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Kerry - Pardoned by Carter in 1977? - Research<p>
Various | 9/5/04 | Tacis

Posted on 09/05/2004 7:29:43 AM PDT by Tacis

The record is puzzling. Why would Kerry claim hero status and then refuse to allow us to see his record and allow every reader to confirm his claims? Why, even in war time, does Kerry’ service in the USNR appear to stretch from 1966 to 1978, 12 years? How does one explain the strange irregularities (multiple citations for his Silver Star) and inconsistencies in the Kerry military records that are available? Why does the 6 year (plus six month?) USNR obligation begun by Kerry in 2/66 appear to end in 1/70 again, in time of war, even though available records seem to indicate that the terminal date of his reserve obligation was 17 Feb 1972? Why are the documents that should be available, not there? The answers to all these question may be linked and surprisingly obvious. My thesis would be very easy to disprove (if it is false) by simply releasing Kerry’s entire military record.

Even if you include a lot of puffery and self-promotion, Kerry’s in-country record in late 1968 and early 1969 was exceptional and one to be admired and honored. But, for reasons we do not yet understand, in roughly late 1969, Kerry turned bad.

In late 1969, Kerry asked for an early release from “active duty”even though he had re-upped to serve on active duty until August, 1970. He said he wished to enter the democrat party primary, held in September, 1970 in Massachusetts, to be a candidate for Congress for the Third District. He was detached from active duty effective 4:00 PM, 2 January 1970 and specifically reminded the he assumed “... The status of a member of the Naval Reserve on inactive duty.”

The paper trail of available Navy records disappears for almost 8 years. In March, 1970, Kerry drops out of the Congressional primary in favor of the notorious Father Drinan, Dean of Boston College Law School (where Kerry later attended law school, 1973-1976). From early, 1970 through the Summer of 1973, Kerry takes part in activities involving war protests, meeting in Paris with Viet Cong representatives and the leadership of the Vietnam Veterans Against the War. These activities, some of which may have been legal, were of very questionable patriotism for an honest citizen of the US but certainly inappropriate for a US Naval officer.

That’s pretty much fact. Now, the thesis that explains the rest of the mysteries. I believe that Kerry was court martialed in the early 70s or otherwise terminated from the USNR under conditions other than honorable. Whatever actually happened represented a stain on Kerry’s record that might not have been taken lightly even by voters in Massachusetts.

Then, on January 21,1977, Democrat President Jimmy Carter (POTUS - January 20,1977 - January 20,1981) gave a blanket pardon, in Proclamation 4483, to certain offenders as follows:

“Acting pursuant to the grant of authority in Article II, Section 2, of the Constitution of the United States, I, Jimmy Carter, President of the United States, do hereby grant a full, complete and unconditional pardon to: (1) all persons who may have committed any offense between August 4, 1964 and March 28, 1973 in violation of the Military Selective Service Act or any rule or regulation promulgated thereunder; and (2) all persons heretofore convicted, irrespective of the date of conviction, of any offense committed between August 4, 1964 and March 28, 1973 in violation of the Military Selective Service Act, or any rule or regulation promulgated thereunder, restoring to them full political, civil and other rights.”

Thus, if my thesis is correct, Kerry’s offense must have occurred between 2 January 1970 and March 28, 1973. My thesis suggests that during 1977, Kerry made application for full pardon under the administrative procedures promulgated by the Office of the Pardon Attorney, Department of Justice. He almost certainly sought and received the support of Massachusetts Senator Kennedy who had much clout in the Carter administration. Kennedy may have been responsible for suggesting that the records of such a fine young man be embellished by Citations from the Secretary of the Navy, rather than a mere admiral, and in other details not yet known.

In my hypothesis, Kerry’s request for full pardon was granted. Kerry applied for his military records to be corrected accordingly, and applied for an honorable discharge. The Secretary of the Navy wrote to Kerry on Feb 16 1978, enclosing an Honorable Discharge Certificate and stating:

“This action is taken in accordance with the approved recommendations of a board of officers convened ... to examine the official records of officers of the Naval Reserve on inactive duty and determine whether they should be retained on the rolls of the Reserve Component or separated from the naval service pursuant to Secretarial instructions promulgated in reference [c].”

