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Conservatives, Time to Adopt Saul Alinsky Tactics ^ | April 2008 | John Perazzo

Posted on 11/05/2008 1:59:20 PM PST by samsmom

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To: samsmom

I DO agree with you on this- Newt has too much baggage- besides he’s a major sellout on Global Warming...

I think Jindal is terrific- will wait to hear more from him.

151 posted on 11/06/2008 9:15:18 AM PST by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: SE Mom

Yeah, what the hey was Newt thinking when he did that stupid commercial with Pelosi. I don’t know. Sometimes I feel that those folks in Washington that we get so amped up about, don’t give a hoot about us out here. Jindal is articulate and plain spoken. I just wonder if he can be inspirational. That’s what it’s going to take. I liked Palin before McCain chose her. I’m just sorry that she wasn’t brought up to speed before they rolled her out.

152 posted on 11/06/2008 9:31:19 AM PST by samsmom
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To: sheik yerbouty

yes, we use ju-jitsu.

Remember folks, conservatives are the PRODUCERS of this country. We stop, IT stops. Now, I’m not saying quit your job,

but there are ways to structure your assets and income such that you appear to own nothing and earn nothing. No taxes, and qualify for gov’t programs -


153 posted on 11/06/2008 9:35:47 AM PST by MrB (The 0bamanation: Marxism, Infanticide, Appeasement, Depression, and Thuggery)
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To: gundog
Why does anybody think this guy's brilliant?

Two of his disciples fought it out to be the Dem candidate for the presidentcy and one will be in the WH.

154 posted on 11/06/2008 9:38:34 AM PST by lonestar
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To: samsmom


Palin was treated SO dreadfully by the press AND the McCain campaign it’s going to take some time for her to recover. She’s got great instincts and she seems a fast learner- I’ll watch her with interest.

155 posted on 11/06/2008 9:38:35 AM PST by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: samsmom

Why Texas is going to the dogs...a list of Industrial Areas Foundation organizations in the Lone Star State:
Allied Communities of Tarrant (ACT), Fort Worth; Austin Interfaith, Austin; Border Organization, Eagle Pass; Communities Organized for Public Service (COPS), San Antonio; Corpus Christi Area Church of the Reconciliation, Corpus Christi; Dallas Area Interfaith (DAI), Dallas; El Paso Interreligious Sponsoring Organization (EPISO)(big in the anti-border fence movement, huge parasite factor), El Paso; Interfaith Education Fund (IEF) (Austin has TWO), Austin; The Metro Alliance (San Antonio has TWO), San Antonio; The Metropolitan Organization (TMO), Houston; Triangle Interfaith Project, Nederland; West Texas Organizing Strategy, Lubbock.

156 posted on 11/06/2008 10:17:48 AM PST by 3AngelaD (They screwed up their own countries so bad they had to leave, and now they're here screwing up ours.)
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To: samsmom; HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
Actually, what we need is a reverse Gramsci plan.

Until we can teach the children, we will always loose the next generation.

157 posted on 11/06/2008 10:46:08 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: MeanWestTexan

So, it’s official then. We’re the “wolverines”. LOL. I was on that thread, too, I think. Should we use it as a keyword for these threads? I’ll add it to this one.

158 posted on 11/06/2008 10:52:34 AM PST by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: redgolum
"During the 1960s Alinsky was an enormously influential force in American life. As Richard Poe reports: "When President Johnson launched his War on Poverty in 1964, Alinsky allies infiltrated the program, steering federal money into Alinsky projects. In 1966, Senator Robert Kennedy allied himself with union leader Cesar Chavez, an Alinsky disciple. Chavez had worked ten years for Alinsky, beginning in 1952. Kennedy soon drifted into Alinsky's circle. After race riots shook Rochester, New York, Alinsky descended on the city and began pressuring Eastman-Kodak to hire more blacks. Kennedy supported Alinsky's shakedown."

It's the Chavez-Alinsky-Obama wing of the Democratic Party in the White House now.

159 posted on 11/06/2008 12:01:59 PM PST by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
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To: samsmom
The one good thing we can borrow from these radicals is building a strong LOCAL grassroots effort.

