Posted on 09/03/2007 3:19:20 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
Today was an eventful day. I drove to Cleveland, reunited with my father’s side of the family and got arrested. More on that arrested part to come.
For the labor day weekend my father decided to host a small family reunion. My sister flew in from California and I drove in from Pittsburgh to visit my father, his wife and my little brother and sister. Shortly after arriving we packed the whole family into my father’s Buick and headed off to the grocery store to buy some ingredients to make monkeybread. (It’s my little sister’s birthday today and that was her cute/bizare birthday request.)
Next to the grocery store was a Circuit City. (The Brooklyn, Ohio Circuit City to be exact.) Having forgotten that it was my sister’s birthday I decided to run in and buy her a last minute gift. I settled on Disney’s “Cars” game for the Nintendo Wii. I also needed to purchase a Power Squid surge protector which I paid for separately with my business credit card. As I headed towards the exit doors I passed a gentleman whose name I would later learn is Santura. As I began to walk towards the doors Santura said, “Sir, I need to examine your receipt.” I responded by continuing to walk past him while saying, “No thank you.”
As I walked through the double doors I heard Santura yelling for his manager behind me. My father and the family had the Buick pulled up waiting for me outside the doors to Circuit City. I opened the door and got into the back seat while Santura and his manager, whose name I have since learned is Joe Atha, came running up to the vehicle.
(Excerpt) Read more at newsite.michaelrighi.com ...
Store policies MUST be in line with their state laws. Ohio law does not allow any merchant to detain customers without reasonable suspicion that someone stole; a reasonable suspicion would likely include observing someone taking something for which they did not pay, such as observing them putting it in a purse, under their jacket, or something similar.
Its only illegal if they force the search or detain you based on your refusal to allow a search. No matter what “they” say, the stats are that most theft is from employees.
If you don’t follow the policy of the store regarding product check, I believe that to be reasonable cause. If you just want to exercise your libertarianism, you should shop at non-totalitarian stores where they don’t give a damn if you steal and raise prices.
Your belief is incorrect. Refusing a voluntary search is not probable cause for the cops or a merchant
Most likely it is not a citizens arrest but the invoking of shopkeepers privilege. Only a fool uses citizens arrest. Also they are most likely a trained Loss Prevention specialist, who would know better that to use refusal to search as the pretext for detention.
The guy called the cop because HE was being illegally detained. The cop demanded information that he was not legally allowed to ask. Ohio law states that the cop could only ask for name, address, and date of birth. The guy did not refuse to supply that information. The cop was wrong.
because it’s the policy of the store in order to limit shop lifting. What makes you so special that you should get preferential treatment? Showing a receipt isn’t like they are strip searching you. Do you shop lift? If not, whats the big deal?
I agree with you, (read my previous posts), I was repeating back someone else’s quotes starting with 98, they asked what I was disagreeing with.
Default position? I missed that day in law school. They take the position that it is better for them and you from a business standpoint. It is impossible from a business standpoint to tracv the movements of all customers through the store. That is why they are using the front door as a screening point. Plus the front door follows legal guidelines that it’s not shoplifting until they leave the store.
Any policy of any store must be in compliance with state law.
Any policy therefore that is not is ILLEGAL.
Don’t know either, its a basic freedoms issue.
The CC bubbas are going to be fired and the chain will ask the vic not to sue under the circumstances. If they cover his legal costs, he should agree.
I already posted to you Ohio law. It appears that they violated at least two of them.
I don’t doubt the judge will throw out the charges and may even rule in favor of any counter-filing made by this guy.
The store thinks it’s “special” when it believes its policies supercedes Ohio law.
What good is a loss prevention policy that lets someone walk away with out having the bagged checked. It defeats the purpose of the policy and will certainly increase loss. In short it violates the right of the store to protect its property rom theft.
It is public enough that no store person is going to search me.
>>>>Cite the Ohio law that states any citizen must produce identification
It’s called a “Terry stop.” See Terry v. Ohio, Mitchel v. Ohio, Williams v. Illinois, et.al
2921.29 (C) Nothing in this section requires a person to answer any questions beyond that person’s name, address, or date of birth. Nothing in this section authorizes a law enforcement officer to arrest a person for not providing any information beyond that person’s name, address, or date of birth or for refusing to describe the offense observed.
This is exactly my position. If people like this guy and others on this thread keep making a big deal out of receipt checks, laws might actually be passed that make it within the right of any shopkeeper to arrest and strip search patrons upon probable cause. Is that what you want?
I know, I only included you because it was your post that I was directing the other guy to. It is just a little thing that is generally done.
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