People like her are extremely dangerous to the safety and well-being of others because they believe that Stalinism is the correct mentality for Americans.
As if democrats have a clue on how to run a safe and efficient Nation.
Fools all.
Posted on 04/26/2008 10:47:03 PM PDT by ricks_place
Court refuses to hear FLDS mothers' request All FLDS children in Texas now off to foster care
SAN ANGELO, Texas — The last of the children taken in the raid on the Fundamentalist LDS Church's Yearning for Zion Ranch are now adjusting to life in the foster care system. Escorted by police cars and ambulances, more than a dozen charter buses rolled out of the San Angelo Coliseum grounds Friday, carrying the remaining 260 children toward foster homes.
Small children waved as they went by. Some appeared to be very young; one child was seen holding a bottle.
"It's a good day for them because they're out of this shelter environment and getting to more stable places," said Chris Van Deusen with the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services. "They're still temporary homes, but it's more conducive to child care."
The departure from the coliseum, which has served as a massive shelter for 462 children and dozens of their mothers in recent weeks, was still emotional. On Thursday, many FLDS mothers were separated from their children.
The children will be heading to foster care facilities and homes scattered across Texas. Mothers are being allowed to stay with tbabies under 12 months of age; the others have been separated.
Meanwhile, attorneys for the FLDS Church threatened lawsuits against the numerous government agencies involved.
...
Meanwhile, parents who have been cast out of the FLDS Church have been coming forward to help establish paternity. Some had no idea their children were in Texas.
"We are hearing from parents who tell us they were forced out of the FLDS, and they believe that their children may now be in DFPS custody," said Rolfe. "We are making arrangements for those parents to submit samples to labs that are close to where they live."
(Excerpt) Read more at webserver.desnews.com ...
Evidently you don't once the raid was ordered, you would have required your people to not take rifles and the armored car?
“Too bad they had to use a warrant based on hoax hearsay then. “
Are you saying the warrant was based solely on the hoax phone call?
Agreed.
Your agenda is lacking facts.
You defend what you haven’t investigated first hand.
Reminds me of the holocaust denyers
IANAL, but I think it's preposterous to believe that the Fourth Amendment was written so poorly that it didn't mean that the required "Oath or affirmation" was that an actual crime was committed or imminent. The idea that mere hearsay (that wouldn't be admissible in court) would be enough to meet a Constitutional requirement is absolutely ridiculous.
Further, that a Texas Ranger would pusue a warrant without even so much as minimal due diligence is a sickening thought as to how far we've fallen.
I don't believe that the authorities' motive alone determines whether a path to greater evil is open. I believe that the way to hell is paved with good intentions.
“Like teachers at public schools aren’t being caught every day molesting kids...”
Yes, but Identification of the suspect, and victim, is so much easier.
“I think one phrase, KEEP SWEET, sums it up.”
How?
it stinks to take all those kids from their moms....period.
to take a 2-6 year old from mom, dad, guardian and keep them away like that...nuts
if they are worried about 14 year old girls and arranged marriages then take them but why take toddlers from Mommy?
all this is about underaged girls and sex in a wierd as hell cult that is little different than early Mormonism (no offense to Mormons)
what’s next?
daddy has too many guns?
daddy is a felon?
daddy is a racist...like Jeffs supposedly.
the more I read into the Jeffs/the cult/the sect/early Mormonism/the girl/her family/the prosecutor/the cops
I am convinced it’s a damned mess and no winners and folks to blame on both sides at eevry angle
and yes...I have yet to see any difference between this happening in 2008, the founders of Mormonism behavior or the 1953 raid
and it will probably pan out just the same but the men will get more time and in time the kids will filter back to their moms and the men not locked up
My agenda is (sic) to promote justice while protecting the rights of the innocent.
You defend what you haven’t investigated first hand.
Yes, it's called The American Way..."Presumed Innocent Until Proven Guilty in a Court of Law"
Reminds me of the holocaust denyers
Reminds me of ad hominem attempt, and an attempt to dodge my question. You made a claim that the things occurring in foster homes listed in that report (drugging, poisoning, and deaths) were occurring at the FLDS ranch. I am asking you to back up your statement.
Remember, any third party reading this can just scroll upthread to see your claim and my question. :-)
“Too bad they had to use a warrant based on hoax hearsay then. :-(”
Had the report been anonymous, the CPS would very likely have had reason to pursue their investigation.
How about a neighbor that reports abuse of children, but remains anonymous?