Glad you weren't suggesting that, because I gotta tell it sure seemed you were implying we use that Marxist model.

If we want to rebuild a grassroots effort I suggest we look to Reagan's ground game.

Rebuilding the grassroots is an excellent suggestion.
160 posted on 11/06/2008 12:23:04 PM PST by Khepri (NEO-STALIN FASCIST DEFEATS NEO-LIBERAL MAOIST!! How's that working for yah?)
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To: samsmom; MeanWestTexan; wintertime; All


This puts our message into the right words.

Please read:


161 posted on 11/06/2008 1:40:50 PM PST by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: Red Boots
I agree we should study them since one must know thouroughly his enemy. That said, I don't think anything built on power gained through them could stand for long, since the foundation is so anti-humanity. And I guess if you look at the "successful" communist movements in history, they don't tend to last too long, which might support my thought.

I wonder, though, if there are any books about which are the most effective tactics to use against them.

That's probably a better book to read now.

162 posted on 11/06/2008 2:43:01 PM PST by Red Boots
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To: Hat-Trick
I think I will volunteer as a double agent with ACORN next time around.

That is seriously a good idea -
163 posted on 11/06/2008 4:04:44 PM PST by Infidel Puppy
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To: hedgetrimmer
Why not use the Constitution?

Because it has failed us. The Constitution was written for people who are moral, just, and interested in their society. Over half of the population no longer fits that bill and is willing to elect politicians who will enslave them just so they can feel good for the moment.

164 posted on 11/06/2008 4:31:42 PM PST by Clock King (Radical Conservatives, arise!)
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To: concerned about politics

The answer to ridicule is to ridicule back. Check out the movie 300. On the followup (behind the scenes) track, a scholar mentions that the young warriors were taught how “dis” one another in the school. This could go on for hours, and was designed to sharpen their wit. It works today in the hip-hop industry and the youth culture.

165 posted on 11/06/2008 4:39:20 PM PST by Clock King (Radical Conservatives, arise!)
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To: gimme1ibertee
I wish I had seen that. Should have asked Alan; why he is asking the question. . .Is he tying to say that Joe is biting the hand that fed him or what?.

Whoopi Goldberg was on 'welfare' at one time; Alan ever attempt a 'smear' of Whoopi for that? What does he really think of people who avail themselves to 'compassionate Liberalism'?

The only question really hee is 'what hate' it is; that motivates, undescores everything a Liberal says, does and believes. And what hypocrisy. . .

166 posted on 11/06/2008 5:27:42 PM PST by cricket (America's Freedom Rings! T hank You ~ U..S.A. Military~)
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To: Clock King; hedgetrimmer
"Why not use the Constitution?"

Because it has failed us. The Constitution was written for people who are moral, just, and interested in their society. Over half of the population no longer fits that bill and is willing to elect politicians who will enslave them just so they can feel good for the moment.

The Constitution has not failed us. But it was written for people who were moral, etc.. However, it reflects a very pragmatic understanding of what actually works well in the human comedy. The problem is that too few, over the past century or so, have bothered to read it as an entity, rather than as a bunch of clauses, to be taken out of context for ulterior motives. For an example, consider how well the Constitution, correctly understood and applied, could have headed off the present financial meltdown, which probably more even than the tactics being discussed here, made the Obama election possible: Congress & The Regulation of Commerce.

The problem with wanting to immitate the tactics of the Left is that while much can be learned by studying them, they are premised upon exploitation of human failure, upon organizing discontent; upon spreading an egalitarian fantasy that simply substitutes wishes for reality. We need to organize our forces, far better, to be sure. But we are the defenders of heritage; defenders of people who have built on what is sound, generation by generation. This certainly rules out an organization directed at fueling the fires of discontent of those driven by envy, jealousy and hate--the staple of the revolutionary. (The American Revolution, by contrast, was a rising of the high achievers--a true counter-revolution against an increase in the power of a remote Government into the daily affairs of those high achievers.)