The reference, “[c],”is to “BUPERSMAN 3830300.” A Google search did not provide any information regarding the text of this provision. But, this might explain why he was discharged 12 long years after enlistment.

This hypothesis explains the inconsistencies in Kerry’s record and makes it clear why he acts like a three card Monte dealer in insisting that we watch his time in Nam very carefully and not pay attention to what happened afterward. It is exactly the position Benedict Arnold took with respect to what happened at West Point and afterward.

Proofs? Well, no. Certainly, the official USNR file on Kerry would quickly prove or disprove my thesis. Kerry refuses to sign a Standard Form 180 authorizing the Navy to release it, suggesting that Kerry has much more to lose by showing his records than by continuing to conceal material information. Kennedy? Not likely that his office would say anything that might negatively effect Kerry even though it might be in the nation’s best interest. It is, after all, Kennedy. The US Navy? It is unlikely that the Navy would, of its own volition, risk alienating a sitting US Senator and a man who might be the next CinC. Kerry’s first wife, Julia Thorne, who went to Paris with Kerry when he met with the Viet Cong, and her brother, David H. Thorne, certainly might be able to add facts but, would the old timey, ultra-left wing, liberal media even ask them?

But, there is a another possibility. Many aspects of the Presidential Pardon/Clemency process are matters of public record, in the Department of Justice. If Jimmy Carter pardoned Kerry, there should be a public record that Kerry shouldn’t be able to conceal. An applicant appears to be told in the application process:

  "A record of each Certificate of Pardon will be maintained in the Office of the Pardon Attorney as an official record, together with your application form and any other documents compiled in the course of processing your request. The Pardon Attorney may disclose the contents of such files to anyone when the disclosure is required by law or the ends of justice. In particular, public record documents that may be compiled in the course of processing an application, such as the judgment order from the criminal case for which pardon is sought, trial or sentencing transcripts, court opinions, and newspaper articles, are generally made available upon request by third-parties (including representatives of the news media) pursuant to the Freedom of Information Act, unless such disclosure could reasonably be expected to constitute an unwarranted invasion of the petitioner's personal privacy. In addition, unsolicited Congressional correspondence is treated in the same manner. On the other hand, non-public documents that may be compiled in the course of processing an application, such as the application form itself, are not generally available under the Freedom of Information Act."

The DoJ procedures indicate:

"Publicly available information for which a FOIA request is not required:

Publicly available information: Executive clemency statistics from the administration of President McKinley to the present; rules governing the pardon attorney and petitions for executive clemency published at 28 C.F.R. §§ 0.35-36 and § 1.1 et seq.; forms for applying for executive clemency; publication: Civil Disabilities of Convicted Felons: A State-by-State Survey (October 1996); copies of clemency warrants and proclamations for persons who have been granted executive clemency; description of clemency procedures contained in United States Attorney's Manual at § 1-2.110 et seq.; whether an individual has applied for executive clemency and action on such application."

Thus, I would urge any individual or member of the media with an interest in learning the truth about Kerry’s total military record to contact/visit the Office of the Pardon Attorney, Department of Justice and inquire whether there are any records for John Forbes Kerry. Check variations of Kerry’s name (intentional misfiling?), things like “John Kerry Forbes.” Kerry’s Social Security Number appears to be shown, unredacted, on a 17 Dec 1970 document in his file but his Military ID number is not known. Finally, don’t limit inquiries to actions under Proclamation 4483, President Carter may have taken some clemency action because key party members may have required him to. Finally, From a reading of the above, it appears that certain information should be available on a “walk in” basis and other information must be requested via FOIA application.

"The offices of record are :

FOIA Contact:

Samuel T. Morison, Attorney Advisor Office of the Pardon Attorney 4th Floor, 500 First Street, N.W. Department of Justice Washington, DC 20530-0001 (202) 616-6070

Conventional Reading Room:

United States Department of Justice Office of the Pardon Attorney 4th Floor, 500 First Street, N.W. Washington, D.C. 20530"

Several observations: It is indeed unfortunate that a man who would be President, so distrusts the American public and his own background that he hides material information in his military records in the hope of hornswoggling the electorate, of tricking us into believing he is one thing when, in fact, he may be another. Second, the above process should have long ago been followed by the media. It is also unfortunate that most of the traditional media are far too interested in electing Kerry to bother with doing any fact finding or reporting of information that might dissuade the electorate or present the truth.

