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Married, without children: Finding fulfillment with no kids
Rocky Mountain News ^ | 1/3/05 | Mark Wolf

Posted on 01/03/2005 8:31:56 AM PST by qam1

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To: Durus

Was that a dirty joke?


121 posted on 01/03/2005 9:15:13 AM PST by Tax-chick (To turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just.)
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To: Durus
There is such hostility on this thread to those who have chosen to not have children. I don't know where such hostility comes from but I can say this...It's nobodies business but their own.

My wife and I were the oldest of large families. We saw enough...The parents sick with worry over supporting us all, the diapers, the calls from teachers, and all the rest. All our many siblings have children, so there is no loss to the population or the family continuity. From life observations, and reading some of the more condemnatory posts, I susepct that what is behind some of the fury is the guilt some (Not a lot, but some) parents feel at, waking at 3 AM, all alone in the dark, in the deepest private secrets of their soul, wishing they had not had children, hating the soccer practice, the upcoming tuition pressures, and the whole trip.

They know they CANNOT feel this way. They MUST condemn people who do not have lives like theirs. They cling to condemning childless people, like clinging to a talisman, because NO ONE must suspect, even for a second, how they really feel.

122 posted on 01/03/2005 9:15:13 AM PST by Gorzaloon
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To: Tax-chick

Not to mention the vast majority of "overpopulation" whiners live in big cities. Unable to see past the ends of their collective noses, they believe the whole world looks exactly like the view outside their studio apartment windows--and we all end up hearing the moaning and kavetching!


123 posted on 01/03/2005 9:15:23 AM PST by Future Snake Eater ("Stupid grandma leaver-outers!"--Tom Servo)
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To: retrokitten
My extremely liberal sister in-law (a teacher) and brother are trying to have a baby. My cousin asked her if she was going to keep working after she has a baby and my sister in-laws response was, "Of course! I can't lose my tenure!" THAT is selfish!

I agree. It would have been much kinder not to have children at all than to have them and put them second to a career. Great point.

124 posted on 01/03/2005 9:15:44 AM PST by Minuteman23
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To: Rummyfan

Thanks!


125 posted on 01/03/2005 9:15:55 AM PST by Tax-chick (To turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just.)
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To: Rummyfan

Wow, that's a whole lotta kids in the house! Were ya'll homeschooled, too?


126 posted on 01/03/2005 9:16:58 AM PST by Future Snake Eater ("Stupid grandma leaver-outers!"--Tom Servo)
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To: A Ruckus of Dogs

LOL! Good points. I can't imagine this woman has been to too many showers, bridal or otherwise. They are only fun for the bride/mom-to-be (sometimes not even her) and possibly her mother and various other female relatives.

I didn't have a bridal shower by choice. I don't like them so why subject my family and friends to one? I can't imagine anything as stupid as a "You've Got No Kids!" shower.


127 posted on 01/03/2005 9:16:58 AM PST by retrokitten
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To: TommyDale
I have seen people decide to HAVE children for all the wrong reasons as well.

See my earlier post. Madonna is the poster child on all the reasons a person should NOT have a kid, yet does. For more, just look at your local slum.

128 posted on 01/03/2005 9:17:19 AM PST by freedumb2003 (My DU name is Bunny Planet and I don't care who knows it! Everyone reveal yours!)
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To: massgopguy
"So do they want to be able to invest some of their Social Security into an account that pays a rate of return or do they want my daughter to pay for them?"

Good point...they need to be limited to only the dollars they contributed and not a penny more, no correction for inflation either...because they represent population deflation. Pio in Mass.

129 posted on 01/03/2005 9:17:30 AM PST by Pio (Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus)
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To: k2blader
To all the people calling these folks "selfish": Do you think married people who don't want children should have them??

Not me. I think its great. There are far too many selfish couples who do have children. The fact that they know this about themselves is to their credit.

130 posted on 01/03/2005 9:17:58 AM PST by Raycpa (Alias, VRWC_minion,)
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To: Slyfox

"That's not for me to decide. For my own case, I have four children. I am praying that I have good daughter and son-in-laws. I am preparing for my emotional future. I want more than anything to be the type of person others will want to be around when I am old and feeble. Others can do what they wish. I, on the other hand, want to be surrounded by family on my deathbed."

