FBI agents said to oppose inquiry (shooting of Eagle Scout in Maryland)

Baltimore Sun ^ | March 15, 2002 | Gail Gibson

[Mulder]

Two senior agents from the FBI's Baltimore office told a private detective yesterday that the mistaken shooting of an unarmed Pasadena man likely would be ruled a "clean shoot," and discouraged him from looking into the case further, the investigator said in an interview. Dudley F.B. "Butch" Hodgson, a former FBI agent who has been retained by the shooting victim's lawyers, said he was told by one of the agents: "There's no middle ground in this thing. You're either with us or against us."

[SerpentDove]

>>I wounder if President Bush is "madder than heck" about this, like he was when one of his Royal Guards was kicked a commercial airliner?<<

Exactly! He probably sleeps like a baby.

[stands2reason]

Whaddya think about Giuliani(sp)? Also, has this story gotten any play in the national news?

[GretchenEE]

fyi.

That agent's words that you are either for us or against us are frightening, a form of homeland terrorism, IMO. Bush presumably meant that sentence for non-US citizens, and did not intend that it be turned against normal inquiries into the government that can and does kill its citizens. How does being an innocent civilian investigating the death by law enforcement turn a citizen into an anti-American? It does not. The president's words in the mouths of power-hungry law enforcement officers are cruelly twisted, misapplied truth.

I don't like this.

[zog]

--even if it was the actual bank robber involved it's not a 'clean shoot". Police are not the official judges and executioners in this country. There was no firearm present at the scene, and you do NOT shoot unless you KNOW there's a firearm pointed at you or another innocent. That's the risk you take being a cop, tuff kitty if you can't handle that, you don't kill people on suspicion only. You can bet your bippy if it was one of these fedcops kids got shot 'accidentally" by some other cop they'd be all over him.

The fed needs to resign at a minimum, and go back to being a mercenary, which is all he is now. He's not a cop, he's an assassin, and a poor one to boot. You can get ex-spetnatz shooters for 1/4 of what they give fibber agents and get better quality hired guns if that's all they want. And they can have all the internal reviews they want, a judge ruled last year that fibbers CAN be tried in state court for manslaughter or murder. They could have tried horribleuchi but they didn't, but the potential is on the books now. Let him get at least manslughter and pull the automatic federal minimum time they are pushing with any felony involving a gun, see how that sinks in to fed cop dom. See how they like project exile. And I hope they raid his house and kick the doors in and toss in some flashbangs and search for other weapons and stomp his wife and kids, slap em around and scream curses at them, then accumulate his household crap and call it 'bomb making" material.

Will it happen, heck no, because they are the "elite" and serve "the elite" above them and if you are just a lowly civvie you are a scumbag perp automatically.

[hgro]

"Since the days of clinton, the FBI has been out of control".

This statement is true in spades for ATF too.

[Database]

The only way it can get cleaned up, IMHO, is for a President to be committed to fixing it (Bush is apparently not interested). It would do a lot of good to bring in an "outsider" to run the bureau. A police chief (one who worked his way up, not a political hack) from a small to medium sized department would be a better choice than this Mueller selection.

Taking police department reform efforts as an example, it would still be quite difficult for an outsider to fix things. There's just too much political baggage.

There needs to be additional political pressure from another source. If states, who are responsible for protecting the rights of its citizens, were to respond vigorously to each and every incident of abuse, it might provide the necessary pressure. We as state citizens, should in turn pressure state officials to do this every time, like clockwork.

[Righty1]

Well the big "shake-up" at INS was having four incompetent bureaucratic geeks play musical chairs. What will happen at the FBI? Probably a sensitivity training course i.e. don't shoot the taxpayers morons!

[Doc Savage]

Clean Shoot??? Oh yeah, like TWA 800, a clean fuel tank explosion! Waco, a clean funeral pyre! Ruby Ridge, a clean mother and infant shooting! Vince Foster, a clean cover-up shooting! OKC, a clean ATF bungle!

The FBI! F*cking Bureaucratic Incompetents!! They're dishonest, violent, lying bastards! The New Gestapo!! And they're coming to your house next!!! Be ready! Be prepared!

[sport]

Ref: Your post # 26.

I hope you are right, but history suggests otherwise.
The next fbi agent that is prosecuted for for shooting someone for the thrill of it will be the first one.

[Area51]

I would hope that Bush would be "furious" about this sad affair, however, I doubt it is of any concern to him. I have seen nor heard of anything from Ashcroft either. Now is the time to charge the man with manslaughter, let the chips fall where they may. Of course this will never happen.

Well YOU KNOW how the PRESS hates GW, And he needs to Adress this Before Many more Innocent Americans get capped by the JBT, perhaps WE as in the FReepers need to Start Protesting or Picketing the White House about this.

You know damned well the Press will cover it like Clinton on a Intern if it looks bad for Bush. AND DON'T Let up till that SOB that did the Shooting IS charged and Tried for Attempted Murder!

[Twodees]

I didn't read an article which stated that the feebs neglected to get medical attention for the victim for that long. This is the second time i've seen that referred to in a response, though. If that's true, it makes my blood boil at everyone involved, including the AA county deputies who came to the scene.

That's as bad as anything I've heard about this case so far.

[sport]

Twodees, it was in the first articles when the story first broke. I read it. I believe that it has been erased from subsequent stories.

The girl's father made the allegation, They left the man lying handcuffed for 40 minutes before allowing medical attention.

Other posters reported that the news film had pictures of the agents celebrating and joking with each other.

[Twodees]

This makes me think, though. The "serious juice" behind his investigation could very well just be his own personal integrity and the trademark courage of an innocent man. Someone who was in that job for 20 years and never fell into corruption or dishonesty might just be offended enough at what he would see as crooks in his old bureau to speak angrily to a reporter about it.

The man definitely sounds like an honest man who is deeply offended by the behavior of the agents who spoke to him.

[griffin]

BTTT