The coming more intrusive style of the Obama Administration will indeed provide an opportunity to rally our core support--those who want the liberty to achieve, as opposed to those who seek dependence on a collective, as an entitlement. While today, there may be more of the latter; among those intelligent enough to take effective action, the numbers are hardly against us. But what we must learn to do a better job of, is in trying to reach those whom Alinsky (above) distinguishes as "Liberals." I would not so characterize them, rather as "Parlor Pinks:" Lenin's confused, "useful idiots." With slightly better focused tactics, I think there will soon be opportunity to wake some of these latter types up. I think that some of them are going to be frightened by the monster they have funded, once they get over their orgasms over the "Historic Moment."

The key to any strategy, of course, is a good understanding of the context of issues; the dynamics of human interaction; the fuller reality that the Left always misses in their emotional commitment to their wish lists. We need to be able to explain to any intelligent person, who will listen, why the new programs cannot work out, in terms of real factors that most people are aware of, but have never been taught to see the essential connections with what is proposed.

Above all, we need to understand that we do not ever need to concede the high ground to the Left. Their policies are good only for demagogues and bureaucrats. They are destructive to the interests of all groups, once those interests are understood in the larger context of the multi-generational struggle that has characterized the history of every people--in part, because they subsidize all that is harmful, while discouraging all that is productive.

167 posted on 11/06/2008 6:05:10 PM PST by Ohioan
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To: Madeleine Ward

>>Yes, and you go right to the streets of Chicago, and ask the ‘hood’ where’s all that stuff you were promised?<<

Are you serious? Hell, we go into the hood and we’ll get our brains blown out!

“Don’t be talkin’ smack about their messiah...”

168 posted on 11/07/2008 12:51:07 PM PST by Humidston (Why is ALL voter fraud ALWAYS linked to Dems????)
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To: SumProVita
I will NEVER lower my moral Christian moral standards to believe or act on the idea that “the end justifies the means.” Would you?

No... HE never said "the end justifies the means", and neither do I...

the infowarrior

169 posted on 11/07/2008 9:18:33 PM PST by infowarrior (“Let the voters decide if Palin is laughable.”-Tublecane)
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To: Braak


170 posted on 11/09/2008 10:00:56 PM PST by Nowhere Man (Is Barak HUSSEIN Obama an Anti-Christ? - B.O. Stinks! (Robert Riddle))
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To: r9etb; lonestar

We’ve got their playbook and they kick our asses. We’ve nobody to blame except the Republican Party. They’re running from Conservatism. Now they’re attacking Sarah Palin. What’s next? Graham-Lieberman 2012?

171 posted on 11/10/2008 3:15:57 PM PST by gundog (We shall overcome.)
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To: samsmom
Well if we're going to go down THAT path, best familiarize yourselves with the work of Antonio Gramsci.
172 posted on 11/11/2008 4:18:32 PM PST by TradicalRC (Conservatism is primarily a Christian movement.)
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To: samsmom
bump to review ... but lie, manipulation and deception of the masses for power is not the way for Conservatives.... Alinsky IS NOT someone to tactically copy, imitate or emulate.
173 posted on 11/14/2008 10:49:17 AM PST by tophat9000 ( Note: To Obama's Thugocracys... We are all " joe the plumber "...)
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To: samsmom
Bullcrap, Alinsky had no original thoughts. Everything he did he copied from his predecessors. In particular Gramsci, Lenin and Marcuse. Reading Alinsky will tell you nothing of the theoretical foundations of Marxism-Leninism. To understand how Marxists think and view the world requires you to have been one of them. That is the problem with much of the right. They haven't got a clue. Generals who use old tactics end up fighting last year's battles. The genius of men like Rommel, Sherman, Caesar, Alexander and yes even Lenin is that they made the rules up as they went along. If you use the same rules of warfare as your enemy, you lose. Let them play checkers, we will play chess. They bring a cannon to the fight, we bring missiles, they use cavalry, we use machine guns.

Our problem is we fight by antiquated rules, we need to effect our own rules, we have been reacting to them, it's time they start reacting to us. Remember that Lenin called all those who opposed him reactionaries, there was good reason for that. They reacted exactly as he goaded them to do.