Proof? Again, no, no proof, but as long as Kerry in his arrogance, refuses to trust Americans, we have the right to make assumptions about his dishonesty, mendacity and refusal to be candid and to assume that he uses similar duplicity with respect to other matters, as well. The above represents my current best guess about why Kerry is being dishonest and what he is hiding.


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: carter; clemency; courtmartial; kerry; pardon; usnavy
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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Please do not show this to any member of the neocommunist, ultra-left wing media. I'd hate to hand them a shot at the Pulitzer Prize for Investigative Reporting when, I know, they, in their legions, are about to investigate and write about women not being involved with the Masters Golf Tournament in Georgia.

And, if you have the text of “BUPERSMAN 3830300,” please shout out and share.

Note that Monday, 9/6/04 is a holiday and DoJ offices should be closed to the public.

1 posted on 09/05/2004 7:29:46 AM PDT by Tacis
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To: Tacis

You may have it,,good job


2 posted on 09/05/2004 7:33:40 AM PDT by cajungirl (no)
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To: Tacis

No one has the right to question John F-ing Kerry.


3 posted on 09/05/2004 7:35:29 AM PDT by Piquaboy
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To: Tacis

We're going to find out because from what I read the Pentagon is going to investigate.


4 posted on 09/05/2004 7:36:26 AM PDT by sirchtruth (Do you just think I fell off a turnip truck?)
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To: Tacis
These activities, some of which may have been legal, were of very questionable patriotism for an honest citizen of the US but certainly inappropriate for a US Naval officer.

Hammer hitting nail on head!

5 posted on 09/05/2004 7:38:51 AM PDT by sirchtruth (Do you just think I fell off a turnip truck?)
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To: Tijeras_Slim; Cincinatus' Wife; WhyisaTexasgirlinPA; kattracks; 7.62 x 51mm; rightwing2; ...

BTTT - a good read that really makes more sense than much I have seen recently.


6 posted on 09/05/2004 7:41:06 AM PDT by SLB ("We must lay before Him what is in us, not what ought to be in us." C. S. Lewis)
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To: Tacis
Carter's pardon was for draft dodgers. Note that the language you provide is about Selective Service Act violations.

Kerry enlisted and at least fulfilled his active duty obligation. I don't think that his problem with records is about Selective Service problems. IIRC, there's some document (on Kerry's web site?) from Kerry's draft board stating that he's no longer under their purview.

Back around 1973/1974, I did a little work for ex-military trying to get their discharges upgraded. There was (is?) a board which handles applications. Kerry would have to apply to that board, if the procedures were followed.

The interesting question seems to be:

Kerry signed up for a six-year obligation in 1966. He should've been discharged in 1972.

It seems as if he was discharged in 1978.

Why the additional six years?
7 posted on 09/05/2004 7:41:35 AM PDT by Mike Fieschko (Oh, and Dick Cheney too.)
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To: Tacis

Off topic: I've heard Kerry say he served TWO tours of duty. Is this true? If so, then he served more than the four months in VN, right? Kerry is so confusing!


8 posted on 09/05/2004 7:41:49 AM PDT by ncpatriot
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To: Tacis

pursue this and get back to us........if true this would end his senaate career as well.


9 posted on 09/05/2004 7:42:42 AM PDT by tioga (GOP, the Grand Old Party. God Bless George W. Bush. Four More Years!)
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To: ncpatriot

- kerry's first tour was on a big ship way out to sea, since the North Vietnam had no navy, he was quite safe.


10 posted on 09/05/2004 7:43:48 AM PDT by tioga (GOP, the Grand Old Party. God Bless George W. Bush. Four More Years!)
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To: Tacis
I believe that if he was court martialed, that it would have been fairly common knowledge. He wouldn't have been able to hide it IMHO, particularly given his highly visible status and activities.

Secondly, I do not believe the pardon of such a court martial could have been covered under Carter's pardon because it would have had nothing to do with the MIlitray selective service act or any violations pertaining thereto.

Now, Kerry should have been court martialed and tried for treason. He aided and abetted the enemy, illegaly consulting with/negotiating with their representatives as they negotiated peace in Paris. He also, in his work woith the anti-war movement was a part of meetings where the killing of American politicians were discussed. To my knowledge he never reported those discussions.