First, I hope that you aren't saying that you had kids to insure your own future. That would be just as selfish as saying that you didn't have kids to insure your own future. Having children or not having children shouldn't be all about what they can or can't do for you when you're 80. Second, I also want to be surrounded by family if I am blessed enough to die in bed at an old age. But that doesn't mean that I'm going to run out and get married and pregnant just because I fear being alone in a few decades. Third, you're assuming that someone without children and in-laws will be alone if they die in bed at an old age. Maybe you don't have siblings, close nieces and nephews, close friends, etc. and only have the immediate family your created, but that's not always the case.


131 posted on 01/03/2005 9:18:25 AM PST by susiek
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To: Aquinasfan
Many parents don't want children. Yet I've never met anyone who wanted to give his child back.

Sadly, I don't agree with you. I know a few parents who don't say that they want to "give their child back", but they behave like their children are a nuisance, and I would guess that if they had it to do all over again they wouldn't have had children at all.

132 posted on 01/03/2005 9:18:25 AM PST by Minuteman23
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To: Durus; Slyfox
"Are you suggesting that the primary reason to have children is that you will have someone to take care of you when you grow old?

Speaking of selfish motivations."

_________________________________________

Until recently that is how most American families survived. You had lots of children and it was their responsibility to take care of the parents when they got old. This was before 401k's, IRA's and other retirement plans but for much of American history, children served as the parents social security. This was especially common with farming families.

The fact that we do not do this to the same degree today is a sad commentary on our society. Throughout Asia this is still the practice with three or more generations of family living together. I have been asked by many Asians about the American penchant for sending elderly parents to nursing homes for others to take care of them. They just don't understand how we could do that to our parents. I see far too many people here who look at their parents as a burden in old age and refuse to offer much assistance to them.
133 posted on 01/03/2005 9:18:56 AM PST by Mase
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To: L98Fiero
Me, me, me, me!! Look at ME! Pay attention to ME!! Celebrate me!!

Sickening. My wife and I don't have kids and the reasons for that are personal. These people however, are children themselves.

LOL!! And you and your wife, of course, are NOT children because your reasons are "personal."

Your post screams hypocrisy.

134 posted on 01/03/2005 9:19:10 AM PST by sinkspur ("How dare you presume to tell God what He cannot do" God Himself)
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To: Prime Choice
*rolling eyes* Now these people think they should be celebrated for doing NOTHING? No wonder they didn't have kids. They're too damned self-centered!

Well, not totally self-centered or they'd succumb to pressure and probably become resentful and rotten parents. And any kids would be the losers.

135 posted on 01/03/2005 9:19:17 AM PST by mewzilla
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To: susiek
And do you really think that the only reason someone doesn't have kids is selfishness?

Not at all! I think often it is very unselfish to not have kids. My argument is with those who look at this and immediately apply the "selfish" label.

136 posted on 01/03/2005 9:19:46 AM PST by k2blader (It is neither compassionate nor conservative to support the expansion of socialism.)
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To: DennisR
Being childless and having abortions are from the same root: selfishness. Period, end of story. If you could have, but do not have, kids, why waste the oxygen? I know this is harsh, but...I'm a complete asshole.
137 posted on 01/03/2005 9:20:10 AM PST by Hemingway's Ghost (Spirit of '75)
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To: Raycpa

Agreed!


138 posted on 01/03/2005 9:21:08 AM PST by k2blader (It is neither compassionate nor conservative to support the expansion of socialism.)
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To: massgopguy
So do they want to be able to invest some of their Social Security into an account that pays a rate of return or do they want my daughter to pay for them?

Perhaps they should receive a refund for school taxes to make that investment.

139 posted on 01/03/2005 9:21:41 AM PST by hobson
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To: Tax-chick

Not even close. I will not offer a sample so you can compare and contrast.

My point was the reporter found them...they didn't find the reporter.


140 posted on 01/03/2005 9:22:05 AM PST by Durus
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