Seriously, I think 9mm hollowpoints are fine...but not the hardball stuff. For military use, a Glock in 45 acp would be hard to beat.
Posted on 07/03/2014 7:51:01 AM PDT by US Navy Vet
The U.S. Army is moving forward to replace the Cold War-era M9 9mm pistol with a more powerful handgun that also meets the needs of the other services.
As the lead agent for small arms, the Army will hold an industry day July 29 to talk to gun makers about the joint, Modular Handgun System or MHS.
The MHS would replace the Army's inventory of more than 200,000 outdated M9 pistols and several thousand M11 9mm pistols with one that has greater accuracy, lethality, reliability and durability, according to Daryl Easlick, a project officer with the Army's Maneuver Center of Excellence at Fort Benning, Georgia.
"It's a total system replacement -- new gun, new ammo, new holster, everything," Easlick said.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
Yeah....heard it. Nice little YouTube ditty.
Most people don’t shoot semi autos as well as they do revolvers...The more powerful the ammo, the bigger the difference. In my experience with Army shooters the M1911 should have had a bayonet lug.
Didn’t we learn this lesson a little over 100 years ago?
Right on. There is no better pistol for combat, IMHO.
Maybe a beefed-up version and a new hotter .45 ACP round.
Hard to believe anyone could on all-around strengths of the 1911.....
How about the Sig Sauer STX 1911? Or Wilson Combat?
“America’s Military Decline began when the switched from a round designed to kill her enemies, to one designed to piss them off. . . “
- John Ringo, “Under a Graveyard Sky”
I can only comment that 8,000 rounds doesn’t mean a whole lot to me. What I’d be more interested in is how many of those 8,000 rounds were continuous, and what was the firing interval. Plastic (polymer), embedded rails and heat is the concern.
Seriously, I think 9mm hollowpoints are fine...but not the hardball stuff. For military use, a Glock in 45 acp would be hard to beat.
“Yeah....I’ve read about those. One case in particular is the guy pressed the button and his finger stayed depressed as it was drawn out and landed on the trigger.... a leg shot.”
Not disputing that that happened, but I’m having trouble picturing how that would work... The button push is directed across the plane of the trigger instead of along it, and my finger hits the trigger guard and rest there till I’m (roughly) on target and disengaging the safety. If you had a single action and you had the safety off during the draw I guess...
I’m getting started in IDPA so I do a lot of dry fire drawing and nothing close to that has happened to me, but double action pull on a DA/SA Beretta that would take a lot of force.
I suppose you don’t realize I was talking about Glocks and those kinds of holsters. Of course a Beretta safety would make my argument null and void.
I would be very surprised if the Army went with any type of Glock.
For starters, the safety is a huge issue. Imagine a scene where there are hundreds of trainees at a pistol range...some on the firing line, some in bleachers, some doing tasks associated with the range like policing brass and loading magazines.
And you are the drill Sergeant.
There is a great deal of comfort in knowing you can physically see that everybody’s pistol is on safe. With the M9, its the absence of a big red dot, visible 10 feet away. All day, your head is on a swivel, looking for big red dots. That’s life on a firing range, in the Army, if you’re in charge....one improper discharge ends your career, and depending on the damage done, the career destruction could go up the chain of command all the way to Brigade Commander. Head on a swivel...all day...no big red dots.
That comfort level is not there with a Glock. It seems minor, but its a huge deal. Special Operations type units may use it, since they are highly trained....but when your cooks and clerks hit the range to qualify, the idea of a Glock scares the hell out of me. And trainees? I just couldn’t even imagine that.
Another issue is durability. I know there is a lot of back and forth over this...and I’m sure a Glock is fine for a cop or drug agent etc, driving around in a car all day. But when you ‘live’ with a pistol, it gets banged around a lot. Climbing in and out of hatches on vehicles, crawling in dirt/mud, sweating all over it, exposing it to chemicals (our insect repellant made the plastic canteens pliable, and us mechanized guys would have antifreeze, hydraulic fluids, etc on our hands), extreme cold, oh yeah...us mechanized guys sometimes destroyed our clothes with battery acid.....anyway, I hope you get the point. There’s a reason everything in the Army is bulkier and heavier than its civilian counterpart (tents for example). The Army expects stuff to last for decades, even when being treated roughly by people with no personal ownership stake in the equipment (you would be shocked at how roughly weapons are cleaned, for example...clean gets you released for the day, so no brush is too hard).
Anyway, I’m not trying to get into the great Glock debates...but I really don’t think a Glock is suited for the Army.
Placemark
“I suppose you don’t realize I was talking about Glocks and those kinds of holsters. Of course a Beretta safety would make my argument null and void.”
Would have thought that the substantial force needed to activate their DA only trigger would keep that from happening. But, seems like I keep reading about it quite possible to shoot yourself with a Glock one way or another. Still gonna have to put it down as a training issue, though... Col Cooper rule #3: Keep your finger off the trigger till your sights are on the target. This is the Golden Rule. Its violation is directly responsible for about 60 percent of inadvertent discharges.
They could do a lot worse than my Remington 1911 R1, and, they have!
Yeah...I agree....training, training, training. It’s just another training issue to remove your finger from the button as you quickly draw your weapon - and then put it back when you are ready to fire. Nearly all of the holsters I have don’t require this. It’s just not the kind of counter intuitive training I want to try and master.
I suppose you are right about that, but even the TCP leaves a suspicious bulge in my Girly-Jeans! LOL! (A Bulge where there shouldn’t be one! hahaha!)
“Yeah...I agree....training, training, training. It’s just another training issue to remove your finger from the button as you quickly draw your weapon - and then put it back when you are ready to fire. Nearly all of the holsters I have don’t require this. It’s just not the kind of counter intuitive training I want to try and master.”
Yes, what you are use to makes a huge difference especially under stress. That’s why training is important and dry firing, as long as you do it right do it safe, and follow ALL the 4 rules, doesn’t cost you anything. Personally, my finger hits the trigger guard where it’s supposed to without my having to think about it.
THAT SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN REPLACED BY A 9MM TO START WITH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree that the .45 is the answer, but what about weight? We got women now, and the wrists of some of the men aren’t as rigid as they ought to be (limper).
The .45 tends to be a heavy gun. Can you get the weight down and not sacrifice accuracy/stability?
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