All of this while he was in the naval reserve. He should be brought up on charges today for those crimes IMHO.

But it's just my opinion.

11 posted on 09/05/2004 7:46:16 AM PDT by Jeff Head (www.dragonsfuryseries.com)
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To: Tacis

I think that Carter's blanket pardons pertaining to "selective Service" laws are not likely pertinent to any secrets kerry is hiding.....but "other" proceedings of a different nature could also have been held and then "pardoned" by Carter outside the Selective Service pardons.

I just don't believe that he violated the Selective Service law.....he was on active duty continuously for way more than 3 years.


12 posted on 09/05/2004 7:46:27 AM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68
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To: Tacis
Not to rain on your parade but I think the pardons granted by Carter were for draft dodgers.

A more plausible explanation is that John Kerry was an FBI,DOD informant against the VVAW and the anti-war movement.
13 posted on 09/05/2004 7:46:57 AM PDT by stockpirate (Dick Morris; Before he spoke, supporting Bush was a duty one owed to the fallen. Now, it is an honor)
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To: sirchtruth
These activities, some of which may have been legal, were of very questionable patriotism for an honest citizen of the US but certainly inappropriate for a US Naval officer.

A meeting where fellow radicals discussed murdering US senators is more than inappropriate. It is sedition.

14 posted on 09/05/2004 7:47:00 AM PDT by hflynn
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

To: Tacis

Since Kerry is now being investigated by the Dept of The Navy, little bits and pieces surface, such as Kerry being courtmartialed in the early 70's by the Navy. His Protests, and three meetings with the enemy in Paris was done by him WHILE being in the Navy Reserve, an offense in the Military which is court martial. Interesting to see, what the investigation will bring...more than we ever wanted to know, and it will be ugly.


16 posted on 09/05/2004 7:48:46 AM PDT by Inge C
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To: Jeff Head

What if he did these things, is there a statute of limitations on prosecuting this? He might have gone for the pardon to prevent this from occurring. He might have wanted a dishonorable discharge changed so he could play the war hero. Who knows, he is scum.


17 posted on 09/05/2004 7:49:19 AM PDT by tioga (GOP, the Grand Old Party. God Bless George W. Bush. Four More Years!)
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To: tioga
Here is the kind of “liar” that Kerry is:

Kerry titles his book "Tour of Duty" for his service in Vietnam. He also claims that he had TWO tours of duty in Vietnam (because of his time on the USS Gridley).

John Kerry was in Vietnam (for 4 months) and yes he was on the deep-water coast of Vietnam on the USS Gridley (for a few weeks), but he did not serve a tour in Vietnam.

A Tour in the Nam was 12 months, one year, 365 days, one trip around the sun. Guys would count down the days until their time was up. It was a big deal. When you only had a few weeks to go until your 12 months was up, you were "SHORT", going home soon. When you broke 100 days you were a “Double Digit”. A “Single Digit” Vet (less than 10 days to go) could be found in his hooch packing.

This issue is important for this reason. John Kerry knows that he didn't serve a Tour, let alone TWO Tours, in Vietnam yet he brazenly reports that he did.

One might argue 'Well, the time that Kerry spent in Nam was HIS tour, so what is the big deal"?

If that is your argument then Kerry should have named his book "My Time in Nam" or something. Not give the impression that he spent a tour in Nam. AND, there is NO excuse for his claim for TWO TOURS in Nam. It is John Kerry spinning the truth to make himself something that he is not.

As far as Unfit for Command is concerned, I have read it. The Swifties could care less if John Kerry got medals, their issue is the same as what I explained above (and the fact that Kerry smeared their good name with his lies) and that is that Kerry diverts from the truth to make himself into something that he is not so much, that he cannot be trusted.

Kerry embellished his After Action Reports to get medals that he didn’t deserve. He fabricated accusations when he came back from Vietnam when he spoke before the Senate Intelligence Committee when he said that his fellow Vietnam Veterans committed atrocities. He has never provided any proof that his accusations were true, and in fact now admits that his accusations were “over the top”. Over the top? They were untrue! And his falsifications harmed POW’s, their families, and Vietnam Veterans in general.

