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"The long distance and the great number of different peoples and cultures in Central Asia made any connections between the two ancient Roman and Chinese empires almost impossible."

Pure BS!

The 4,000 year old red-headed Caucasian mummies found in China were found very near Dunhuang, the location of the 'Jade Gate' in the Great Wall Of China.

Elizabeth Barber, in her book, Mummies Of Urumchi, clearly established a connection between the mummies and the Celts at Halstadt, Austria...5,000 miles away from the site of the mummies.

1 posted on 12/20/2005 9:59:12 AM PST by blam
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To: blam

If you build a wall, and I build a wall, utilizing the construction materials of the same time, for the same purposes, then it isn't out of the realm of possibility that your wall and my wall would be similar is size, shape and basic design.........


2 posted on 12/20/2005 10:03:09 AM PST by Red Badger (And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him)
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To: blam

I think it's implausible that the Roman frontier defenses were in any way, shape, or form dependent on the Chinese frontier defenses. The concept of a wall is quite universal, and the idea that a big wall on the borders will keep out invadors is nothing if not obvious.

Keep in mind that Chinese archaeology is notorious for misrepresenting history for Chinese propaganda purposes.


3 posted on 12/20/2005 10:07:39 AM PST by AntiGuv (™)
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To: blam

Very cool. Thanks for posting!


4 posted on 12/20/2005 10:07:49 AM PST by COBOL2Java (The Katrina Media never gets anything right, so why should I believe them?)
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To: blam

I think it's implausible that the Roman frontier defenses were in any way, shape, or form dependent on the Chinese frontier defenses. The concept of a wall is quite universal, and the idea that a big wall on the borders will keep out invadors is nothing if not obvious.

Keep in mind that Chinese archaeology is notorious for misrepresenting history for Chinese propaganda purposes.


5 posted on 12/20/2005 10:07:49 AM PST by AntiGuv (™)
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To: blam

News of the future: US learns from great wall, closes Mexican border.


6 posted on 12/20/2005 10:10:24 AM PST by Rain-maker
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To: SunkenCiv
GGG Ping.

The Mummies Of Urumchi


8 posted on 12/20/2005 10:11:59 AM PST by blam
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To: blam

This hypothesis I think is clearly a post hoc ergo prompter hoc fallacy, and by applying the same logic I see no reason whatsoever that the Great Wall of China wasn't inspired by the Long Walls of Athens.


9 posted on 12/20/2005 10:21:00 AM PST by AntiGuv (™)
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To: blam

This is nothing more than a continuation of the old communist "we invented it first" BS.


10 posted on 12/20/2005 10:23:06 AM PST by Natural Law
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To: blam
The Roman border walls and the Great Wall have absolutely no relationship with one another.

This is the Chinese government making ridiculous assertions.

Sovereigns have been building territorial walls to keep out bandits since Sumer.

11 posted on 12/20/2005 10:24:48 AM PST by wideawake
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To: blam

The construction of the border fence marked the end of expansion of the Roman Empire, which, since expansion of the Empire was the driving force of the Empire, marked also the end of the rise of the Empire and the beginning of its descent.


14 posted on 12/20/2005 10:42:43 AM PST by RightWhale (pas de lieu, Rhone que nous)
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To: blam
"The long distance and the great number of different peoples and cultures in Central Asia made any connections between the two ancient Roman and Chinese empires almost impossible."

Nevermind the fact that they exchanged ambassadors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_embassies_to_China
16 posted on 12/20/2005 10:49:28 AM PST by English Nationalist
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To: blam; FairOpinion; Ernest_at_the_Beach; StayAt HomeMother; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; asp1; ...
Thanks Blam. There was contact, but I find the rest of the article a little farfetched. :') OTOH, I'll post a link in a minute that will send everyone running. ;')

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

17 posted on 12/20/2005 11:13:24 AM PST by SunkenCiv ("In silence, and at night, the Conscience feels that life should soar to nobler ends than Power.")
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Romans in China?
Archaeology | Volume 52 Number 3, May/June 1999 | Erling Hoh
Posted on 07/18/2004 8:43:09 PM PDT by SunkenCiv
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1173944/posts


18 posted on 12/20/2005 11:15:39 AM PST by SunkenCiv ("In silence, and at night, the Conscience feels that life should soar to nobler ends than Power.")
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To: blam

They called the Romans Daqin...I wonder if that's any connection to the name Tarquin?


21 posted on 12/20/2005 11:29:08 AM PST by Graymatter
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To: blam

File this under "highly unlikely."


24 posted on 12/20/2005 12:01:18 PM PST by Antoninus (Hillary smiles every time a Freeper trashes Rick Santorum)
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To: blam

If this is true, why don't they ever find any MSG at Roman sites? Why aren't there any fossilized fortune cookies at Hadrian's Wall?


