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Barf Alert: ACLU's 'intelligent design' in Dover case
ACLU Email newsletter | 10.20.2005 | ACLU executive director

Posted on 10/20/2005 3:00:56 PM PDT by DoctorRansom

Dear Friend,

We can forget sometimes how much personal courage it takes to stand up for your convictions.

But, these last few weeks, as the ACLU's intelligent design case has unfolded in Dover, Pennsylvania, we've seen ordinary people do something extraordinary. Christy and Bryan Rehm and the other plaintiffs in this historic case have put themselves on the line to protect their children from religious zealotry and to defend your and my religious freedom.

We owe these courageous people more than our admiration. We owe them a debt of gratitude. You can let them know you appreciate the tremendous stand for liberty they have taken by sending them a message of support today. Our ACLU attorneys are providing their dedication, guidance and expertise on the legal issues, but your personal messages can add something more.

Believe me, every positive note will make a world of difference to these brave parents and teachers. We'll forward these letters to the Rehms and their fellow clients, and with your permission, share our favorite messages with our larger community of supporters online.

Defending freedom means being willing to stand up to those who would undermine it. None of the rights and liberties the ACLU has advanced for the past 85 years would have become reality without the courage of our clients, everyday people who have stood up for their beliefs, often in the face of tremendous public pressure or downright intimidation.

The parents and teachers involved in this 21st Century version of the Scopes Trial are making a difference not just in their communities, but are influencing a nationwide debate that is about more than just science education -- it is about the role of religion in our society and our government.

With the support and partnership of members nationwide, the ACLU will continue to resist the growing movement of political leaders and organized extremists with a faith-based vision for America that pushes aside religious liberty and tolerance to promote and enforce one particular brand of religion, using government power and taxpayer dollars.

Stand with the ACLU today and send a loud and clear message that you support the parents and teachers who are challenging the Dover School Board's efforts to inject religious doctrine into the science classroom. Tell them you support their courage. Click here.

Together, we'll preserve America's tradition of religious liberty with every ounce of energy we have.

Sincerely,

Anthony D. Romero Executive Director American Civil Liberties Union


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: aclu; crevolist; dover
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"Go back to the Abyss! Fall into the nothingness that awaits you and your master!"



Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

1 posted on 10/20/2005 3:00:57 PM PDT by DoctorRansom
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To: DoctorRansom

For once, the ACLU is on the side of right and justice. Well, even a broken clock is correct twice a day...


2 posted on 10/20/2005 3:02:56 PM PDT by orionblamblam ("You're the poster boy for what ID would turn out if it were taught in our schools." VadeRetro)
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To: DoctorRansom
it is about the role of religion in our society and our government.

Translation.....it is about the role of Christianity in our society and using the government to wipe it out.

3 posted on 10/20/2005 3:05:55 PM PDT by Taggart_D
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To: orionblamblam
Hello to a voice from the recent past. I believe discussion died on a previous thread in which the original subject (The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe) underwent much change over very little time. However, let me restate something here, just in case:



Argument: some mutations are beneficial
from Refuting Evolution 2 by Dr. Jonathan Sarfati
(a [still-unanswered] rebuttal to Scientific American's July 2002 article "15 Answers to Creationist Nonsense")


Might want to read that one, for continuing study if nothing else. Many of these arguments supporting mutation-driven evolution were already dealt with decades ago, even before other scientists -- in the ID and Biblical creation movements -- came up with information theory.

To reiterate:
1. No serious scientist, evolutionary or creationist, in this century, has invoked supernatural explanations for present-day natural laws. To use the "well if you're going to allow any kind of miracles, you can't do science," canard is misleading (and again, completely blind to evolutionary "miracles" that are impossible).
2. Particles-to-people evolution requires immense amounts of new, amazingly complex information to arise out of nothing. This process has never been observed and is statistically improbable. The "proofs" cited are only examples of already-existing information being modified or combined.