POW’s who were in North Vietnam prison camps when Kerry was telling his fabricated stories to the Senate and the American public to bolster his political ambitions were tortured and threatened to be placed on trial as “War Criminals”. POW’s were told by their captors “You will never go home” because of Kerry’s fabrications. Kerry’s untrue accusations are unforgivable.

General Vo Nguyen Gaip , the Commanding officer of the North Vietnamese Military and Bui Tin who served on the General Staff of the North Vietnam Army and received the unconditional surrender of South Vietnam on April 30, 1975 both claim that North Vietnam was poised to negotiate a surrender because of the Communist’s military failures during the 1968 Tet Offensive and thereafter. But because of the Anti-War movement in America (led by Jane Fonda and John Kerry) they felt that the Demonstrations “gave us confidence that we should hold on in the face of battlefield reverses."

America was kicking the Communist’s butt in every battle. General Westmoreland had the Communist’s number and was winning the war. America’s pullout of Vietnam was due to Kerry and his group of Demonstrators. Kerry’s ant-war activities played a very significant part in causing America to lose the war in Vietnam.

Because of John Kerry and others like him there are more names on the Vietnam Memorial in Washington D. C. than there otherwise would have been. There was also the slaughter of 3.5 million South Vietnamese, Laotians, and Cambodians when America pulled out that is significantly attributable to John Kerry and his now admittedly “over the top” accusations. John Kerry has blood dripping from his untrue accusations.

When I returned home to Los Angeles from Vietnam in 1971 my head was spinning as I walked through the Terminal at LAX, thinking about the culture of war that I had just left while looking around at the opulence in America. When I stepped outside onto the sidewalk a group of “Longhairs” walked by and one of them spat on me while the others called me a “Baby Killer”. I feel that the treatment that I received, and have lived with for the past 33 years, was due to John Kerry and his lies.

John Kerry does not have the moral integrity, honesty, or judgment to be the Commander-In-Chief of the world’s most powerful military. John Kerry IS, unfit for command.

Vietnam Veteran

Mekong Delta 1970-1971

18 posted on 09/05/2004 7:50:01 AM PDT by Viet-Boat-Rider (((KERRY IS A NARCISSISTIC LIAR, GOLDBRICKER, AND TRAITOR!)))
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To: leadpenny

Here!


19 posted on 09/05/2004 7:50:08 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: MAK1179

very interesting ping.......


20 posted on 09/05/2004 7:51:05 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (American Forces armed with what? Spit balls?)
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To: Tacis

bump


21 posted on 09/05/2004 7:53:10 AM PDT by aposiopetic
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To: sirchtruth
because from what I read the Pentagon is going to investigate.

When?
22 posted on 09/05/2004 7:53:25 AM PDT by Delphinium
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To: Viet-Boat-Rider

You are right about kerry.

Thank you for serving your country in Vietnam. You were then and are now one of my heroes. Not all of America felt that way then or do now; I am one of them.


23 posted on 09/05/2004 7:56:11 AM PDT by tioga (GOP, the Grand Old Party. God Bless George W. Bush. Four More Years!)
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To: Delphinium
Pentagon to check Kerry war record.
24 posted on 09/05/2004 7:56:54 AM PDT by Mike Fieschko (Oh, and Dick Cheney too.)
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To: ncpatriot

> I've heard Kerry say he served TWO tours of duty.

That can only be literally true if Kerry was a tourist.
He put in only one full "tour", and that was not "in"
Vietnam.

A short tour was one full year. He only served for
4 months in Vietnam on PCFs.

His time on the USS Gridley might have been a full
year, but it was only ever briefly off the coast of VN.

Now if Kerry is refering to his service to North Vietnam,
then yes, he probably gave them a full year of anti-war
service.
___________
"Tour of Duty"
The fictions begin with the title.


25 posted on 09/05/2004 7:58:03 AM PDT by Boundless
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To: Mike Fieschko; Tacis; ncpatriot
Did reserve status gain JF'K any pay? Medical benefits? College help? Cheap PX purchases like cigs or medicine?

Why wait as an inactive officer, if he would have had to re-up in '72 for 6 more years to a Navy he loathed?

Kerry's family had money back then but wasn't super-wealthy, IIRC.

It is also common for lefties to receive financial assistance from the very government that they want to topple, and from the very adults that they see as "the source of all problems".

