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To: thomaswest
In most cases, science strictly speaking confines itself to experimentation and observation (both directly and indirectly) on a small scale with the aid of reason as it is applied in particular ways. When matters of ultimate history and causation are induced or deduced, and expressions made regarding the same (i.e. when the bigger picture is presented as with evolution in the wide sense) we are entering the realm of philosophy and exiting the realm of science.

In view of the text of our Constitution it is an abomination to expect the theory of evolution to enjoy an exclusive hearing by law in public schools, regardless of any further implications.

67 posted on 10/14/2006 3:04:54 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: Fester Chugabrew
When matters of ultimate history and causation are induced or deduced, and expressions made regarding the same (i.e. when the bigger picture is presented as with evolution in the wide sense) we are entering the realm of philosophy and exiting the realm of science.

Oh, I see you ARE still espousing drunken sophomoric philosophy.

*whew* You have me worried.

71 posted on 10/14/2006 3:06:20 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: Fester Chugabrew
experimentation and observation (both directly and indirectly) on a small scale

Well, measurements that show the earth is about 4.5 billion years old and the Universe about 14 billion years old do not seem to me "small-scale".

One of the many beauties of evolution is that it incoporates a vast age that is fully supported by physics and astronomy and geology in many converging lines of evidence.

But can you prove via your criteria (direct experimentation/observation) that Caesar or Jesus actually existed?

86 posted on 10/14/2006 3:32:15 PM PDT by thomaswest (The truth will make you free. But it may tick you off.)
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To: Fester Chugabrew; nmh
Re 67. What would constitute proof for you of a supernatural intervention from a scientific perspective?

I think you have agreed that "God did it" is inadequate, because this is an argument from ignorance, which you reject on philosophical grounds.

In my earlier post, I suggested that repeatable, verifiable evidence of a supernatural/unnatural force would make this force natural, by definition, and thus dethrone gods.

There is another notion, namely, that gods or God can intervene willy-nilly changing everything according to their whim and omnipotence. It seems to me that this notion would destroy every concept in objective reality, methological determinism, and usual common sense.

But this view of an invisible, supernatural deity intervening randomly from time to time according to pleasures, and who is impervious to cause and effect, seems impossible of scientific examination.

110 posted on 10/14/2006 5:10:28 PM PDT by thomaswest (The Zeus, Apollo, Jupiter, Mithras god beliefs were abandoned. Yet each was thought omnipotent.)
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