174 posted on 11/15/2008 12:33:14 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: Madeleine Ward
That's the way it always is in “worker's paradises.” Its “trickle-up economics,” with the bureaucrats, party hacks, and apparatchiks all shaking down the very peasants, small businesses, and workers they were supposedly installed to help. Like leaches the anointed class gorges themselves while their charges slowly grow weaker.
175 posted on 11/15/2008 1:36:02 PM PST by attiladhun2 (Obama is the anti-Reagan, he believes government is the solution, rather than the problem)
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To: wintertime
There are too many government teachers in the pews and ministers are not going to bite the hand that puts money in the plate.

I've seen this firsthand. We had a family in one church I attended with several school teachers. They objected to the pastor's preaching. He had the gall to preach that men are born with a twisted nature, per the Scriptures. IOW, he was not afraid to "bite the hand" that puts money in the plate. You see, this family bought into the government-school's idea that humans are basically good, and tried to propagate this notion. The pastor stood up against this family, and they finally left the church, and took about half the congregation with them.
176 posted on 11/15/2008 1:52:35 PM PST by attiladhun2 (Obama is the anti-Reagan, he believes government is the solution, rather than the problem)
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To: MeanWestTexan
RULE 12: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions. (This is cruel, but very effective. Direct, personalized criticism and ridicule works.)

This is what was done to Palin, and done very effectively. And notice how outside of right-wing radio, you didn't hear the least bit negative thing about B.O.

If you think about it, the reason why right-wing talk radio has been so effective is that the best in that business are already using these tactics against the left...Rush, Mark Levin and Sean especially.

And let me just add this -- those of you on Free Republic who think for one second that people are going to stream to the conservative cause because of it's "moral superiority" are smoking crack. Conservatism is dying a slow death, for numerous reasons, and just waiting for the ignorant masses to wake up and smell the coffee just ain't gonna happen.

The war of ideas is not won by the idea that is morally superior, it is won by those who have the guts and the tenacity to go out and sell their ideas to the masses, regardless of the cost. Liberalism has done that in spades, and has been doing it for decades with only one minor interuption: Ronald Reagan.

Fighting a purely defensive battle is ALWAYS a losing strategy. If conservatism is going to be a major force in American politics from this day forward, it will have to start going on the offensive, big time. Sadly, I don't see anyone other the Rush, Mark Levin, and a couple of others who are willing to do that. Individuals are not enough, the conservative movement absolutely needs to get organized, and if the involves LEAVING the Republican party to sleep in it's own poop, then so be it.

Now, all we need is our own Saul Alinsky to go out and start organizing. Any volunteers?

177 posted on 11/15/2008 2:04:44 PM PST by Ronzo (Poetry can be a better tool of understanding than tedious scribblings of winners of the Noble Prize)
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To: samsmom; MeanWestTexan; teletech

The Alinsky method is nothing more than the offspring of Machiavelli.

Machiavelli denied the existence of God so that he could establish his own system of morals: the ends justifies the means—and the ends are whatever the ruthless dictator says they are.

No. It’s a horrible philosophy.

For conservatives to adopt this kind of approach would be an even quicker way to destroy conservatism.

178 posted on 11/17/2008 4:24:41 AM PST by reasonisfaith (Palin alone accomplished the ultimate political success--beating the corrupt status quo)
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To: wintertime

Morality, as dictated by God, is first. If conservatism can be advanced by this principle, then I’ll support it.

Alinsky’s Machiavellian method is not the way.

I agree that teaching conservatism as well as Marxism (not through indoctrination but through the rational method), from a young age is critical.

Marxism has advanced because the public school system teaches neither conservatism nor Marxism in a rational manner. Adolescents simply don’t know what either ideology is, and that’s exactly what the Marxists want.

179 posted on 11/17/2008 5:08:25 AM PST by reasonisfaith (Palin alone accomplished the ultimate political success--beating the corrupt status quo)
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To: samsmom

If anyone is unfamiliar with it, research the “Cloward-Piven Strategy”.

180 posted on 11/17/2008 6:53:39 PM PST by Lexinom
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