Witness the DU'ers in NYC last week. They need more welfare benefits since the price of dope is higher in NYC.
26 posted on 09/05/2004 7:58:26 AM PDT by texas booster (Make a resolution to better yourself and your community in '04 - vote Republican!)
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To: ncpatriot
This is sKerry BS nuance. The USS Gridley was briefly off the coast of VN. So using sKerry's twisted nuance, USS Gridley's brief encounter with VN is "tour 1" and his time with swifties is "tour 2."

However, using this twisted logic, anyone who went on a SpecOp or served any temporary duty in VN could claim they served more than one tour in VN. Heck, if sKerry twists this enough, since he was assigned to 3 different swift boats, he can also claim that he served 4 tours in VN!

27 posted on 09/05/2004 7:59:49 AM PDT by Conservative Infidel
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To: texas booster
Did reserve status gain JF'K any pay? Medical benefits? College help? Cheap PX purchases like cigs or medicine?

I don't know. Other freepers, who are ex-military, could probably give an answer.
28 posted on 09/05/2004 8:01:05 AM PDT by Mike Fieschko (Oh, and Dick Cheney too.)
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To: Piquaboy

Wouldn't it be interesting if PEANUT was involved in this mess.


29 posted on 09/05/2004 8:02:50 AM PDT by pointsal
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To: Mike Fieschko

hubby was vet from that war. Got three years of stipend for education on GI bill,,,suspect Kerry got the same for law school.


30 posted on 09/05/2004 8:03:06 AM PDT by cajungirl (no)
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To: tioga

Regarding Kerry's "two" tours. The first was on the USS Gridley, of which only five weeks was spent anywhere near Vietnam, on aircraft gaurd duty. The remainder was spent off the west coast of the US and in a transit from there to Australia and back.

His second tour, on the Swifts, was four months, of which the first full month was spent at Cam Ranh Bay, in the safety and comfort of a former French resort while he went through training.

As to his "volunteering" for combat, that's a distortion as well. He first applied for a student deferrment to study in, of all places, Paris. He was refused. So, he volunteered for the Navy, with less prospects for combat duty in-country. After his year on the Gridley, he volunteered for the swift boats. However, at that time, the Swifts were coastal patrol craft that hardly ever saw combat. Right after he joined, they were ordered into the rivers, the dangerous duty with which they made their mark on naval history. Kerry is reported to have complained bitterly at the change.


31 posted on 09/05/2004 8:04:20 AM PDT by ConservativeVoice
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To: Mike Fieschko

Thanks, that is great, and very interesting.


32 posted on 09/05/2004 8:07:15 AM PDT by Delphinium
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To: Tacis
I don't see where Kerry violated any part of the "Selective Service" act, as Carter's plan was an amnesty program offered to draft dodgers that illegally ran to Canada and other places to avoid the draft.

Kerry violated much more serious laws when he met secretly with the North Vietnamese while he was still on active reserve duty status. He should be hung or shot for treason to the United States.

33 posted on 09/05/2004 8:08:24 AM PDT by TommyDale
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To: tioga
I believe he did do many bad things, not only unbecoming an officer, but in fact aiding and abetting the enemy.

But, as regards:

He might have gone for the pardon to prevent this from occurring

I do not believe he could have gotten any kind of pardon under Carter's pardon. Those pardons were for violations of the Army Selective Service Act...Kerry's crimes had nothing to do with that.

34 posted on 09/05/2004 8:10:37 AM PDT by Jeff Head (www.dragonsfuryseries.com)
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To: SLB

Thanks for the ping, SLB. Hammer on the head of a nail, alright!


35 posted on 09/05/2004 8:11:17 AM PDT by 7.62 x 51mm ( Veni Vidi Vino Visa "I came, I saw, I drank wine, I shopped")
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To: stockpirate
But if he was an informer he could tell everyone now and get the Swifties off of his case. He could tell them he did it for them. He wouldn't even have to go public and alienate his base he could go to them in private and if he showed them proof, I think they'd let it go.

The Purple Hearts and the medals are just annoyances to them but the anti-war activity hurt them.

