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The Toomey-Manchin Proposal Will Allow Doctors to Block Your Right to Guns
Red State ^ | 4/10/2013 | Erick Erickson

Posted on 04/10/2013 11:40:05 AM PDT by rmlew

I just talked to someone familiar with the Toomey-Manchin proposal who raises a serious concern based on his understanding of the legislation.

Everyone on all sides agrees that we need better help for those with mental health problems who need treatment.

Unfortunately, the person I talked with is concerned that the Toomey-Manchin proposal could discourage people from getting help.

The proposal will allow a doctor to add a patient to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) without ever telling the patient he or she has been added.

There would be no due process requirement. Not all doctors will be able to do it with the same ease, but many will. Knowing a doctor could add him to a federal database as mentally ill without his knowledge could potentially dissuade a patient from going to the doctor in the first place to get help.

Worse, if the doctor does so and makes a mistake, the patient would have to actively work through the system to get himself removed — guilty before being proven innocent. In some states, should a doctor flag you as having mental illness without your knowledge, you may very well see the state come collect your previously purchased guns.

Activist mental health providers will probably be overly aggressive in adding people to the list. Give it five years in liberal areas and people who believe in the physical resurrection of Christ will probably get automatic entry onto the list.

Mental health is a serious issue and the Toomey-Manchin legislation could have negative consequences. Worse, it would still not stop a Columbine, a Newtown, or the daily massacres in Chicago.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania; US: West Virginia
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; gunrights; manchin; secondamendment; toomey
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To: rmlew

I’m beginning to realize that this is what they really want. They don’t need anything else.


21 posted on 04/10/2013 11:53:57 AM PDT by Noamie
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To: rmlew

And let me guess: The doctor or other health care professional who reported you and made a mistake will be protected from litigation.


22 posted on 04/10/2013 11:56:44 AM PDT by Nita Nupress
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To: rmlew
The Toomey-Manchin Proposal Will Allow Doctors to Block Your Right to Guns

Well considering I don't intend to play by their "universal" system (as a seller or buyer) no matter what laws are passed and I long ago "opted out" of the Brady law, by only buying from individuals. I'm not particularly worried about anybody blocking my right to guns. Oh true, they might block my right to go down to the local gun store and buy one off the self, but I haven't played that game since before the brady bill went into effect anyway.

23 posted on 04/10/2013 11:58:05 AM PDT by apillar
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To: rmlew

In reality, I will bet that the Doctor probably wouldn’t know that he’s adding anyone to a “list.”

The Doctor would simply put in a code (required by ObamaCare) that means something simple like, “patient has reported increased stress”.

What the Government will do - without the Docs knowledge - is start searching for those particular codes and then flag people.

HIPPA be damned.

Without a strong 2nd there just are no other Rights.


24 posted on 04/10/2013 11:58:51 AM PDT by Noamie
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To: rmlew

Primary them. Even if they win a primary, they are forced to spend money and are weakened. We need payback.


25 posted on 04/10/2013 11:59:10 AM PDT by AdaGray
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To: Nita Nupress

How many people have had legitimate issues with Experian and other credit agencies? And there you have data that shows where the mistaken reporting came from. And recourse to fix it.

It’s like the no fly database. No way of knowing how you ended up there. No way to fix it if you’re there by mistake.


26 posted on 04/10/2013 12:02:46 PM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: Robert357

I can’t find it at http://thomas.loc.gov

A secret bill?


27 posted on 04/10/2013 12:06:10 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: Noamie; waterhill; ixtl
I’m beginning to realize that this is what they really want. They don’t need anything else.

Oh yeah, and you can bet all of this is already in place in Obamacare.

Further comments self censored...........(((ping))).

28 posted on 04/10/2013 12:06:49 PM PDT by Envisioning (Call me a racist........, one more time..........)
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To: rmlew

This will keep Ashley Judd from having a gun????

Is there anyone who is fifty or older who hasn’t had trouble sleeping or who hasn’t had a period of anxiety or depression?? Better not say anything about it to your doctor.


29 posted on 04/10/2013 12:07:26 PM PDT by JimSEA
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To: rmlew

So they are going to make doctors the “police.”

And HIPA privacy be damned.


30 posted on 04/10/2013 12:08:24 PM PDT by dhs12345
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To: Nita Nupress

“The doctor or other health care professional who reported you and made a mistake will be protected from litigation.”

I wouldn’t be surprised if they were allowed to remain anonymous.


31 posted on 04/10/2013 12:10:22 PM PDT by MNGal
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To: cyn

32 posted on 04/10/2013 12:12:01 PM PDT by ConjunctionJunction
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To: rmlew

Face it. It is over That jackass McCain and his buds sold out.

No use voting anymore. People always said this is where they would draw the line. Yeah right. Just kicking the can down the road. The fight is over.


33 posted on 04/10/2013 12:12:38 PM PDT by dforest (I have now entered the Twilight Zone.)
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To: St_Thomas_Aquinas

If I were a doctor, I would be concerned. If a person is determined, and unstable (why else would they be seeing the doctor) they’d be able to find a gun somewhere and might not be happy with the doctor.

If I were a doctor, I would refuse to comply for my own safety.


34 posted on 04/10/2013 12:16:28 PM PDT by dhs12345
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To: rmlew
Time to get on the phones again?

Yup, once again it's that time of day to beg your own government for freedoms which were not even in question not long ago.

Beg them to stop punishing you, call them, but be polite and ask them real nice to stop dancing with the devil. Remember, be polite, say please, say thank you, and provide them all your information!

35 posted on 04/10/2013 12:16:31 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: rmlew
Toomey, when will you switch parties like your friend Spector did?? It is time for the TEA PARTY to wake up and fight FOR the CONSTITUTION!! We Marxists - AND RINOs - are fighting against it, we need to fight for it!
36 posted on 04/10/2013 12:20:42 PM PDT by ExCTCitizen
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oops we = The...sorry..Mistakes happens (even from us CONSERVATIVES)


37 posted on 04/10/2013 12:21:50 PM PDT by ExCTCitizen
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To: VerySadAmerican
And if you tell them you sold your weapons they’ll ask you why you bought ammo last week.

I quadrupled my money on gunbroker.com

38 posted on 04/10/2013 12:26:26 PM PDT by dartuser (My firearm is not illegal ... its undocumented.)
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To: rmlew; Born Conservative; airborne; smoothsailing; Dr. Scarpetta; martin_fierro; Coop; Tribune7; ...
Gun Groups Not Happy With Toomey, Manchin Compromise

Toomey and Manchin's legislation clarifies that doctors can enter mental health records into the national background check system without it being a violation of privacy laws.

That's nice. No due process!
39 posted on 04/10/2013 12:27:04 PM PDT by neverdem ( Xin loi min oi)
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To: rmlew

A list of conservative, Second-Amendment friendly physicians in every state needs to be compiled, that is, if doing so hasn’t been made illegal.


40 posted on 04/10/2013 12:32:06 PM PDT by Jyotishi (Seeking the truth, a fact at a time.)
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