28 posted on 12/20/2005 4:20:47 PM PST by Verginius Rufus
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To: 75thOVI; beebuster2000; bert; BJClinton; BlessedByLiberty; brazzaville; canalabamian; chesley; ...
MilHist ping

To all: please ping me to threads that are relevant to the MilHist list (and/or) please add the keyword "MilHist" to the appropriate thread. Thanks in advance.

Please FREEPMAIL indcons if you want on or off the "Military History (MilHist)" ping list.

33 posted on 12/22/2005 3:26:03 AM PST by indcons
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To: blam; SunkenCiv
Romans May Have Learned From Chinese Great Wall: Archaeologists

I want to bring to mind that Jerusalem was a cosmopolitan type city like New York or London.

In Jerusalem citizens were referred to as Jews, but they might not be from the tribe of Judah, it like in America we are called Americans, but come from various nations!

In Jerusalem there were folks from the Asia such Chinese, or from Africa, Egyptian, Roamans, Greeks, etc!

This subterranean world would most likely been learn from the Chinese!

Archaeologists Find Ancient Israel Tunnels (used during revolt against Romans 66 to 70 A.D.) Posted by NormsRevenge

Archaeologists in Israel find ancient tunnels from Jewish revolt against Romans

Archaeologists have uncovered underground chambers and tunnels constructed in northern Israel by Jews, for hiding from the Romans during their revolt in A.D. 66-70.

Archaeologists said Monday they have uncovered underground chambers and tunnels constructed in northern Israel by Jews for hiding from the Romans during their revolt in A.D. 66-70.

The Jews laid in supplies and were preparing to hide from the Romans, the experts said. The pits, which are connected to each other by short tunnels, would have served as a concealed subterranean home.

Yardenna Alexandre of the Israel Antiquities Authority said the find shows the ancient Jews planned and prepared for the uprising. This is in contrast to the common perception that the revolt began spontaneously.

"It definitely was not spontaneous," said Alexandre. "The Jews of that time certainly did prepare for it, with underground hideaways here and in other sites we have found."

However, the recent discovery of these underground chambers at the Israeli Arab village of Kfar Kana, north of Nazareth, is unique. All other "hiding refuges" found so far are hewn out of rock. But at Kfar Kana, the settlers built the chambers out of housing materials, and they hid them directly under their floors. They made sure their families had access to the chambers from inside their homes.

"This construction was very well camouflaged inside one of the houses," Alexandre said. "There are three pits under this house and one tunnel leading to another pit. There are 11 storage jars in that pit. This was storage for an emergency situation during the second half of the first century CE, which is well-known for the Great Revolt."

Alexandre describes the chambers as "very attractive." Built like igloos, they are wide at the base and small at the top. The tunnels between them are very short, and the ceilings are too low for standing up.

Zeev Weiss, a professor of archaeology at Hebrew University in Jerusalem, said, "I think this is a very important find at Kfar Kana. It can give us more information about life in the Galilee in the first century and the preparations Jews were making on the eve of the revolt." Weiss is director of excavations at Sepphoris, which was the largest city in the Galilee at the time of the revolt.

The Jewish revolt against Roman rule ended in A.D. 70, when the Romans sacked Jerusalem and destroyed the Second Temple.

The Jews at the Kfar site built their houses over the ruins of a fortified Iron Age city, reusing some of the stones from the original settlement. Then they dug through 1.5 meters (five feet) of debris from the ancient ruins to build their hideaway complex. "It was quite a lot of work," Alexandre said.

The original settlement, which dates from the 10th and 9th centuries B.C., is also a new discovery.

Alexandre attributes current dating of the original city as an Iron Age settlement to pottery remains, which are plentiful at the site. The excavators have also found large quantities of animal bones, a scarab depicting a man surrounded by two crocodiles and a ceramic seal bearing the image of a lion.

The excavation of the city's architecture has uncovered fortified walls which still stand 1.5 meters high in some places. "It's magnificent," said Alexandre. "You can walk among them."

35 posted on 03/19/2006 3:29:48 PM PST by restornu (Our blessing flow more when we as a nation murmur less!)
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To: blam

"University of Pecs in Hungary"

I think Gov. Schwartzenegger got his degree there.

Seems like a wall is pretty easy to figure out though. :')


36 posted on 03/19/2006 3:34:10 PM PST by SunkenCiv (Yes indeed, Civ updated his profile and links pages again, on Monday, March 6, 2006.)
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To: blam
"It is quite obvious to suppose that Rome gained information about China and about their special, complicated structure of frontier defence. Could the idea of the strong limes not come from the well-tried system of China?" Visy added.

Speculation out of thin air. The Roman era is not prehistorical. If the Romans were influenced by the Chinesse they would have wrote about it, and some writings would have been likely to survive.

37 posted on 03/19/2006 3:39:11 PM PST by Plutarch
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