Should that prevent an investigation? This report is being called a “hoax” yet the situation in the sect’s compound was as she reported it. IE. pregnant underage females, which by legal definition constitutes statutory rape.
The other parties to the statutory rape is the male, and possibly adult females who facilitate same. Criminal offenses under the guise of an institution established specifically to undertake these violations.
Would you have our legal authorities ignore reports of the legal violations?
I support legal prosecutions against all responsible adults, and protection of the minors, from being placed back into the same environment—which is effectively what many advocate.
2. Although an affidavit supporting a search warrant may be based on hearsay information and need not reflect the direct personal observations of the affiant, the magistrate must be informed of some of the underlying circumstances relied on by the person providing the information and some of the underlying circumstances from which the affiant concluded that the informant, whose identity was not disclosed, was creditable or his information reliable. Giordenello v. United States, 357 U. S. 480, followed. P P. 110-115.
The Sheriff had an informant. What general facts were reported by the alleged girl were consistent with information the informant gave.
You made the claim what is not going on in the cult.
I say that and worse and it will be proven.
“Like teachers at public schools aren’t being caught every day molesting kids...”
And they are prosecuted when identified.
Yes...please read the warrant and you'll see.
The "Oath or affirmation" required by the Fourth Amendment in the original (April 3, 2008) warrant was an oath by a Law Enforcement Officer that she had been told by someone that a person had called with an accusation.
While there was "filling" of calculations that "this 50 year old must have committed a crime because it's illegal to impregate a girl of the age of the caller," etc.
The warrant basically hangs on something like me calling a third party, who tells the police that I said you were doing something illegal, and they just go raid you.
Or...put another way... Is there Probable Cause for me to believe that Obama is a God just because someone told me that he told them that he was?
I think you are mixing the CPS and the LE.
The CPS can come in, remove a child, for the safety of the child, based on such a thing as an anonymous phone call.
The LE is required to provide them escort,if they ask, maybe even if they don’t.
At the FLDS, there was also a SEARCH WARRANT put in effect, to get family records from the temple, which the men of the FLDS had continually refused to provide, or allow the CPS to see.
This has been going on a long time.
Now, an ARREST WARRANT for a suspect, that will come after the CPS can prove the crime was committed.
Hasn’t happened yet, that we know of. DNA testing can be so slow.
Of course, there is a court-sealed warrant, that none of us know the contents of.
I think I have the affidavits of the first two search warrants involving the FLDS compound, if you want to see them.
Polygamy.
The girl case.
Her lawsuit.
The hoax call.
Jeff's public racism.
Carolyn Jessop’s crusade.
Allegations of everything from excessive child discipline to expelling boys(which I believe) to welfare fraud (which I believe) to women raised as chattel to be raped at will by men averaginbg over 50 years old to claims girls as young as 8 were married in church ceremonies.
The more I read into all of it from every aspect, the truths get muddier except that yes they did practice polygamy and yes they did arrange girls 14 and up to marry...but at what frequency I don't know nor can I tell if the men were usually middle aged or young..
btw...Jeff's daddy was boss during the crime Jeffs got nailed on.
it just goes on and on......
I do believe some discretion as to how to keep the kids with some parental units woulda been nice but child services agencies these days just don't think like that especially on such a politically charged issue
I did not.
I am calling you a Liar and that's not a personal attack at all. It's based on the fact that I never made such a claim, but you libel me.
But of course, as I said, third parties can scroll up to #36 and confirm you are a liar....since what I said was: "I hadn't heard that the kids were being drugged, poisoned, and dying. Wow. Where did you hear that?"
People like her are extremely dangerous to the safety and well-being of others because they believe that Stalinism is the correct mentality for Americans.
As if democrats have a clue on how to run a safe and efficient Nation.
Fools all.
The CPS can ignore the Constitution?
At the FLDS, there was also a SEARCH WARRANT put in effect, to get family records from the temple, which the men of the FLDS had continually refused to provide, or allow the CPS to see.
Nice and convenient that you can just waltz in on a hoax, and then get a warrant based on what you find. As I said, something inadmissible in court shouldn't be considered as acceptable for meeting Constitutional requirements! That's Stalinist in nature!
Of course, there is a court-sealed warrant, that none of us know the contents of.
Dated when?
Now, an ARREST WARRANT for a suspect, that will come after the CPS can prove the crime was committed.
The arrest and search warrant was April 3, 2008. Have you not read it?
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