36 posted on 09/05/2004 8:11:45 AM PDT by tiki
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To: Tacis
Very intriguing thesis, Tacis. This week, Mr. Kerry, speaking to the Boston Globe, said "If you wind up being less than what you're pretending to be, there is a major confrontation with value, self-esteem and your sense of how others view you." Do I see some major incoming confrontation and declining self-esteem on his part?
37 posted on 09/05/2004 8:12:04 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: Mike Fieschko
Kerry signed up for a six-year obligation in 1966. He should've been discharged in 1972.

It seems as if he was discharged in 1978.

Why the additional six years?

Based only on what's seen here, it looks like he signed up for another six years. Probably in the Active Reserve, which he promptly ignored. He came from a prominent blueblood family. He may not have a desertion behind him (as they accuse W of having), but he may have had to get his service record "touched up" for those missing years, which is why they're off-limits to us.

It also means he was still a commissioned officer while he was hob-nobbing with the North Vietnamese.

38 posted on 09/05/2004 8:13:37 AM PDT by 300winmag (FR's Hobbit Hole supports America's troops)
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To: Mike Fieschko

Yes, indeed. Why the additional six years?


39 posted on 09/05/2004 8:13:55 AM PDT by hershey
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To: sirchtruth
.
We're going to find out because from what I read the Pentagon is going to investigate.

That'll take years . . .

Check out the John F. Kerry Timeline. Email it to your friends.
.

40 posted on 09/05/2004 8:14:26 AM PDT by christie (http://www.hillaryforpresident-2008.com -- NOT!)
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To: Tacis

Great post!!!


41 posted on 09/05/2004 8:14:37 AM PDT by moonman
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To: Jeff Head

Thanks. kerry is hiding something when he refuses to sign a release form for all his documents though. Never having been in the military I will have to trust those who have and know far more then me to sort this out. Doesn't change my vote either way, mine was promised to Bush long ago.


42 posted on 09/05/2004 8:15:40 AM PDT by tioga (GOP, the Grand Old Party. God Bless George W. Bush. Four More Years!)
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To: Tacis

He was just waiting for a democrat to pardon his war crimes.


43 posted on 09/05/2004 8:15:49 AM PDT by television is just wrong
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To: tiki

If he admits to being an informer, the anti-war crowd will turn on him. He can't afford to do that. Personally, I don't think he was an informer -- that would have required intelligence on his part.


44 posted on 09/05/2004 8:17:20 AM PDT by TommyDale
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To: Tacis

It was thirteen (13) months for Marines!


45 posted on 09/05/2004 8:17:31 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Tacis

You are on to something


46 posted on 09/05/2004 8:17:39 AM PDT by pushforbush
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To: tiki

No, he wound need to correct the record and the left would dump him.

I don't think him being an informant is the case however.


47 posted on 09/05/2004 8:21:13 AM PDT by stockpirate (Dick Morris; Before he spoke, supporting Bush was a duty one owed to the fallen. Now, it is an honor)
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To: Tacis
if you have the text of ?BUPERSMAN 3830300,?

It's the Naval Bureau of Personnel Manual, probably 3830.300.

I'm still searching for the directive, its a bit elusive.

48 posted on 09/05/2004 8:21:28 AM PDT by angkor
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To: tioga
There are plenty of vets posting on this thread, on FR in general and all over the web about Kerry.

The swift boat vets are for real and they don't care and will not be deterred by what either political party has to say about their efforts. This is about things much more important than politics.

I believe Kerry's complete military records would reveal just how badly he pushed for his own medals and embelished things (lied) to get them. It would also reveal that he was still a naval officer when he colluded with the anti-war people and our enemies in Paris...a very BIG no-no, but thst just my opinion.

Either way, he's toast and should have been burnt badly long ago IMHO.

49 posted on 09/05/2004 8:24:25 AM PDT by Jeff Head (www.dragonsfuryseries.com)
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To: Inge C

If ugly doesn't begin to describe what Kerry's sealed military records are hiding, and if the Naval investigation leaks at all...which it will, of course...Kerry will resign from the ticket. Perhaps RAT honchos are already demanding answers from Kerry in private on this subject. If so, no wonder TerAysa was hauled off by ambulance to the nearest hospital the other day. She's in total meltdown at the thought of what she married, (the humiliation of it all!), and Kerry is busy blaming his staff! Nothing can save him.

If events play out as common sense dictates, then Kerry will lose his meal ticket, too. TerAYsa will walk.


50 posted on 09/05/2004 8:24:48 AM PDT by hershey
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