars on his shoulders. He is an individual who hates the American way and wants to see changes in America. He does not have an interest in winning a war. That is definitely not his interest. This man has been paid millions and millions of dollars to do this awful thing. It doesn't take someone who is really bright to look at these videos and see that they are staged. And everything that was done was staged so that it would look so ridiculous. It is important for the Intelligence to get to the bottom of this. They will find that an officer [which could be a man or a woman] who is very high up will have money put in a Swiss bank. It will not be in his name though. It will be in a woman's name who is connected with him/her and she is not American. She is not his wife; she is a girlfriend, but this money will be transferred around in years to come. This money was put together by a number of people who got together and planted this little scheme right in the middle of political battles in America. It was meant to make the President look silly. It is important for everyone to pray for peace because this war can go into another war and that could go into another war and as you know, two of the most dangerous places on earth are Iran and North Korea. These people have the ability to create mass destruction in many ways so it is important for everyone to pray for peace at this time."

Two Star General in a tan uniform. Well, that narrows it down. Any guesses?

36 posted on 05/09/2004 7:24:30 PM PDT by Texas Mom
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To: oceanview
Hasn't happened, but your emotion
just thinking about the prediction
that it will, has got you making
derogatory remarks about President
Bush.

Not me.
37 posted on 05/09/2004 7:25:28 PM PDT by txrangerette
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To: oceanview
Yes - an Iraqi guard, under the aegis of the US military - while being filmed by a GI.

That's the ticket!

38 posted on 05/09/2004 7:26:02 PM PDT by Senator Pardek
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To: oceanview
ever watch COPS? are you kidding me? what do you think American police officers do with those german shepards when they find a perp resisting arrest?

LOL!! This is NOT resisting arrest!!! The guy's standing there, buck naked, with a 100 pound dog, with 3 inch bicuspids bared in his direction! The prisoner is completely confined!

And, apparently, there's a picture of him bleeding, on the ground, after the dog has done his business.

Ugly, ugly stuff.

39 posted on 05/09/2004 7:26:11 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: sinkspur
well sure, if iraqi guards are raping people, and the media presents them without context to make people believe that US soliders are doing it.

same thing with murder. how many of those deaths were associated with prisoners attacking guards, or trying to escape? its easy to say "prisoner X was killed in custody", and call it "murder", so long as you don't present the context regarding how it happened. Without context, it sounds like US soldiers just randomly walked into prisoner cells and shot them in the head. I want to know the whole story.
40 posted on 05/09/2004 7:26:30 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: TomGuy
Apparently, the actual attack did NOT get photographed--only the before (dogs in proximity) and after (prisoner laying on floor with apparent bleeding 'wound').

Logic would dictate that some kind of attack occurred, don't you think?

41 posted on 05/09/2004 7:27:27 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: oceanview
what do you think American police officers do with those german shepards when they find a perp resisting arrest?

In a prison while one is naked up against a cell? Lol...

42 posted on 05/09/2004 7:29:06 PM PDT by Senator Pardek
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To: oceanview
my point is, there may be photos that exist that are outside the Pentagon's control.

Well, given how common digital cameras are, I'd bet that there are more than a few photos that have yet to come to light...

43 posted on 05/09/2004 7:29:52 PM PDT by NYC GOP Chick ("If I could shoot like that, I would still be in the NBA" -- Bill Clinton, circa 1995)
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To: Senator Pardek
look, don't get me wrong, I am not excusing rape. But I want to know the whole story, that's all I am saying. If some GI did film that, that may well be worthy of a life sentence. and it had better really be rape, not consentual sex between two iraqis filmed by some pervert GI with a porn film director fantasy.

Again, all I ask for is the whole truth.
44 posted on 05/09/2004 7:30:39 PM PDT by oceanview
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To: Senator Pardek
Did you hear that Rumsfeld himself could not get copies of the photos until the night before the senate meeting?

I think Bush was telling Rumsfeld to demand the military give him all copies of any abuse immediately by presidential order. I wonder if some of the military is possibly willing to sabotage Rumsfeld.

45 posted on 05/09/2004 7:30:56 PM PDT by ClancyJ (It's just not safe to vote Democratic.)
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To: BenLurkin
My guess: Rumsfeld has already handed in his resignation. Bush is holding it - waiting to make the decision to accpet, or not.

If Rumsfeld resigns or is canned, the war is over - and Bush cannot afford to do that.

Rumsfeld is staying - at least - through the election, but I fear that he may be out in a second term. :(

46 posted on 05/09/2004 7:30:59 PM PDT by NYC GOP Chick ("If I could shoot like that, I would still be in the NBA" -- Bill Clinton, circa 1995)
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To: Jim_Curtis
Is it just me that senses that it looks like a demonic-rat behind this crap?

Since none of the Americans in the photos is denying their authenticity, I think that it's just you. I couldn't even begin to imagine how this could be created as a political set-up. Sometimes bad things happen in this world that can't be explained by crackpot theories.
47 posted on 05/09/2004 7:31:36 PM PDT by HostileTerritory
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To: oceanview
same thing with murder. how many of those deaths were associated with prisoners attacking guards, or trying to escape? its easy to say "prisoner X was killed in custody", and call it "murder", so long as you don't present the context regarding how it happened. Without context, it sounds like US soldiers just randomly walked into prisoner cells and shot them in the head. I want to know the whole story.

Remember Abner Louima? He really DID get brutalized with a broomstick. The "context" only made it worse.

Perhaps "context" will mitigate to some extent, but I don't expect it to calm the storm.

Somebody's head will have to be offered on a platter, and I'm afraid it's going to be Rumsfeld's.

48 posted on 05/09/2004 7:31:45 PM PDT by sinkspur (Adopt a dog or a cat from an animal shelter! It will save one life, and may save two.)
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To: sinkspur
Having been around the military a bit, it is very difficult for me to believe that some or most of this was not known and condoned by some who were/are high in the chain of commmand. If it was not known it is pure negligence and incompetence and that alone makes them guilty.

One who may not fall but who certainly has a great deal of responsibility for oversight is the General (can't remember her name) who ran the MP Brigade with no discipline, none. The troops did whatever they desired, no saluting, no respect for seniors, lowest enlisted ranks calling field grade officers by their first names, etc.

I won't be surprised at what comes out but my heart goes out to the troops in the field who will take the brunt of the backlash (effect from the libs and media in the US).

In my view, we no longer understand how to wage war.
49 posted on 05/09/2004 7:31:51 PM PDT by oldngray
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To: sinkspur
alot of perps in the US are just scared, they run, and the dogs are turned loose on them. these prisoners may well be Fedayeen or iraqi secret police. who deserves to have the dog used on them more, that iraqi, or some inner city American kid scared out of his mind for having a vile of crack in his car?
50 posted on 05/09/2004 7:33:05 PM PDT by oceanview
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