Posted on 10/17/2011 2:40:44 PM PDT by sklar
Suppose a pensioner makes $15,000 a year.
Under the current IRS system, they get a personal deduction of $6000 (which would go away under 9-9-9). Their taxable income is $9000. At the 10% rate, they pay $900 to IRS.
Under 9-9-9, they would pay 9% personal tax = $1350, an increase of $450, PLUS a brand new 9% Federal Sales Tax on everything new that they purchase including food household goods, etc.
Unless my calculations are flawed, 9-9-9 would be disastrous for Pensioners on a fixed income.
Walmart needs more greeters.
Cut him a break.
Eat Democrats.
ML/NJ
I believe Cain's SIGNATURE IDEA should be THOROUGHLY vetted.
If that means asking some stupid questions, so be it.
We're talking about a man who wants to be POTUS and wants to radically change the Tax Structure. Let's talk about it awhile.
“Adding a sales tax on to what they would have to pay..”
That is where most people go astray.
The sales tax is not added. It replaces a multitude of other taxes in the chain of production.
Do yourself a favor and read this:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2793957/posts
This site is also useful:
People who make, sale stuff, stock stuff, ship stuff have to pay high taxes, you end up paying their taxes plus a sales tax. Their tax goes way down, they will start lowering their prices or someone else will make the same product and lower their prices. Someone help me out, am I wrong?
Yes that is true - I stand corrected, although they are both pensions - one from the government and one from an employer.
By dramatically reducing taxes on production and imposing more of the federal tax burden in the form of a sales tax, the 9-9-9 plan takes away advantage from overseas manufacturers and makes domestic manufacturers more competitive.
The tax burden on domestic manufacturers is reduced and BOTH domestic and foreign manufacturers have their goods subjected to sales tax.
When combined with the lifting of regulatory burdens that the Republican candidates in general all favor, we can see the return of decent manufacturing jobs and return of economic hope for the grandchildren of these pensioners.
Items like televisions and other consumer goods could be feasible to manufacture in the United States again.
The prices of consumer goods would come down under 9-9-9, offsetting higher sales taxes.
Pensioners have a choice: they can derail tax reform and improving US economic competitiveness by objecting to shifting invisible taxes that they already pay embedded in prices to a visible tax, or they can allow their grandchildren to have some prospect of a decent standard of living and US economic competitiveness.
Sir, your question is an honest and earnest and one that deserves attention and respect. Anyone who behaves otherwise is a jerk.
Part of the reason that you’re not getting a straight answer is that nobody really knows. The details of the plan aren’t out. Right now we’re discussing generalizations.
Even if Cain puts out every detail of his plan, in the end he will not be the one writing the bill. That will be congress and Lord knows what they’ll do to it.
With that said, Mr. Cain has reassured us that SS income will not be taxed. My grandparents received a pension from GM, so I’m guessing that you have something similar in addition to SS that you may be concerned about.
Mr. Cain has assured us that he will make sure that seniors and those in poverty will not be harmed by his plan.
I cannot see things like food and medicine being allowed to be taxed by congress. That plan simply won’t pass.
What the others are saying about the 9% sales tax not being a concern is true. The prices of goods will drop once the corporate tax drops and free market competition takes effect.
Congress will not pass a bill that destroys the elderly. Mr. Cain has no desire to hurt the disabled and the elderly.
Your country will take care of you. There are tens of millions of Boomers who’d never allow the new tax system to destroy their retirement. Believe it or not, those of us in the younger generations have no desire to hurt ‘grandma and grandpa’ either.
Price of goods would decrease under 999 since it does away with the various embedded taxes: http://999calculator.net/
Some people are born to be tools.
From the website in its laughable attempt to justify the alleged "built in 22%" tax rate.
"On average, 22% of the price of most consumer products is incorporated into the price to cover the average corporate tax rate of 35%. If that corporate tax rate is reduced to 9%, that 22% is reduced to about 6% (using the ratio 35%:22%, 9%:6%)
Even semi-intelligent people ought to be offended by the insult of that statement.
The current corporate tax is on profits after all expenses, cost of goods and labor, other taxes, loopholes and incentives are deducted which includes all kinds of deductions permitting major corporations like GE to pay nothing in corporate tax. Unless the profit is 90% on the sale of any goods, there is no way that a the corporate income taxes on profits will even comes close to 22% in the price of goods and products.
The whole premise is fraud and whoever promotes it is a tool.
This is a serious question and deserves an answer.
How is that estimated?
Also there are exceptions for poverty level working poor.
No there aren't.
Why is questioning the details of the 9-9-9 plan and the claims made by its supports 'attacking' it? Are we supposed to accept without question or discussion anything that Cain (or Perry or Gingrich or Bachmann depending on the thread) proposes like good little robots?
Yes, it would be.......A typical pensioner no longer saves, their pension goes to pay their debts, bills and everyday purchases. An additional 9% Federal tax would be disastrous to the majority of them.........
Speaking as someone who is retired, retired folks owe taxes too. So do people who make 15K each year. EVERYONE should be paying taxes, and not sponge off of others.
If the 50% who currently pay no taxes, including many who get money ‘back’ without ever paying any, had to PAY taxes, then MAYBE they would want to CUT SPENDING!
There is also an additional tax on savings, already taxed once through the income tax, due to the sales tax. Seniors get screwed as it stands.
Except for the ones who are followers of Bill Ayers- "Kill your parents...that's where it's at!"
I’ve re-read the original post several times, and can’t find a question.
All I see is false information being put out as a fact.
OK now THAT is a good point for the Cain side. Well said!
I just want to have a THOROUGH discussion of 9-9-9 before the Cain Train leaves the station, and a (possibly) flawed discredited Signature Plan is hung around our necks like a millstone.
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