Good discussion, though. It's great stuff to study, from any side. But for more, I do recommend an open-minded read-through of the article.




Another reiteration: ID is very different from Biblical creation.


Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

4 posted on 10/20/2005 3:13:16 PM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: Taggart_D
And unconstitutionally "mak[ing] law regarding an establishment" of the religion of de facto Secular Humanism, indeed.

Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

6 posted on 10/20/2005 3:14:45 PM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: bobbdobbs
People get stuck on thinking there is only their religion or nothing. In fact there are dozens of religions and if the state supports one, it does so on the backs of all others.
Such is not banned by the First Amendment, however. It merely a more-recent misinterpretation sourced by a neo-religion of pluralism and "spiritual schizophrenia" that tries to tell only adherents to certain faiths exactly where their place should be: in private, only.

Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

8 posted on 10/20/2005 3:17:31 PM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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To: bobbdobbs
Compare to cells, the human eye, DNA, etc. ... Where is the snowflake's "order" other than a mere arrangement that happens to appear pleasing to us, from an artistic perspective?

Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

9 posted on 10/20/2005 3:20:56 PM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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To: bobbdobbs

God does not belong to one religion.


10 posted on 10/20/2005 4:15:45 PM PDT by mlc9852
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: orionblamblam
Well, even a broken clock is correct twice a day...

You read my mind.

I hate the ACLU. And I think they deliberately target Christians for bogus issues, such as the small cross they forced the city of Edmond Oklahoma to remove from their city seal. My mother was the one who suggested they put that cross in the seal at a committee meeting that designed it decades ago. Her reasoning was that the churches were a big part of city culture when it was founded, and she was correct.

But on the evolution issue, the ACLU on the side of reality and against ignorance. Yeah. Stopped clock.

13 posted on 10/20/2005 5:46:29 PM PDT by narby (Hillary! The Wicked Witch of the Left)
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To: DoctorRansom

YEC INTREP


14 posted on 10/20/2005 6:20:31 PM PDT by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America)
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To: DoctorRansom

> Particles-to-people evolution requires immense amounts of new, amazingly complex information to arise out of nothing. This process has never been observed

Since this statement is blatantly false, should you be assumed to be astonishingly block-headed or a liar? The addition of new genetic information is observed with some regualrity.


15 posted on 10/20/2005 8:20:19 PM PDT by orionblamblam ("You're the poster boy for what ID would turn out if it were taught in our schools." VadeRetro)
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To: DoctorRansom

I get it and I knew it all along. What the ACLU is really about is not scientific truth but about the larger argument about the role of religious belief in society. They are very good with their progaganda espically in the society they have carefully crafted to futher met the goal. The communist roots like a bad hair dye job is showing. Problem it is to late. They have won. I really believe this. Their goal to destroy belief in religion espically christianty is a true communist goal. They have won over time and our culture shows it.


16 posted on 10/20/2005 8:39:32 PM PDT by therut
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To: orionblamblam
New, complex genetic information from absolutely nowhere? What are some examples?

Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

17 posted on 10/21/2005 6:52:29 AM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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To: Jay777
Ping.

Dr. Ransom
FaithFusion.net
Speaking only for those with ears to hear

18 posted on 10/21/2005 6:53:19 AM PDT by DoctorRansom ("Alert and in first-class fighting trim")
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To: DoctorRansom

> New, complex genetic information from absolutely nowhere? What are some examples?

Replication errors. Retroviruses.

You knew this. Your insistence upon professing ignorance is disgusting.


19 posted on 10/21/2005 7:17:15 AM PDT by orionblamblam ("You're the poster boy for what ID would turn out if it were taught in our schools." VadeRetro)
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To: RepCath; Liz; IronJack; Grampa Dave; MeekOneGOP; Iris7; wkdaysoff; EdReform; Nick Danger; ...

20 posted on 10/21/2005 7:32:51 AM PDT by Jay777 (My personal blog: www.stoptheaclu.com)
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